Wow Guys, You Need To Read This About Clublexus.com... Wow

[cduluk]

Guys, anyone here a member on clublexus.com as well as here?

Well, i am. Or should i say was?

For those of you who know me, i have done a lot of mods to my Rx300. I'm pretty talented with building stuff i guess you could say. I've done some LED mods in my gauge cluster, headlight projector conversions, wood additions, the works...

Well, a few weeks ago someone posted a question in the lighting section of clublexus.com, where they wanted to know if anyone had converted the gauge color from green to white. I was quick to respond that i have done this mod, and am pretty good at it. I told them if they wanted me to do it, they could PM me and i would gladly help. I received a PM by the member and they asked me how much i would charge. I told them $150 would do it and he said he'd think about it.

Couple days later, i received a message from one of the mods on clublexus.com telling me i was receiving an infraction for 'soliciting' on the forum without being a registered 'vender'. I responded telling this moderator that i was not 'soliciting' and that i never mentioned a money value... He responded quoting what i had sent in the PM to the other member!!! Snoop much!? And by definition of 'solicitation' one must "sell" a product for 'profit'. Just so happens that i never intended to make a profit, nor was i selling a product but doing a favor for someone who couldn't do it themselves. For anyone who knows about these gauge conversions, $150 just about covers the cost of materials and shipping. I even made a point to take it to PM to avoid anyone being offended. It's BESIDES the point that i was doing a favor for a fellow club member.

A day later, i received another message from this same moderator telling me he was taking my PM function away for a YEAR! He also gave me another 'infraction point' for refusing to stop 'soliciting'.

So, i let it go because i figured there was nothing i could do.

Few days ago, i posted a couple threads in the RX section of clulexus.com where i posted pictures of a wood conversion on a couple interior parts for the Rx300. In this thread, i clearly wrote in the beginning that the reason i would not be replying to anyones PM's is because a moderator took the function away for soliciting. I didn't want to come off as ignorant to the other members when and if they'd PM me and i'd never respond... so i put it out there as to why my PM function had been taken away. Never did i mention the moderator's name. Afraid he's gonna come after me with a gun or something.

Tonight i received two more messages from this same moderator, one telling me i was receiving another 'infraction point' for "complaining about a moderator". The other email telling me i have been BANNED from clublexus.com for 30 days because of my infraction points.

Not only that, this moderator deleted my threads on the RX forum where i had spent HOURS posting pictures and writing out detailed, and i mean DETAILED descriptions of how to do the wood mod to anyone else who might like to do it. And i mean, i spent HOURS, and now it's all gone.

This personal vendetta this moderator has with me is now costing me the right to surf the site or communicate in any way.

I have been SO hurt by everything that's happened on that site, i can't even explain how it feels. And it's my birthday today- this has seriously been the most pain i have felt coming from the 'cyber' world. I have belonged to many forums and have never been singled out and treated this way for helping out another member. I mean, am i supposed to do it for free?? Maybe i shouldn't have helped at all?? This is incredibly unfair, but you wanna know the sad thing? There's nothing i can do about it.

I just wanted to vent and let everyone on this forum know what's going on over there in CL land. I have to say the moderators on this site are pretty awesome; cheers to you guys for having a heart.

...did i mention today's my freakin' birthday?? UGH

[flop170]

happy birthday and sorry that happened to ya!!

[cduluk]

Thanks, and yeah i'm sorry this is happening too.

I brought it up with my parent's who are both attorneys, and they told me there's nothing i can do unless he communicates or threatens with me outside of the clublexus.com site.

Oh well i guess, this forum is more friendly anyways, maybe i belong here.

[SKperformance]

Happy Birthday ,

Here is my thoughts on this , it is a very 2 sided coin .

On the LOC we are a smaller community than CL so it does not have as much traffic.

Thus most people head to CL first and are always trying to sell their wares.

It is unfortunate but it has to be a blanket policy to advise on no solicitation as everyone it trying to get it for free.

I had some parts a few years ago to sell and it indeed looked like i was trying to sell it as a buisness , it just happened i only had 3 sets and had to buy in bulk for me to get them. I can't even remember what it was but i was advised of the same policy and it made sense.

Remeber it is not a personal thing against you as you are great at these projects such as the retros .

It is also easier to swallow if you just post a DIY write up and anyone who wants you to do it just asks and you are usually good then.

I don't think you are trying to make a buisness out of it ,and if you were it probably couldn't make enough to buy 1 more set of projectors :) .

So again you can't blame them or even us for stoping anything that sounds like soliciting as it has been spoiled by years of free loaders looking for ways to say "well he can do it for free or that way".

[lenore]

that sucks, I have thoroughly enjoyed your posts, sometimes they pick the flysh&T out of the pepper barrel. Keep on posting here. By the way your wood work is exceptional and happy birthday. Thomas1 on CL and me here.

[Lucky13]

[SW03ES]

Hey man,

Sounds like a bummer, especially on your birthday...

I've had my issues with CL in the past, however the current management there is a lot more fair handed than in my day. They have rules and regulations just like us, we don't allow solicitation of our members for gain either. Its a little harder over there because they are owned by a company that runs the forums for a profit, whereas we're independently owned by an enthusiast. What I'm getting at is it may not be entirely within the management's control.

We also moderate members for openly discussing the moderators and their decisions and for going around the moderators and doing things like creating additional accounts. In fact creating additional accounts here will get you banned for good.

I have a sneaking suspicion that if you contacted Dave (DaveGS4) and discussed the situation it would work out.

[cduluk]

Just to happens that Dave "DAVEGS4" is the moderator that is putting me through this!

I understand that what i did might classify as 'solicitation' to some, but that was never my intention and i made a point of keeping it between the member and myself through PM not to "advertise" on the site. It's the fact that i was doing this guy a favor and this moderator couldn't let it go under good faith that bothers me so much.

I could see if i was marketing and putting myself out there as "open for business"... I was merely helping out ONE single member who wanted me to put LED's in his cluster. I do not own a business, i merely have a talent that i was going to use to make another member have a nice gauge cluster. If there's no profit it can't classify as 'solicitation'. The definition clear states so.

I just think there's a right and wrong way to do things. When one has power, it doesn't always mean they have to use it with such force. Each situation requires different punishment and i feel there was excessive use of power in my situation.

There's keeping things in order, and then there's nitpicking. I mean if every cop out there gave everyone a ticket for doing 1 over the speed limit, can you imagine what would happen??

It's just the fact that this stemmed from one single gauge cluster modification for a fellow forum member. It just bewilders me lol...

I believe this is where the saying, "No good deed goes unpunished" becomes true once again...

[SW03ES]

Dave's not a moderator, he's the forums manager.

Things get out of control quickly, the same thing happens here. People's backs get up, all of a sudden the original issue gets lost and sometimes its hard to keep sight of what the real issue is.

I wouldn't loose too much sleep over it. We're still here ;)

[blake918]

I just looked up your threads on CL where you added the wood to the lid and refinished your steering wheel....quite impressive!

[SW03ES]

Yeah post 'em here!

[revpd]

Yeah I just had a run in with that Dave guy too. Real control freak if you ask me. He was insisting that I was trying to orchestrate a "group buy" because I said I was gonna order a whole bunch of DVD motors to fix the RX Nav unit since no vendor would sell just one. I explained that it wasn't a group buy because I was just gonna buy them myself - eating the cost - and if other members said they needed them I'd share, no profit intended. He's all worried about his "approved vendors" and his policies... He deleted my post. And what's that nonsense with "infractions"? Is he kidding? What kind of power trip is that? He needs to get a grip so badly that I'd offer to send him one myself... but he'd probably send an infraction because I didn't get his grip from an approved vendor. :P

You'd think that someone spending that much time as a mod would develop a sense as to when rules are actually being broken, versus blindly wielding absolute power.

Anyway, in a small victory, I later found that the part we were all looking for was also available for FREE in junked CDROM drives that most people have laying around their houses. So I RE-posted about how nobody had to buy anything from any vendor. Then I went out and enjoyed my social life.

At least the whole experience got me to re-register here. Glad to be back.

[SKperformance]

One thing to remember the vendors over there pay big bucks and will start complaining if anyone gets to sell anything.

I would have probably asked a vendor to sell the rest for you so they can make a couple of dollars and everyone is happy.

It is a pain trying to establish what reality is over perception. I have seen for years on the internet people saying it was only for them and a few people then turned out it was sold more and more to the point where it was more sales than some vendors.

Even so i have a member calling the rules garbage on here because they are not allow to post "for sale" threads because they have never contributed here.

I just don't get it sometimes, where logic and rational overcomes the "I am important factor" so let me do what i want .

Funny enough i also remember having a thread a few years ago trying to clean out my garage and one post on the prelude forum got locked and the mod was warning me telling me to be a vendor . i was like it is all used stuff in my garage i am clearing out. She said it was too many things for one person to have and i was a business. I laughed and had another member vouch for me that it was mine and she apolgized.

Oh well , i live to pay tax another day.

[nc211]

One thing to remember the vendors over there pay big bucks and will start complaining if anyone gets to sell anything.

There is the core reason for CL's actions against you, cduluk. They're protecting their cashflow stream from the vendors, and therefore are being somewhat controlled by the vendors. However, try as they may, no vendor can compete with the desire for knowledge, as was found out with the cdrom part discovery. This is also why you don't see NC211 being active over there. I can't recall the last time I posted on that site "or visited for that matter". I discovered LOC, and haven't looked back.

Even so i have a member calling the rules garbage on here because they are not allow to post "for sale" threads because they have never contributed here.

I just don't get it sometimes, where logic and rational overcomes the "I am important factor" so let me do what i want .

SK, why you buggin' on me man? All I'm offering is my gutter cleaning services to home owners while wearing my camouflage speedo. Dang', holmes, can't I make a dollar up in here?

Good thing nobody knew about those old suspension parts from my 95' LS I was sending down to Blake a few years ago. I had no idea I could have been "vendoralized"!!

DC, you better call for backup amigo, I think the CL team is coming for you!

[SW03ES]

Remember what I said

CL=corporate owned, run for a profit.

LOC=enthusiast owned, run so that the owners won't be poor because it exists.

It changes things...

It really doesn't have anything to do with Dave. If I had a dollar for everytime someone on here has said about me exactly what you guys have said about him I'd have....several dollars. People don't like to be moderated. I feel for them with the company that owns the site dictating the way they have to enforce the site's rules.

[cduluk]

Well i have an update :) I have been permanently banned from clublexus.com forever lol.

Oh well. Nothing i can do. Whenever i try to re-register on there they just block me. I'll make another fake sn and try to copy my old posts and post them on here in case anyone wants to ask me questions about them lol...

LOC rocks :)

-Chris

[cduluk]

Another update- i made another username on clublexus so i could "quote" my posts that had pictures so i could copy the URL's onto this site, but now i can't even view clublexus.com because "the administrator has banned my IP address".

Damn lol. At least we have 4 computers in our house.

I am copy and pasting all my DIY posts from clublexus to the Rx300 forum of this site for anyone who wants to see them and ask me questions about them :)

Here are the links to the threads i posted on this forum:

My own wood re-dye pics:

http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index...showtopic=57089

My own LED mods pics:

http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index...showtopic=57088

Sample wood steering wheel refinish pics:

http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index...showtopic=57087

Sample flip-up cup holder wood addition pics:

http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index...showtopic=57086

[SW03ES]

Well, we ban people for good here too if they create multiple screen names to try and circumvent a ban...

Just leave it alone.

Your stuff looks great!

[SW03ES]

Now that you've posted your threads here I want to give you some feedback as to why you ran into trouble on CL I think and why I also have edited your posts here...

When I read through your writeup, mentioning how people on CL wanted you to do it for them, referencing your customers' parts and how your customers can wire them up...it certainly does read to me like an advertisement. While you don't come straight out and solicit buisness it does appear from your posts that you are engaging in a business relationship with forum members as a result of your posts to the forum...and not paying for the right to do that. We simply cannot allow that, it isn't fair to the people that do pay us for the right to do business on the site.

If thats not the case I apologize, but it certainly seems that way. It certainly doesn't just look like you're just showing off work you did to your own car, lets put it that way.

I have edited your threads but left them in place, hopefully you understand.

[jerzynuts]

Ive been a member of a couple different forums too this one being my latest that i joined just today but i realized club lexus is wayyyyy to strict about some of the rules they have the moderators there are harsh. Just reading their forum rules made me decide to look for a better forum out there for lexus's and here i am. Did you know to sell something you have to have 300 posts and someone to vouch for you cmon now thats just ridiculous. At least your being the bigger person and walking away someone with your knowledge i see it as their loss.

[cduluk]

I think everyone on that site needs to take a chill pill. We're in a horrible economy, life is strict as it is- it would be nice to browse a FRIENDLY forum and feel comfortable and relaxed without having to watch out for all the ridiculous rules.

Oh well, they can eat dirt. :)

This forum is much better. Not as much activity, but it's better than TOO much activity and getting banned for stupid crap...

[Mr. Freegard]

I was banned Christmas eve not even 24 hours after joining. I did absolutely nothing except express gratitude about the parts that I could replace to bring light back to my instrument cluster et al. Next morning I go to the site and I have been banned. No warning, no reason. Just banned. At least you guys have a clue.

[TX1911fan]

I can't even get on to Club Lexus from my work computer. It's blocked for some reason.

[Studancer]

I'm new and don't know the lay of the land, but that seems to defeat the whole purpose of a private information sharing forum. Are these sites focused on business interests over member interests? I'm just asking.

[smooth1]

This is an open and free forum to share experiences, knowledge, and our passion for cars while making friends and meeting new people from all over the world. Unfortunately there are those out there that have other intentions. Identifying and removing those are the job of the moderators. How each site manages their moderators can vary greatly, but here, we all work together and act together. Although it may be one moderator or another actually handling the communications, most times it's done after we have consulted with each other and have agreed on a course of action.

I was a member here for a few years before I became a moderator.