Rock Chips And Scratches

[lambobaby1218]

I just had the 3M clear bra installed on my hood, fenders, mirrors and headlights. It looks great on my smoky granite (dark gray) IS250. The dealer was asking $1000, so I called around to get some price quotes. I got it all done for about $300 with the name brand 3M kit by a guy named Dean who has his own business and does these full time. He's north of Seattle, but came all the way out to Issaquah for a reasonable travel charge to do mine.

I'd definitely recommend this route instaid of paying the dealer three times as much.

Here is the contact info for the guy who did mine:

Clear Statement

Everett, WA 98203

425-231-3749

I wish he'd drive down to Southern California!!

My husband was kind enough to point out to me today my first rock chip. Only 1,800 miles on the car!!!! Oh, and as luck would have it, I ran a cart into the rear end of my other car, and it now has a nice little ding. Yikes! It's hard keeping cars looking nice.......

[Sidney07]

I just had the 3M clear bra installed on my hood, fenders, mirrors and headlights. It looks great on my smoky granite (dark gray) IS250. The dealer was asking $1000, so I called around to get some price quotes. I got it all done for about $300 with the name brand 3M kit by a guy named Dean who has his own business and does these full time. He's north of Seattle, but came all the way out to Issaquah for a reasonable travel charge to do mine.

I'd definitely recommend this route instaid of paying the dealer three times as much.

Here is the contact info for the guy who did mine:

Clear Statement

Everett, WA 98203

425-231-3749

I wish he'd drive down to Southern California!!

My husband was kind enough to point out to me today my first rock chip. Only 1,800 miles on the car!!!! Oh, and as luck would have it, I ran a cart into the rear end of my other car, and it now has a nice little ding. Yikes! It's hard keeping cars looking nice.......

As luck would have it...I LIVE NEAR EVERETT!!! Small world huh?

As for running carts into our own cars....that's another matter ;) (sorry Trina)

Rock chips are inevitable, unless you don't drive you car on the road with other cars.

[john j]

I have a ton of scratches on the hood. I think the design of the car with the rounded high hood somehow attract rocks or I'm just the unluckiest guy around myself. They bounce of the hood (scratch it first) and then hit the windshield (which has a ton of scratches as well). I don't think the paint job is the best either but that's just my opinon. I also have a clear bra (from day one) and it doesn't seem to help that much because the scratches are all above the clear bra. I also have a ton of tiny scratches on the windshield. I'm wondering about the quality of the glass also.

[Manolo1]

It definitely has to do with the lower hood. I had two Boxsters before my Lexus and the windshield was horribly pitted with all the tiny rocks, etc. And I don't believe neither Lexus nor Porsche use low quality glass!!!

[dbguru]

I'm not a fan of clear bras. I had a 3M clear bra put on my 2005 RX 330 when it was new. The installation was great and the bra looked awesome for about two years. After you washed it, the bra would shine along with the rest of the car. I was very careful with the bra as to not get any wax on it or scratch it. I had the car for 3 and a half years and 60,000 miles before I got rid of it. By that time, the clear bra had developed a milky look to it. When I would wash it, it almost looked as if I forgot to wash the clear bra and the rest of the car shined like a new penny. It wasn't that bad and looked OK I guess, but I was starting to consider peeling the bra off. Now that I have a new 2008 IS 250, I think I'll skip the bra. I think I'll just try my luck with the paint chips. My suggestion is to pick the lesser of two evils - paint chips or a milky clear bra in 3-5 years.

[clay1]

I'm not a fan of clear bras. I had a 3M clear bra put on my 2005 RX 330 when it was new. The installation was great and the bra looked awesome for about two years. After you washed it, the bra would shine along with the rest of the car. I was very careful with the bra as to not get any wax on it or scratch it. I had the car for 3 and a half years and 60,000 miles before I got rid of it. By that time, the clear bra had developed a milky look to it. When I would wash it, it almost looked as if I forgot to wash the clear bra and the rest of the car shined like a new penny. It wasn't that bad and looked OK I guess, but I was starting to consider peeling the bra off. Now that I have a new 2008 IS 250, I think I'll skip the bra. I think I'll just try my luck with the paint chips. My suggestion is to pick the lesser of two evils - paint chips or a milky clear bra in 3-5 years.

Totally understand your opinion, but I wouldn't eliminate a clear bra. Firstly you can always peel off the bra and have it replaced in three years - but the chipping is relentless. I have a few chips on the hood above the bra...I have to say that the paint job is very unusual in that when you get a chip you actually see bear metal. On my wife's Honda at least you see the primer coat when you get a chip. Bottom line is how much do you drive. I drive 2,500 - 3000 miles a month. The license plate surround from the dealer actually got so chewed up with rock chips I had to replace it - I imagined what my front end would look like....

[SW03ES]

You do actually have to maintain the bra, it can and should be waxed for instance.

[konac0ffee]

I just had the 3M clear bra installed on my hood, fenders, mirrors and headlights. It looks great on my smoky granite (dark gray) IS250. The dealer was asking $1000, so I called around to get some price quotes. I got it all done for about $300 with the name brand 3M kit by a guy named Dean who has his own business and does these full time. He's north of Seattle, but came all the way out to Issaquah for a reasonable travel charge to do mine.

I'd definitely recommend this route instaid of paying the dealer three times as much.

Here is the contact info for the guy who did mine:

Clear Statement

Everett, WA 98203

425-231-3749

I wish he'd drive down to Southern California!!

My husband was kind enough to point out to me today my first rock chip. Only 1,800 miles on the car!!!! Oh, and as luck would have it, I ran a cart into the rear end of my other car, and it now has a nice little ding. Yikes! It's hard keeping cars looking nice.......

Greetings,

Why do we never run the shopping carts into our old cars?

Kona

[lambobaby1218]

Those shopping carts just go out of control sometimes, ya know??? lol!

[amy092380]

I am a Lexus customer of over 2 years. My car has 24,000 miles on it, and I have to say I am extremely disappointed that I have scratches that show through to the white, on various spots on the car liek the hood, roof, and trunk. My car is black, and I barely drive it. I shouldn't be seeing every single scratch and ding. Furthermore, I have been rading on these forums, that opther people besides myself are experiencing paint chipping, scratches, on the car, rins, etc. Should this be acceptable to this level on a Luxury class car? My fiance drives a hyundai and this doesn't happen on his. If you compare his driving to mine, he drives on the highway more than I do, so he has even more exposure to road wear. His car doesn't look like mine, and his is black also, nor did this happen on his black pontiac. The standard as from the body shops I have taken my car to, is that paint be applied first, and that a clear coat be applied as a seperate application. I am not sure that my car has clear coat, if it did, I would have scratches, chips, and spots of something that is eating all the way through on certain areas of my car. It wouldn't strip all the paint off and show white underneath. I've never seen this happen on any other car I've owned. I had more luck with used cars I've owned.

I am also experiencing a lot of bubbling, and chipping on the interier chrome around my shifter. Also the chrome around the hood on the exterior of my car is chipping and bubbling. The weather stripping on both sides of the car, is wearing away, and cracking. I have had the molding on my door replaced already once. The chrome around the shifter had been replaced, but I have to back to get it replaced around the knob now, and have the front looked at.

This is unacceptable for a luxury class car. If anyone else is experiencing problems like this on your vehicle please post a reply.

[SW03ES]

Your black Lexus does not have a clear coat. Lexus black is single stage.

The bad news? It wears easier because the paint is soft. The good news? Its very easy to polish out.

Check out the detailing forum or find a good well respected professional detailer in your area. I bet the car will come out of a detail and look incredible.

Paint requires maintenance, especially that paint but if you keep up on it its a great looking finish. I've detailed dozens of single stage black Lexus cars and they always come out looking great.

As for the silver bubbling around the shifter...I'd have the dealer replace that under warranty...

[ajis250]

I agree in one sense, reading this forum really makes me wonder of the quality overall, my wifes Volvo is just as "old" (about 5 months) and mine , Tungsten Pearl, but I would just call it light grey since there is no "pearl" at all to it is showing far more little nicks.

No question in my mind, the Lexus paint is really thin and weak but in all fairness, I have not checked out a Pontiac or Hyundai Owners Club if there is one of course.

[retired00]

Your black Lexus does not have a clear coat. Lexus black is single stage.

The bad news? It wears easier because the paint is soft. The good news? Its very easy to polish out.

Check out the detailing forum or find a good well respected professional detailer in your area. I bet the car will come out of a detail and look incredible.

Paint requires maintenance, especially that paint but if you keep up on it its a great looking finish. I've detailed dozens of single stage black Lexus cars and they always come out looking great.

As for the silver bubbling around the shifter...I'd have the dealer replace that under warranty...

<_< You will often see internet postings indicating that black cars or white cars are not clear coated. I believe all manufacturers now use it on all colors, including Lexus. My black 08 IS passes this test, I suggest you try it as well (from Meguiars detailing FAQ):

To determine whether you have a clear coat or a single-stage finish perform this simple test.

Find an inconspicuous area to test, such as the lower rear quarter panel of your car's fender or inside the door jamb.

Clean this area first with car wash and water or Meguiar's Quik Detailer® or Ultimate Quik Detailer®. You don't want any dirt or grime to interfere with your test.

Using a small piece of white cotton, such as a piece of terry cloth towel, rub a little paint cleaner or Cleaner/Wax into the paint of this inconspicuous area.

After rubbing for a few moments, turn your cloth toward you and look to see if there is any color from your paint on the cloth. If you have a red car and you now have red paint residue on your cloth, this is a pretty good indicator that you have a single stage finish. If you have a red car and you don't see any red paint residue on your cloth, this is a pretty good indicator that you have a clear coat.

To be 100% sure, you should test in a couple of different areas.

Note: If you have a white, or very light colored car you should use a dark piece of cotton cloth and look for the color of your car's finish on it after rubbing some paint cleaner or Cleaner/Wax into the finish for a few moments.

[SW03ES]

You will often see internet postings indicating that black cars or white cars are not clear coated. I believe all manufacturers now use it on all colors, including Lexus. My black 08 IS passes this test, I suggest you try it as well (from Meguiars detailing FAQ):

I have detailed dozens of Black Lexus vehicles. Lexus black does not have a clearcoat, its obvious when machine polishing these vehicles because the black paint transfers to the pad on your polisher. Toyota white is also not clearcoated but Lexus white is.

What did you use to try and get the paint to transfer? You need something abrasive enough.

If I machine polished your black IS...the paint would transfer.

Go to www.autopia.org and search for "black Lexus" and read the posts, thousands of professional detailers there and plenty of discussions about the single stage Lexus black.

[retired00]

You will often see internet postings indicating that black cars or white cars are not clear coated. I believe all manufacturers now use it on all colors, including Lexus. My black 08 IS passes this test, I suggest you try it as well (from Meguiars detailing FAQ):

I have detailed dozens of Black Lexus vehicles. Lexus black does not have a clearcoat, its obvious when machine polishing these vehicles because the black paint transfers to the pad on your polisher. Toyota white is also not clearcoated but Lexus white is.

What did you use to try and get the paint to transfer? You need something abrasive enough.

If I machine polished your black IS...the paint would transfer.

Go to www.autopia.org and search for "black Lexus" and read the posts, thousands of professional detailers there and plenty of discussions about the single stage Lexus black.

I used Meguiars Paint Cleaner and a cloth, no transfer. I also found this quote from you in the Detail Forum: June 06

New Lexus have clearcoated black, the started clearcoating them about 2001. Its not really a big deal, in fact the single stage Lexus black is some of the easiest paint to polish out.

--------------------

-Steve- E-Mail Me!

Forums Manager

Support the Club - Become a Gold Member Today!

[SW03ES]

I don't know if that was just people confused or if Lexus really did clearcoat some black for a while. I had heard reports from some detailers that did some black Lexus vehicles in that period that were clearcoated, but I have seen firsthand current model Lexus black cars that are definately, unquestionably unclearcoated single stage. So...I dunno.

*I* have never detailed a black Lexus that had a clearcoat.

The Meg's paint cleaner is very mild...you need something more abrasive. I'm 99% certain your IS is single stage.

[retired00]

I don't know if that was just people confused or if Lexus really did clearcoat some black for a while. I had heard reports from some detailers that did some black Lexus vehicles in that period that were clearcoated, but I have seen firsthand current model Lexus black cars that are definately, unquestionably unclearcoated single stage. So...I dunno.

*I* have never detailed a black Lexus that had a clearcoat.

The Meg's paint cleaner is very mild...you need something more abrasive. I'm 99% certain your IS is single stage.

I sent an email to Lexus on their owner support site, they said I should have an answer in a couple days. I asked specifically about my Obsidian (paint 212) for '08, and will relay the answer.

[SW03ES]

People have done that and they've been given differing answers.

What I'm telling you is a fact...every black Lexus I have ever detailed, running a whole gambit of years have been single stage. Its easy to tell because when you pull the buffer pad off the paint...the pad is black from transferred paint.

Do you think I'm lying?

[smooth1]

The Obsidian Black used by Lexus is indeed a single stage paint. Very few car mfgrs use this, most use a base coat clear coat. But for the record, it's all the same chemically, both types are urethane enamels. The only difference is the clearcoat is UNPIGMENTED urethane enamel. I actually prefer the look if single stage paints in solid colors and find them much easier to keep looking good. And the depth of the finish can be much greater than any BC-CC. Modern SS paints are every bit as good as the BC-CC counterpart. The only time I have ever known BC-CC to have any real advantage was with paints containing metal flake additives. In which case the CC can be applied to cover, protect and and smooth out the metal flake. Most car mfgr's went to metallic paints as they became polular, and turned to the BC-CC process. But most Concours winning show cars are all single stage paint finishes.

There are advantages to having a single stage paint, which was why I specifically made the decision to purchase the Obsidian Black color. All paint jobs will have some chipping and scratches over the life of the vehicle. But the passion of auto lovers have developed great processes to repair single stage black, red, and white cars. Metallic BC-CC paint jobs may hide scratches and dirt well, but repair work on them is almost impossible, and even repainted panels are easy to spot.

[BaddBoi70]

I have a clear bra installed on both of my Lexus vehicles and I would HIGHLY recommend them. If you are a golfer or if you have young kids, I would also suggest getting the rear bumper covered to prevent scratches!

As SW has stated, the clear bra does require regular maintenance. If it becomes "milky" you can typically have it professionally buffed or attempt it on your own to bring back the shine :D I had mine professionally buffed and it looks brand new again.

[SW03ES]

And like I said, as someone who has detailed a lot of cars, the single stage black Lexus paint comes out so well after a detail...

[Gregg06]

I have a blue onyx pearl IS. Every time I wash the car I wince to a new rock scratch/chip. I have owned other cars in the past and swear that this car is the worst, somehow it attracts scratches and chips. I drive 95% highway and have not noticed any serious road debris from the norm. I do not tailgate. Well now that I have whined, have any of you out there installed the clear bra and what are your impressions of the appearance. After I work on the hood (wet sand) I was thinking of having one installed?? Any thoughts on installation after deep chips/scratches cannot be removed???

This a common problem with ALL of todays cars...

You see the same complaint on all of the forums.

Chipguard is the only way to minimize the damage

What is Chipguard? I am very anal when it comes to my IS. I clay bar my car 2 or 3 times a year and lots of Klasse and Meguiars NXT. This sounds like something I would love to get on my car asap.

[SW03ES]

Do you use the NXT and the Klasse at the same time?

Just food for thought, the Klasse won't bond over the NXT, and the NXT has a lot of cleaners so using it over the Klasse would remove it. Those two products don't work well together.

If you want to top Klasse you should do so with a pure paste carnuaba that won't remove the Klasse layer beneath.

[Gregg06]

Do you use the NXT and the Klasse at the same time?

Just food for thought, the Klasse won't bond over the NXT, and the NXT has a lot of cleaners so using it over the Klasse would remove it. Those two products don't work well together.

If you want to top Klasse you should do so with a pure paste carnuaba that won't remove the Klasse layer beneath.

I put the NXT over the Klasse. Meguairs NXT Tech 2.0 is a wax. A detailer told me that they work well together. My car always looks soaking wet and smooth for months, everything just wipes off with ease. I've been doing this for 2 years. Always looking to try something different. Anything you recommend?

Edited October 28, 2008 by SW03ES
Fixed quote tags

[SW03ES]

I'm a detailer too ;)

The NXT tech wax is actually synthetic, it is not a carnuaba wax. Its kind of like a "synthetic wax"...

The issue is that NXT Tech wax has a LOT of cleaners and solvents. It actually is mildly abrasive, you could apply it with a machine and a polishing pad and it would remove light swirls.

It does not work well with Klasse because the cleaners and solvents in the NXT remove the Klasse layer underneath.

It won't do any harm and your car will obviously still look fresh and be protected, its just the Klasse step is wasted, you'd have the same results if you just applied the NXT without the Klasse since NXT cannot be layered over sealants.

My suggestion? If you want the additional protection of the Klasse but a top layer of carnuaba, try using a pure paste wax over the Klasse. What color is your car?

Some good pure carnuaba paste waxes:

Pinnacle Souveran

P21S

Meguiars #16

There are plenty.

Any liquid wax is not layerable because the solvents they use to make it liquid will remove any sealant layer beneath it when its applied.