lexus400 Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 I have a persistent problem with rotors warping. I have tried turning them and buying new ones. I go a couple of thousand miles and then very steadily they get worse and worse. Been through this about 4 times over the past 2 years. Calipers seem fine, no excessive drag. I replaced rear carrier arm bushings, front strut rod bushings, new rack, tie rod ends, struts, etc. I needed to do all of this anyway but I mention it because I know other components (carrier arm bushings) can cause a vibration in the front end and the shifter. Is there anything else I should look at ? The funny thing is the last time this happened, I checked the runout with a dial indicator and they seemed ok. I put new ones on anyway and the vibration was fixed ? I always use a torque wrench on the wheels. Fluid has been flushed a couple of times. Anything else that might be making it appear as though the rotors are bad ? I'm sure all rotors warp a little bit and maybe there's something else that shows up unless the rotors are dead on (new). thanks... Bob
andy haw Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 I have a persistent problem with rotors warping. I have tried turning them and buying new ones. I go a couple of thousand miles and then very steadily they get worse and worse. Been through this about 4 times over the past 2 years. Calipers seem fine, no excessive drag. I replaced rear carrier arm bushings, front strut rod bushings, new rack, tie rod ends, struts, etc. I needed to do all of this anyway but I mention it because I know other components (carrier arm bushings) can cause a vibration in the front end and the shifter. Is there anything else I should look at ? The funny thing is the last time this happened, I checked the runout with a dial indicator and they seemed ok. I put new ones on anyway and the vibration was fixed ? I always use a torque wrench on the wheels. Fluid has been flushed a couple of times. Anything else that might be making it appear as though the rotors are bad ? I'm sure all rotors warp a little bit and maybe there's something else that shows up unless the rotors are dead on (new). thanks... Bob What rotors and pads are you using.
lexus400 Posted February 21, 2006 Author Posted February 21, 2006 I'm using Raybestos rotors (2x) and I've turned the OEM once or twice. Pads are Raybestos ceramics. I've used both these pads and rotors in different cars and they have been great ??
Arkansawyer Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 I'm using Raybestos rotors (2x) and I've turned the OEM once or twice. Pads are Raybestos ceramics. I've used both these pads and rotors in different cars and they have been great ?? There are grades of Raybestos rotors if I am not mistaken. THe ones you want to get are made in North American (U.S. or Canada). I've had the parts counter guys try to push off the Chinese made Raybestos ones on me before. Finally ended up getting them from Rockauto.com IMO I think the ceramics are the best becuse of the heat dissipation.
dcfish Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 I'm using Raybestos rotors (2x) and I've turned the OEM once or twice. Pads are Raybestos ceramics. I've used both these pads and rotors in different cars and they have been great ?? There are grades of Raybestos rotors if I am not mistaken. THe ones you want to get are made in North American (U.S. or Canada). I've had the parts counter guys try to push off the Chinese made Raybestos ones on me before. Finally ended up getting them from Rockauto.com IMO I think the ceramics are the best becuse of the heat dissipation. Buy OEM pads and rotors. ;)
anthonyiez Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 2 things, while i really like the use of oem pads and rotors, there is a brand you can use with no problems. brembo makes a great rotor and you can buy pads made by a company called akebono. they make the pads for lexus/toyota so they are quality stuff. second thing...what are you using for a lubricant on the caliper slide pins? the only thing that will work is a high temp silicone. do not, and i repeat do not, ever use a metallic based antisieze on the caliper slide pins. metallic as should never touch metal to rubber, if it does it will turn into a hard paste. this will keep the calipers from "floating" and then the rotors will surely warp. other than that make sure the rears are working as well. if not the fronts will warp quickly. as for turning a rotor, its a waste of time. all you do is make the rotor thinner and now it can't dissapate the heat as well. if a rotor is bad enough to be turned replace it. in fact i sold my brake lathe many years ago, just a waste of time if you want to produce quality repairs.
jc19907 Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 Just bought some OEM pads. They squeel. I didn't get a shim kit; apparently, I should've... It's really obnoxious... I've got to take it back in. Make sure you ask for the shim kit, if and when you get OEM pads...
nc211 Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 ....and the fitment kit...shims and fitment kits are two seperate pieces...I have no idea why other than profit makers, and frustrating as hell too!!
dcfish Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 I'm using Raybestos rotors (2x) and I've turned the OEM once or twice. Pads are Raybestos ceramics. I've used both these pads and rotors in different cars and they have been great ?? There are grades of Raybestos rotors if I am not mistaken. THe ones you want to get are made in North American (U.S. or Canada). I've had the parts counter guys try to push off the Chinese made Raybestos ones on me before. Finally ended up getting them from Rockauto.com IMO I think the ceramics are the best becuse of the heat dissipation. Buy OEM pads and rotors. ;) The brakes didn't squeal when you drove it off the lot, If you are trying to get by with anything else you will have problems sooner or later. Those toyota engineers are pretty damn good. ;)
SKperformance Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 Who is doing the repairs ? I agree with checking the sliders and cleaning them also. Is it front or rears warping?
lexus400 Posted February 23, 2006 Author Posted February 23, 2006 All done by me. I've done probably 50 brake jobs myself and have never had this problem. Yes, guide pins are always cleaned and lubed. I have plenty of movement so I know that the pads aren't getting hung up on the pins. No squeal or noise, brakes work fine... just continual warping.
chips229 Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 Hi, What model/series LS do you have? you dont say in your profile.. Mine was the mk1 and i found because of the small size front discs it was very easy to warp them,in just normal driving with very little heavy braking,if its a mk1 id think about a upgrade of the disc size. cheers chips..
dcfish Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 Hi, What model/series LS do you have? you dont say in your profile.. Mine was the mk1 and i found because of the small size front discs it was very easy to warp them,in just normal driving with very little heavy braking,if its a mk1 id think about a upgrade of the disc size. cheers chips.. YOU DO UNDERSTAND THERE IS A BREAK IN PERIOD FOR NEW ROTORS ? Usually I do not use all caps, There is a +- for rotors/pads. I'm at my ends with repeated posts, I recomend that mods merge such post's, There are WAY TOOOOO !!! many repeated discussions on these boards. I MAY BE WRONG ???????????????????????????????
lexus400 Posted February 23, 2006 Author Posted February 23, 2006 YES ! RELAX.... I wouldn't classify this as a run of the mill brake question would you ? This is well beyond the break in period for the pads or rotors. Like I said, I've done probably 50 brake jobs in the 20 years I've been working on cars. This is the first time I've had an issue like this... I think I have all the obvious things covered and was looking for something else to try. To the previous poster it's a '91 LS and the brakes are a little undersized. I think I might try OEM rotors and see if that makes a difference. Bob
dcfish Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 YES ! RELAX.... I wouldn't classify this as a run of the mill brake question would you ? This is well beyond the break in period for the pads or rotors. Like I said, I've done probably 50 brake jobs in the 20 years I've been working on cars. This is the first time I've had an issue like this... I think I have all the obvious things covered and was looking for something else to try. To the previous poster it's a '91 LS and the brakes are a little undersized. I think I might try OEM rotors and see if that makes a difference. Bob Maybe it is the driver ? Geez. I am not looking to create a flame war here. Re_evaluate your situation, Almost NOONE has warping problems with there lex. cool down and do some searches on these boards,
AussiLS400 Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 HAVE YOU LOOKED AT THE CALIPER SLIDES AND DID YOU LUBRICATE THEM WITH SPECIAL BRAKE GREASE. NORMAL GREASE BINDS THEM UP. IT HAS TO BE A CASTOR OIL BASED LUBRICANT.
FreddT Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 My experience with rotors and pads has shown that some pads/rotors work together well, and others do not. My '94 was experiencing the typical "rumble tumble shake syndrome". So I replaced my front rotors with Rock Auto cheapies, and also replaced the front pads with Raybestos semi pads. I could not believe the squeal that resulted, especially at low speeds such as when pulling into a fast food drive-in lane. After lubricating the caliper pins, shims and everything else, the result was the same. Finally, in desperation, I replaced the new pads with the OEM pads I had removed, since they still had a lot of thickness left. Aha, quiet as a sleeping baby. This was 1 year ago, they're still great today. So maybe the problem is matching the right materials that make up the rotor/pad combination. I've found that you can screw around all day with shims and grease and noise reducing gunk-and the like, but if the rotor doesn't like the pad-and vice versa-you have a real problem. I guess the best bet is to try ceramic or OEM pads next. Best of luck.
SKperformance Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 You failed to mention if it is all 4 or the front or rear rotors warping at once?
falciott Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 My front rotors were warped as well on my 90 LS, with 40 something K original miles a few months ago, replaced those bad boys with regular non drilled nor slotted Brembo brakes, and Akebono pro act ceramic pads. Results?! Supersmooth!! My guess is that u've just been unlucky and got a few sets of bad rotors one after the other.
lexus400 Posted February 24, 2006 Author Posted February 24, 2006 I think the verdict is go with OEM rotors which I'll do. Yes, forgot to mention that the problem has just been with the fronts. I'll give those a shot and see what hapens. Bob P.S. - caliper pins have always been greased with high temp brake lube
RCRFAN3 Posted February 25, 2006 Posted February 25, 2006 I'm a certified brake tech, Raybestos ceramic brake pads have had a terrible problem with warping rotors. I've seen it several times on different cars, not only the LS. After market rotors are just as good as OE, but not zinc coated, so you will see rust on the hat of the rotor.Go with the Akebono pads they are OE on many Toyota's.
Leadfoot Posted February 26, 2006 Posted February 26, 2006 I'm a certified brake tech, Raybestos ceramic brake pads have had a terrible problem with warping rotors. I've seen it several times on different cars, not only the LS. After market rotors are just as good as OE, but not zinc coated, so you will see rust on the hat of the rotor.Go with the Akebono pads they are OE on many Toyota's. I not a certified brake tech but I think you should also check the runout when installing the new rotors as it is possible that the wheel bearings could be out of spec. The discs have to run within 0.002" or you can get uneven "out of plane" wear. Good luck.
VMF Posted February 27, 2006 Posted February 27, 2006 tried different products and faced sqeakcing, vibration and all other kinds of problems changed to the oem pads, rotors, shim kits and now i ENJOY braking!
dcfish Posted February 27, 2006 Posted February 27, 2006 tried different products and faced sqeakcing, vibration and all other kinds of problems changed to the oem pads, rotors, shim kits and now i ENJOY braking! Again, I will add there is no better pad/rotor setup for your lex than oem.
ROYT Posted February 27, 2006 Posted February 27, 2006 Did you scrupulously clean the hub before fitting the new rotor? If it doesn't run true because of debris or rust behind it, this causes problems...... ;)
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