SW03ES

Well...if you owe more for the car than someone gives you for it...you're upside down. Thats just the definition of being upside down. Now all of a sudden I'm hearing about haggling and negotiation from you...when you said before you don't care about haggling and negotiation...which is which? You're correct that you didn't overpay on the interest, you just overpaid on the car. The MSRP was $43k and you probably could have bought that car for $39-40k. That $4,000 difference would have been enough in your 350Z scenario to keep you from being upside down. Thats the difference. Nobody needs to calm down, its your money I'm more trying to educate others that your way of buying cars is the absolute wrong way, negotiating from the payment. You will ALWAYS overpay for the car, and I work too hard for my living to overpay for things. I don't go crazy trying to wring every dollar out of them, but I want a fair market value. My cousin buys cars like you do and it drives me nuts, he's always upside down and having to roll the previous unsatisfied loan into the new loan. Its a cycle that never ends...

But would be voided if you have a repair that can be linked to using fuel below the specified octane level...whether its because of that or not.

Nobody wants to be my friend :( ;)

No offense...but thats why you were upside down on the 350Z probably. Affording the note is fine, but smart business decisions are important. Wouldn't you like it if that monthly note was even MORE affordable? I just hate to see people waste their hard earned money.

Naa, the Flex is a random orbital and is a very safe machine. The PC is fine, thats what I have but if I were buying one today I'd buy a Flex.

I'm not sure why you're being so defensive. LEXIRX330 is an insurance agent...he's only trying to help...as we all are. Anyways if you like the vehicle but are concerned about the physical age of the vehicle your budget of $26k certainly puts you in a lower mileage 2005 LS430...maybe even an '06. I've seen several '05s with under 50k miles listed within that range before you ever even try to negotiate...even if the insurance is in fact different (I would be shocked if during actual underwriting it wound up being significantly different) how different could it be?

You might want to call the insurance company or your agent...that just doesn't make any sense...

I would replace the battery again...

Jim, I responded to your email...did you get it?

Everybody said the same thing about the styling of the '04 when it came out...actually the exact same thing about everything pertaining to the '04...

I would tell them that. Tell them that after your experience it needs to be your price or you're going to do business with someone else. It may very well not be the dealer...it may just be that particular salesman. I don't blame you though.

Just had to do it again on my car...

I personally don't think the 04-06 LS430 looks that dated...its more modern looking than what you have... I share your concern, but truly if you are going to buy a used car the LS is the car to buy. As you know nothing takes miles like an LS. I'm looking at them right now myself, '05s and '06s. I'm confused as to why the '05 and '06 would be more insurance when they are identical to the '04... My opinion, if you are debating buying a NEW ES350 then there is an argument to be made with new vs used, but if you are already buying a used ES350...I wouldn't even consider a used ES over a used LS. New ES vs used LS sure, but not used vs used. The ES is a great car, I love mine and its given me 130k trouble free miles but the LS is more car.

I'd let them take as long as it takes to make it perfect...I wouldn't hurry them. And don't pay for it or take delivery of it until its perfect, thats a BIG repair, a lot of paint work and it very well may have some rough or wavy points at first. If it does...tell them to keep it until its right. When I had my bumper repainted by my shop who does INCREDIBLE work...I sent it back twice before I accepted it. Most people would have just taken it the first time...but I'm not most people.

I also prefer the Lexus nav to the Garmin. Plenty of RX350s to drive, similar enough to try out all the features and ergonomics. Not one available? Then wait. Its $55,000...a lot of money to spend on anything, I personally would be damn sure its the right car before I plunked it down...even if I had to wait. Its just going to get cheaper..."but I want it now!" is for kids...people have to be smart. When we bought our Prius in 2004 there were 8 month waits here...and somehow we had already driven them enough to know exactly how everything worked when we went to WV to buy ours with no wait. Dealers have demos...

You'll never see a full battery charge, its not designed to continually be completely full... As for the Prius and looks, the new Prius is MUCH better looking than the old one IMHO. I actually kinda like how the new one looks. I told my wife I would buy a new Prius in an instant if she would trade the old one...no deal! The Lincoln MKS I drove was very tight with a VERY high quality interior, much nicer than the ES350 IMHO. I'd seriously look at a Fusion Hybrid over a Camry Hybrid.

You can use it on everything, it is very mild. It probably won't clean glossy things like plastic, wood, and glass well (it'll smear) but it won't hurt them. I've had success with it on Carpet too.

You didn't get ripped of Nick because you got exactly what you asked for. In order to be "ripped off" you would need to be screwed over in some way. The dealer not offering you a discount when you don't ask for one isn't ripping you off. In life you don't get what you deserve...you get what you negotiate. Did you overpay for the car? Absolutely. However if thats what you wanted and you didn't want to haggle then you got what you wanted. I would venture to guess a lot of people who buy high dollar cars are this way...more than we know. Not haggling probably cost you $2,000-$4,000. Jim, have you tried to contact the Internet Sales Manager? Most Lexus dealers have one and they operate the way you want to operate. The other salespeople try to get you in the door because they have been taught to do that, its easier to sell and harder for you to walk away when you are there then when you are on the phone. I don't blame ordinary salespeople for trying to get you in the door, but the internet sales manager won't do that. When I bought my car from the Internet Sales Manager in Annapolis I did everything exactly how you described and walked in to sign the deal and pick up the car. The dealers here even list their CPO cars for several thousand dollars less online than on the sticker...

The difference between regular and premium is about $.30/gal. If you fill up 15 gallons a week (1 tank, assuming you never run the other 2-3 out) thats $4.50 per fill up, or $234/year. Is it worth that to me to use the gas Lexus engineer's deemed as neccisary to get the optimum performance out of my $40,000 Lexus? Yes. They wouldn't have made it a requirement if there weren't some reason...

How awful! People like that give everyone in the sales profession a bad name. I would however hear Ana out probably. I would level with her and tell her that you were so personally insulted by how this hack treated you that you don't know if you even want the Lexus anymore, and you don't know if you can even bring yourself to walk into her dealership again even if it means paying more somewhere else. I would demand the offer faxed to you in writing and a signed guarantee from her and her GM that you will be arriving at the dealer only to sign the papers, that no further negotiation will take place, and that they will keep the first hack away from you. If they won't do that in light of what happened they aren't for real... I got your email also, not to worry your post is just fine in here...

Please see the OP's other thread for responses: http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index...ic=59279&hl

Great! So you know that will clean all the interior vinyl and the leather well...

SC and ES are totally different cars though...

I'd probably buy the Optimum Poli-Seal.

I hope it turns out well, I'm sure it will.