hyperopt Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Daizen has bushings for first generation LS front suspension arms and I wonder how good they are in the long terms. Some reported that those bushings are a bit too stiff and would squeak with age. What are your thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 That depends on what year your car is. Some Diazen bushings are only meant for the first generation models. Me personally, I think the characteristic of a Lexus LS400 is all in the rubber bushings of the suspension components, as they absorb the bumps and noises a lot better than hard plastic. But you pay for that too, big time over what Diazen's costs. I've heard they squeek too, and make the ride harsher, more of a sports car feel than cruiser sedan. Daizen has bushings for first generation LS front suspension arms and I wonder how good they are in the long terms. Some reported that those bushings are a bit too stiff and would squeak with age. What are your thoughts? ← Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92ls forhundo Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 HHmmm, this is an interesting question all ive ever heard about the daizens is how wonderful they are in every aspect,blah blah vlah,etc,etc?!? Now some are saying that they ar squeeky and provide more of "a sports car" feel. Whats the real deal then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blake918 Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 HHmmm, this is an interesting question all ive ever heard about the daizens is how wonderful they are in every aspect,blah blah vlah,etc,etc?!? Now some are saying that they ar squeeky and provide more of "a sports car" feel. Whats the real deal then? ← I've only heard good things also. I'm sure they do provide a tighter feel over the cushy, soft rubber bushings that Lexus uses. Their website says that the 95-00 bushings are comming out soon. I think I'm going to try them since they are so much cheaper than the OEM parts, and I'm starting to get some soft clunks from the front end. It'll probably be a summer project. Rob, where did you read/hear the bad reviews on the bushings? Lexls, lextreme, and many others all rave about them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 I can't recall where I heard it from, maybe back in the day on that other lexus forum?? I just remember hearing that some people had problems with squeeking due to poor lubrication and cold air. I can't argue the price benefits at all! Even with Army's help last spring, I was still out $1,600+ for all of my new control arms and such. Hell of a lot better than retail thought, at roughly $3,900!! Ouch!! Vlomous bushings over in Australia are supposedly awesome too, but I don't think Andrew has made the gen 2's yet. I would be very interested to read other's opinions who have used the Diazen's in thier cars for a year or so. I too am curious about how they do. Hey blake, gonna send you a pm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKperformance Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 All urethane bushings will be stiffer but will also translate into much more crisp steering and control. Will it deteriorate the the over all ride ,it all depends on what condition your bushings are in before replacement. If they are worn then it will be an improvement in softness and revived handling . If they are in good condition it will feel sharper and most of the absorption of bumps will be left to the suspension itself . The only time they squeak is when they have not been properly lubed before install which keeps them from squeaking. With the amount of sound absorption materials i would suspect you can;t hear it unless the windows are open but you can always hear a clunk from worn bushings. So the pros are reduced part cost as they don't fall apart every few years don't need a new component like a control arm which does not break. reduced labour costs as you won't pay for a new one to be installed improved steering and handling cons slightly stiffer may squeak if installed improperly Its up to you how you weight each part for your personal style. Now what i wrote above is about urethane bushings in general not specifically for daizen bushings which i have no experience with. I do find there bushings to cost more than they should compared to normal cars .Compare a full master kit for an accord let's say and it is every bushing around 30 on the car for $100 while you only get 4 with daizen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsrxlex Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 on my 1990 ls400, i had a mechanic installed daizen bushings on both upper control arms about 2 months ago, and now they squeak badly (too bothersome even with windows up). i have to spray silicon on them every 2 weeks. there was a post lately stated that "daizen bushing sucks", so i'm not sure i will use them to replace the lower control arms or not. should i buy 2 new oem lca? about $200 each at irontoad.com. any suggestions? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gumart1 Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 If you lube them properly as SK said they will not give you any trouble for a long time. $3.99 for a tube of Sil-Glyde at NAPA Auto - better than silicone spray. I don't think Daizen "sucks" in any way, except for being ridiculously overpriced! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlander Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 with my 95 i went with aftermarket.... will not do it again.... with the 98 if i need to... OEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperopt Posted December 14, 2005 Author Share Posted December 14, 2005 Daizen bushing kit comes with lubricant, but like all lubricants, it eventually dry out and lose its lubricating properties with time. I am sure those bushings are good when lubed, but I wouldn't want to have to remove those bushings to lube them every few months as that would not be cost effective. Those who have had Daizen bushings on their vehicles for awhile please share your thoughts. lsrxlex: Do you know if the mechanic lubed those bushings at installation? Sound like you have had bad experiences with Daizen bushing so go for OEM. The price for lower control arms isn't too bad...$75.77 at newlexusparts.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ko90ls Posted December 14, 2005 Share Posted December 14, 2005 drying out over time is one thing but two months is not a long time. who knows maybe the mechanic didn't install them right? anyone personally installed them? i was thinking about getting some but now i might get the aussie bushings. <_< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsrxlex Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 hyperopt, my mechanic allowed me to lube the bushings before installation. maybe the lube dried out so fast. then that's not a good lube though. i'll buy the oem lca as you recommended. gumart1, i'll use sil-glyde tube on the daizen bushings at the upper control arms. do you think it'll go inside the bushings to silence them like the silicone spray does? thanks everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VBdenny Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Am I correct in understanding that you can replace the upper control arm bushings with these as opposed to replacing the whole control arm assembly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Yes Denny, you are correct. They've got all the bushings for the 1st generation models. Am I correct in understanding that you can replace the upper control arm bushings with these as opposed to replacing the whole control arm assembly? ← Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Just a quick story on OEM V. Diazen. This time last year my car had squeeks in the suspension, and it rode very rough over concrete and such. I replaced everything with oem parts in the suspension. It's tough to gauge the difference between the old and new when it's warm outside, as the rubber softens up due to the heat. But now that it's cold, I can tell a huge difference in the car's ride and composure with the new parts installed. It takes bumps and rough pavement extremely well, as one would expect a LS400 to do. My only concern with the Diazens outside of the potential squeeking noise is thier composure when it's below freezing outside. Plastic tends to harden up when it freezes "as does rubber". But rubber still gives here and there, as where plastic won't. But again, I'm just thinking outloud here and have no real experience with the diazen products. I can easily see the benefits of both sides of the question. My question is the drawbacks and which one has more. OEM is costly, but it's oem spec. Diazen is not as costly, and compared to oem, it's practically free. But the feel of the car, especially when the conditions outside are less than perfect, is what makes me say oem is worth the cost. But I plan on keeping my car for a long long time. Basically I want to keep for as long as it wants to keep me as it's owner! And judging by Blake's mileage, and the help of this forum, I have a feeling that will be a long time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blake918 Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Just a quick story on OEM V. Diazen. This time last year my car had squeeks in the suspension, and it rode very rough over concrete and such. I replaced everything with oem parts in the suspension. It's tough to gauge the difference between the old and new when it's warm outside, as the rubber softens up due to the heat. But now that it's cold, I can tell a huge difference in the car's ride and composure with the new parts installed. It takes bumps and rough pavement extremely well, as one would expect a LS400 to do. My only concern with the Diazens outside of the potential squeeking noise is thier composure when it's below freezing outside. Plastic tends to harden up when it freezes "as does rubber". But rubber still gives here and there, as where plastic won't. But again, I'm just thinking outloud here and have no real experience with the diazen products. I can easily see the benefits of both sides of the question. My question is the drawbacks and which one has more. OEM is costly, but it's oem spec. Diazen is not as costly, and compared to oem, it's practically free. But the feel of the car, especially when the conditions outside are less than perfect, is what makes me say oem is worth the cost. But I plan on keeping my car for a long long time. Basically I want to keep for as long as it wants to keep me as it's owner! And judging by Blake's mileage, and the help of this forum, I have a feeling that will be a long time! ← Wow, you hit all of the points perfectly!! Where is Carl? I know he has them on his 91...he traded his pretty much new bushings for the Daizens and wrote a helluva tutorial to go along with it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsrxlex Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Am I correct in understanding that you can replace the upper control arm bushings with these as opposed to replacing the whole control arm assembly? ← i also have a 1990 ls with 222.7k as of now. after recently buying a daizen front suspension bushing kit (for ~$100 from sewell lexus) and replacing only the upper bushings, i got bad squeaking noise. (the daizen bushings for the lower control arms are still unused). now, i just wonder if the upper ball joints need to be replaced after 15 years of use. if so, then i have to buy the whole upper control arms since we cannot buy the upper ball joints separately. so if i were to do it again, i'd bite the bullet and replace with all oem control arms, upper and lower. goodbye daizen bushings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexls Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Where is Carl? I know he has them on his 91...he traded his pretty much new bushings for the Daizens and wrote a helluva tutorial to go along with it! ← I'm here, just been super busy :) As I said in my tutorial, the ride is more firm without clunks. Even my new UCA's clunked a bit going over big bumps, now that's not the case. I personally love the feel with the new bushings, but they may not be for everyone. It still rides like a Lexus, just not quite as "loose." I didn't get any squeeking until we got in the single digits here...or maybe it was below zero, not sure, but it was damn cold. Yes, I lubed them fully when installing so this may be the big drawback. Anyway, I'm not worrying about it because it's not that cold for very long here. I think most of you are in warmer climates than me so no big deal. It's hard to describe if you'll like the bushings or not, you just have to ride in a car with them installed or risk it. In the end the choice is pretty simple in my eyes though; if you want your suspension a few notches firmer then install the Daizen bushings. There are +'s and -'s to everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Lexls, curious, how long have you had them on the car? By the way...kickas* website you got man! I think it's safe to say that I speak for all of us when I say THANKS!! Where is Carl? I know he has them on his 91...he traded his pretty much new bushings for the Daizens and wrote a helluva tutorial to go along with it! ← I'm here, just been super busy :) As I said in my tutorial, the ride is more firm without clunks. Even my new UCA's clunked a bit going over big bumps, now that's not the case. I personally love the feel with the new bushings, but they may not be for everyone. It still rides like a Lexus, just not quite as "loose." I didn't get any squeeking until we got in the single digits here...or maybe it was below zero, not sure, but it was damn cold. Yes, I lubed them fully when installing so this may be the big drawback. Anyway, I'm not worrying about it because it's not that cold for very long here. I think most of you are in warmer climates than me so no big deal. It's hard to describe if you'll like the bushings or not, you just have to ride in a car with them installed or risk it. In the end the choice is pretty simple in my eyes though; if you want your suspension a few notches firmer then install the Daizen bushings. There are +'s and -'s to everything. ← Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianmch Posted December 17, 2005 Share Posted December 17, 2005 Hey, First post to the forum, have been reading it intermittently for a while though. Great information. Also to you, Lexls, your tutorials are REALLY good. Thanks. Have a 99 LS400 w/115K on the clock. Have a case of the clunks and was wondering how to diagnose whether its bushings or ball joints. I guess just take the front tires off and see what wriggles? I like the idea of the poly bushings as I prefer a bit more of a firm ride, but I don't want to give up that "Damn, this ride is SWEET" thing, which is one of the reasons I bought it. Brian Above freezing in Kansas City, MO I'm here, just been super busy :) As I said in my tutorial, the ride is more firm without clunks. Even my new UCA's clunked a bit going over big bumps, now that's not the case. I personally love the feel with the new bushings, but they may not be for everyone. It still rides like a Lexus, just not quite as "loose." I didn't get any squeeking until we got in the single digits here...or maybe it was below zero, not sure, but it was damn cold. Yes, I lubed them fully when installing so this may be the big drawback. Anyway, I'm not worrying about it because it's not that cold for very long here. I think most of you are in warmer climates than me so no big deal. It's hard to describe if you'll like the bushings or not, you just have to ride in a car with them installed or risk it. In the end the choice is pretty simple in my eyes though; if you want your suspension a few notches firmer then install the Daizen bushings. There are +'s and -'s to everything. ← Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JIBBBY Posted December 17, 2005 Share Posted December 17, 2005 I am familiar with the daisen bushings and to me they are too rubbery and spongy feeling, I suggest you all go on ebay and get the stiffer ones there are several other brand bushings out there that are much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexls Posted December 17, 2005 Share Posted December 17, 2005 Lexls, curious, how long have you had them on the car? By the way...kickas* website you got man! I think it's safe to say that I speak for all of us when I say THANKS!! Thanks, I'm happy people are using it and learning some new things from my site. I've had them in for about 5 months now. I actually recently received the new sway bar bushing set from TM Engineering and will be installing that soon once it warms up here. By that time Daizen should have their rear control bushing kit out and I will install that one as well. The rear kit is what my car really needs cause the bushings are worn out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JIBBBY Posted December 17, 2005 Share Posted December 17, 2005 Lexls, curious, how long have you had them on the car? By the way...kickas* website you got man! I think it's safe to say that I speak for all of us when I say THANKS!! Thanks, I'm happy people are using it and learning some new things from my site. I've had them in for about 5 months now. I actually recently received the new sway bar bushing set from TM Engineering and will be installing that soon once it warms up here. By that time Daizen should have their rear control bushing kit out and I will install that one as well. The rear kit is what my car really needs cause the bushings are worn out. That's funny because I have a new set of daisen bushing collecting dust in my back yard, they are still in my old control arms you can have them, They are left over from an expensive foul up from Todd at TM. I had to go with the supra arms after I got screwed.. Hear are the pics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexls Posted December 17, 2005 Share Posted December 17, 2005 Ummm that would be great if I had an SC :whistles: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JIBBBY Posted December 17, 2005 Share Posted December 17, 2005 Ummm that would be great if I had an SC :whistles: Bushings are the same arms are different and these daisens can be pushed right out no problem. Just trying to help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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