Mercedes Converts?

[LexusLooker]

Don't make too much fun of me, guys - yet!! My name is James, and I'm a Benz addict. (everybody say "Hi James") I've tried Volvo. I've tried American cars and trucks, and I always fall in love with another Benz. And now I'm suffering under the spell of my latest one. It's in the shop AGAIN, and I can't believe how I blindly pay more and more to keep it alive. I get so much grief from my Lexus-owning friends and co-workers. I've poo-pooed Japanese cars because they don't seem to grab me. I love the feel, solidity and personality of German cars. But I've always liked the looks of the LS, and I respect good engineering. I drive a little over 40K miles a year, and I just can't keep up with the "always something going out" on the Benz. I've been lurking on this site for a couple of weeks, and I'm impressed with your enthusiasm for your cars. I'm hoping to get to 200K miles before declaring bankruptcy, and you guys go 300K all the time. What did you guys drive before you bought Lexus? Are any of you Benz (or German) ex-owners who never looked back? I'm thinking of an 01/02 LS430.

Thanks for a great site - your enthusiasm is infectious!!

[Matthew_McNally]

welcome to LOC LL

start looking for an LS now - these guys will convert you in no time at all ;)

[RFeldes]

I've owned three Mercedes in my lifetime and loved them all. But, they were pre 1991. A dear friend of mine who owned four also exclaimed to me in 1991 after driving his Lexus said something I never forgot. " I honestly think this Lexus is better quality" and we never looked back. He has more money than I do. It seems as if Mercedes has lowered it's standards in the last few years be it the Euro or Corporate pencil pushing. Lexus has maintained it's quality standards, as far as I know. I have a 1990 and can still be tacken aback by the engineering from that era. If you want a solidly built car with few headaches then it's Lexus. If you are looking for a pinnacle and status with a price then it is Mercedes. The only Mercedes I would entertain if I had a backup is the S55 only because Lexus has not stepped up to that league.

[RFeldes]

Please let me add that the Germans are the best in the world at analog Engineering and build solid vehicles but the reliabilty problems surfacing are because of Digital components and they lag the Japanese and Americans. Therein lies the dependability issue, in my humble opinion

[flanker271]

What we need is Daimler-Toyota :D

[SKperformance]

I love the MB's look for many cars

I can't stand the way they break so damn easily.

As well as the option list longer than my leg for things that should be standard in a luxury car.

I find them dreadful in snow even with a phenominal esp system.

I also love the S55 a real "in the pit of your gut" kind of car.

On of my favorites to drive around next to the SL55.

I left domestics after thinking they were perfect.

Funny i look back and i used to have to keep extra starters ,alternators and other parts as it just kept breaking and i thought it was normal. Until i got rid of it and bough my first Japanese (Lexus). I was floored and still am that i fix stuff i break not stuff that was underengineered.

BTW i work for M.B.

[SW03ES]

I know a couple people who have switched from Benzes and all of them are happy. With 40k miles driven per year you need something thats reliable sheesh. If you want a Lexus, the LS is the most solid and "Benz-ish" of all of them, it will definately spend WAY less time in the shop.

[1990LS400]

If I don't count the cars driven primarily by my wife, prior to the two LS400's, I had, in no particular order, three Mercedes, three Volvos, a VW, a Honda and a few English 2-seaters and 50's/60's American cars. My best friend probably bought his Mercedes E320 because he thought I was happy about my last Mercedes. I sure wish he had asked me what I really thought about my Mercedes experiences. At one time I was locked into the "dream" of Mercedes cars. Unfortuately, the Mercedes dream does not agree with reality of trying to keep them working and paying the rediculous cost of owning and repairing them.

All I lost when I switched from Mercedes to Lexus was a whole lot of pain.

There are four S-class Mercedes spread among three households in my culdesac. Frankly, I feal very sorry for all these people have to put up with.

[99lsguy]

I test drove an 98' S430 sedan for a few days before I settled on the 99 LS.

The car was in very good shape, excellent records..........

For me, the ride was too stiff and the seats to hard/uncomfortable.

The wheelbase was 123 inches.......but still wasn't as smooth as the LS to me. I was use to Honda and Acura's as far as looks - but the 430 was certainly impressive looking.

As for the interior - their were WAY too many buttons and such - the classic interior of the LS was for me ---and away I went!!!

[SW03ES]

I remember a guy on CL traded his 97 LS400 in on a brand new S430, all $78,000 of it. Last we heard from him he'd had the car 3 months and driven it a week, it'd been in the shop the whole rest of the time.

I work too hard for my money to spend it on something as extravegant as a luxury car and drive their crappy loaners all the time because its in the shop.

[99lsguy]

I remember a guy on CL traded his 97 LS400 in on a brand new S430, all $78,000 of it. Last we heard from him he'd had the car 3 months and driven it a week, it'd been in the shop the whole rest of the time.

I work too hard for my money to spend it on something as extravegant as a luxury car and drive their crappy loaners all the time because its in the shop.

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Yeah, that's the part I forgot--------the $78 GRAND PART!!! this puppy was in no respects $20K more vehicle than the LS. Totally outrageous.

Those kind of numbers boggle my mind

[vincentesq]

I currently own a 97 S500 and a 03 S500 for my wife. My last car before the 03 S500 was a 92 LS400. I just bought an 01 LS430. I have to say that although I like the look of the Merc more (both the current generation and the last (92-99) generation), both mercedes have broken down many more times than I care to remember. My LS400 did not start to break down until about 150k or so, then something would break every couple of months until I sold it. My 97 S500 has only 80k on it, and my average repair bill is about $3k/year. Can you imagine I had to pay $2000 on repairs for my AC 6 months after the warranty expired???? When does the AC fail on a 4 year old car with 30k miles? I am selling my 97 S500, and swears never to be ripped off again. By the way, my brother had a 99 M3 for a couple years and when it worked, it was flawless until it would break down about once/year. Each time, the bill was between $1k-2k. He finally got tired and got an infinity G35 which cost less, has never broken down and is faster than that previous generation M3 series. He tells me he never looked back either. Yes, you will be very very happy with lexus. That's the bottom line.

[SRK]

I have owned two Mercedes, both the old analog types. Wonderful cars when they built them. Tough, reliable, and frightening expensive to repair. Now they are weak, unreliable, and frighteningly expensive to repair. They look great. They drive great. That isn't enough in my mind.

So I advised a real estate salesman buddy of mine to look at an LS400 when he needed a new car to ferry clients around. He said Lexus were boring. I said I had never driven one, but that he should drive one anyways. He bought the first one he sat in...... I found another for myself, and 18 months later bought a second one for me as the wife wouldn't get out of the first.

I have had 19 Volvos, two Mercedes, one BMW, a 67 Plymouth Barracuda (yikes!), a 94 Camaro Z28, a 49 Mercury panel truck (that was a cool truck), and a few others. I will drive a Lexus for as long as I draw breath. Without knowing me, it is tough for anyone here to tell how significant that comment is, as I thought the world of Volvos. I still repair them, but I won't own one again.

Own a Lexus, and you will never go back.

[90LS400Lexus]

My favorite Mercedes are the 1981-1985 S-Class sedans- particularly the 1984-1985 500SEL 4dr extended wheelbase sedan. These cars are very good (up to 1991), but very costly to maintain. I am currently considering a like new 1985 500SEL, if I can get the owner down about $1500 more. I am still frightened of the high maintainence costs however, so I am still hesitant.

I have owned MANY cars before my Lexus- and several after. Here is my list- I

will try to list them in order that I got them beginning in 1989. I will warn you- I was into the older American cars back then and over the past two years started wanting them again....

1976 Lincoln Town Car 4dr (really dads, but he said it was mine) :P

1973 Plymouth Valiant 4dr (was only 14, but dad bought for me to tinker with)

1972 Cadillac Sedan DeVille 4dr (my first "official" car registered to me)

1960 Oldsmobile Super 88 4dr sedan

1977 Chevrolet Monte Carlo 2dr

1971 Oldsmobile Toronado 2dr (was like new- wish I had of kept)

1978 Lincoln Town Car 4dr

1983 Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera LS 4dr

1983 Oldsmobile Ninety-Eight Regency 4dr

1981 Oldsmobile Toronado 2dr

1983 Ford Thunderbird 2dr

1985 Chevrolet Camaro

1991 Chevrolet Camaro RS

1984 Toyota 4WD truck (my very first import and stuck with one since until recently)

1987 Toyota Camry 4dr

1986 Honda Accord LX 4dr

1987 Mazda 2wd truck

1988 Honda Civic LX 4dr

1981 Toyota Cressida 4dr

1989 Acura Integra RS 2dr

1986 Honda Accord LX 4dr (2nd one)

1974 Mercedes 240D 4dr

1982 BMW 733i 4dr

1987 Toyota Camry 4dr (2nd one)

1984 Honda Accord LX 4dr

1989 Honda Accord DX 2dr

1972 Buick Electra 225 4dr (loved it- return of the old American tanks to my fleet) :D

1991 Honda Accord LX 4dr (loved this car)

1989 Pontiac Safari wagon (bought in June of 2001 - still own)

1995 Chrysler Concorde 4dr

1993 Toyota Camry LE V6 4dr (loved it too)

1990 Lexus LS400 **

1969 Chevrolet Caprice 4dr (my classic undergoing restoration - still own)

1973 Pontiac Grand Ville 4dr (current car - 89K actual, one owner miles - still own)

In the market for a S-Class Mercedes (1981-1985) or another Camry/Accord/LS400

You can see I have owned many, many different cars since 1989. I used to get tired of them quick, or find something else I liked better and resold. <_< :D

[LexusLooker]

Man, you guys answered my question better than I asked it. What I didn't ask but you answered anyway was the question "are you as passionate about your Lexus as you were about your other cars/Benzes?" Thanks for the great responses. You are obviously car lovers and you get it when somebody says they love their car. I don't drive Benz for others, I drive it because I like it. Funny though, I was talking to a guy at the gym today who works for Daimler-Chrysler (kinda like you, SKPerformance) and he just last week bought an 89 ES and loves it. He made the comment that he doesn't get the looks that he did in his Benzes. That won't bother me; I don't want to be all show-offy about it. I just want a good comfortable solid car.

I had an "a-ha" moment when a couple of you mentioned analog vs. digital cars. I hadn't thought about it that way. I used to have an 83 S-class diesel. So it was analog, and it had 240K on it when I sold it. I spent a lot to keep it running well, but it was bulletproof and not "glitchy". I literally got teary eyed when I traded it for a shiny new Volvo. I kept the Volvo 6 months and went back to MB. My current benz, the one that's been in the shop for 2 months, is an 02 and has had a few digital glitches (although the current problem is analog). I agree that the quality is suffering. I drove an 01 S500. It's nice, but not solid enough.

A couple of you listed previous cars you owned - some cool stuff there. 90LS400, your list looked like some of the American cars I had when they ruled the world. I still think 60s and 70s Caddys and Lincolns are cool.

Every one of you had at least a nugget or two in your posts. I appreciate the input. Now I just have to decide if I want an LS400 (more affordable) or an LS430 (go Levinson...and better road feel, supposedly). Thanks a million for taking the time to answer me. I didn't expect such good answers. I gotta go shopping :) Hope to see you guys again.

James

[blake918]

I'm a repeat Lexus customer. I got a '94 ES300 first and a year later the '95 LS400. The LS400 has 248.6k miles(ES doesn't even have 130k), and it is simply a fantastic car. I've never driven anything that can compare with the quality and engineering of the LS series. The reliability is unparalleled.

However, I must say that I am a little upset with the comfort of the LS, but I am very tall-6'4. Those bad feelings with my LS were furthered after logging 700 miles in a friends '01 Taurus this weekend. The comfort was simply amazing-the seats, the head and legroom, etc; even after 5hrs at the wheel, the seats were painfree which can't be said for the LS(as other tall 400 drivers have also noted), and it was novel to me to not have my hir brush the ceiling, and I could stretch out my legs. Let me get my shield ready to dodge the rocks comming at me, but I'd really consider selling my LS for a Taurus if I hadn't invested north of $3k in repairs this year.

I hear the driver comfort in the 430 is supposed to be much, much better though, so I'll probably just hold out for one of these in 4-5 years.

[99lsguy]

I'm a repeat Lexus customer. I got a '94 ES300 first and a year later the '95 LS400. The LS400 has 248.6k miles(ES doesn't even have 130k), and it is simply a fantastic car. I've never driven anything that can compare with the quality and engineering of the LS series. The reliability is unparalleled.

However, I must say that I am a little upset with the comfort of the LS, but I am very tall-6'4. Those bad feelings with my LS were furthered after logging 700 miles in a friends '01 Taurus this weekend. The comfort was simply amazing-the seats, the head and legroom, etc; even after 5hrs at the wheel, the seats were painfree which can't be said for the LS(as other tall 400 drivers have also noted), and it was novel to me to not have my hir brush the ceiling, and I could stretch out my legs. Let me get my shield ready to dodge the rocks comming at me, but I'd really consider selling my LS for a Taurus if I hadn't invested north of $3k in repairs this year.

I hear the driver comfort in the 430 is supposed to be much, much better though, so I'll probably just hold out for one of these in 4-5 years.

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Yeah..........

I'm 6-1 and feel at the max for the LS..........my head is within 1" of the ceiling. The legroom is ample though. The 01+ 430's have much more interior room (especially headroom) than previous LS's which is dearly needed.

I drove a 2000 mazda 626 (basically a Ford) that has more interior head room that the LS.......but those seats weren't comfy.....the LS is adequate, but not great.

I think we're all passionate about the LS - it's not a time trial vehicle........but a great "cruiser" - and has "silent acceleration" from 40 to 90 mph.......... :D

[Matthew_McNally]

start looking for an LS now - these guys will convert you in no time at all  ;)

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Now I just have to decide if I want an LS400 (more affordable) or an LS430 (go Levinson...and better road feel, supposedly).  Thanks a million for taking the time to answer me.

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what did I tell you! :D

[lkirchner]

My favorite Mercedes are the 1981-1985 S-Class sedans- particularly the 1984-1985 500SEL 4dr extended wheelbase sedan.  These cars are very good (up to 1991), but very costly to maintain.  I am currently considering a like new 1985 500SEL, if I can get the owner down about $1500 more.  I am still frightened of the high maintainence costs however, so I am still hesitant. 

I have owned MANY cars before my Lexus- and several after.  Here is my list- I

will try to list them in order that I got them beginning in 1989.  I will warn you- I was into the older American cars back then and over the past two years started wanting them again....

1976 Lincoln Town Car 4dr (really dads, but he said it was mine)  :P

1973 Plymouth Valiant 4dr (was only 14, but dad bought for me to tinker with)

1972 Cadillac Sedan DeVille 4dr (my first "official" car registered to me)

1960 Oldsmobile Super 88 4dr sedan

1977 Chevrolet Monte Carlo 2dr

1971 Oldsmobile Toronado 2dr (was like new- wish I had of kept)

1978 Lincoln Town Car 4dr

1983 Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera LS 4dr

1983 Oldsmobile Ninety-Eight Regency 4dr

1981 Oldsmobile Toronado 2dr

1983 Ford Thunderbird 2dr

1985 Chevrolet Camaro

1991 Chevrolet Camaro RS

1984 Toyota 4WD truck (my very first import and stuck with one since until recently)

1987 Toyota Camry 4dr

1986 Honda Accord LX 4dr

1987 Mazda 2wd truck

1988 Honda Civic LX 4dr

1981 Toyota Cressida 4dr

1989 Acura Integra RS 2dr

1986 Honda Accord LX 4dr (2nd one)

1974 Mercedes 240D 4dr

1982 BMW 733i 4dr

1987 Toyota Camry 4dr (2nd one)

1984 Honda Accord LX 4dr

1989 Honda Accord DX 2dr

1972 Buick Electra 225 4dr (loved it- return of the old American tanks to my fleet)  :D

1991 Honda Accord LX 4dr (loved this car)

1989 Pontiac Safari wagon (bought in June of 2001 - still own)

1995 Chrysler Concorde 4dr

1993 Toyota Camry LE V6 4dr (loved it too)

1990 Lexus LS400 **

1969 Chevrolet Caprice 4dr (my classic undergoing restoration - still own)

1973 Pontiac Grand Ville 4dr (current car - 89K actual, one owner miles - still own)

In the market for a S-Class Mercedes (1981-1985) or another Camry/Accord/LS400 

You can see I have owned many, many different cars since 1989.  I used to get tired of them quick, or find something else I liked better and resold.    <_<  :D

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I thought I was bad at owning cars and it is nice to see someone else as car crazy as I was and still am. Here are the cars , to the best of my knowledge, that I have owned or own;

Mercedes ( Not in order of purchase)

Family Model Year

W198 300 SL Gullwing 1956

W188 300 SC Roadster 1957

W188 300 SL Roadster 1962

W115 220 1968

W111 280SE 3.5 Coupe 1971

W113 280 SL 1971

W115 220 D 1972

W108 280 SEL 4.5 1973

W116 450 SEL 6.9 1977

W124 300 CE 1988

W126 560 SEL 1991

W201 190 E 2.6 1992

W210 E320 1996

W210 E430 1998

W208 CLK 55 2002

W215 S 55 2003

W215 CL 55 2003

W209 CLK 500 2004

Other Cars (Not in Order of Purchase

Corvette Coupe Fuel Injected 1964

Corvette Roadster 396 1965

Corvette Coupe L88 1967

Jaguar XKE Coupe 1968

Jaguar Mark X Sedan 1966

BMW 2002 Tii 1973

Mini Cooper 1973

BMW 735i 1985

Ford Taurus SHO 1990

Mazda Miata 1990 Son’s car

Chrysler LHS 1994

Oldsmobile Aurora 1995

Honda Prelude 1994 Daughter’s car

Honda Civic 1996 Daughter’s car

Honda Passport 1996

Toyota 4 Runner 2001

Lexus SC 430 2004

Lexus LS 430 2004

As you can see I was a previous Benz owner before purchasing Lexus. I truly cannot say that I am overjoyed in the Lexus experience. For one thing I still like the firmer ride that you obtain with a normal Benz auto and the AMG performance is nowhere to be seen in any Lexus. That said, my wife loves the LS and everything about it. I only wish that I could say the same about the SC. The car has sat in the rain 2 times and it has acid rain spots on the hood, trunk and roof. I personally take care of my cars and it has 3 coats of sealant and at least 4 coats of wax on it. Paint as fragile as this should not exist on a $65,000 car. In addition, I have been having a problem with the upholstery on the seats since September and as late as this morning, I took it back for the 6th time to be told we have done all that we can do and will have to take it to the regional service manager who will be here sometime in March. By the way, I really do not want to get into the gory details as to what transpired on the visits to have it repaired. My comment to them was don't waste your time since I will be going directly to the Mercedes dearler once I leave here to trade this on a new SL. In all likelihood as soon as the new S class is released I will trade the LS for one.

So here is one person who sought "the Ultimate Pursuit of Perfection" and came over from Mercedes only to be disappointed in what I found. I found the Ultimate Deluge of Surveys, Letters and Poor Service that i thoght did not exist at Lexus.

Lou K

[FlintUltra]

LexusLooker - I sold my 2003 E500 and am now driving an 04 Ultra Lux package LS430. 2003 E500 stickered at $65K, I sold it for about $44K with 28,000 miles on it. 8 different unscheduled visits to the dealer plus two scheduled visits in 22 months. My Audi S4 before that saw the shop about three times. That plus the depreciation hit I was taking on the new E class - I got out. The reliability issues were almost all electronic ones. I just think MB was trying to incorporate too many cool things all at once.

There are trade-offs - the E500 with the sport package will outhandle just about any Lexus sedan out there. Stiffer ride, though. My LS with the air suspension set to SPORT give me 85% of the E500. Good enough for me.

MB Keyless Go is a better implementation than Lexus. MB implementation of the sequential shift mode is better - just move the lever left or right from the "D" position - no need to move over to a separate gate.

My LS is almost as quick, way quieter, and so far has not skipped a beat in 4,000 miles. Dealer experience so far has been great. Wife went and got herself a 2005 RX330 in the same damn color combo! Good luck with your search!

Bruce

[SKperformance]

I love how their is not one comment on "MB sucks"

btw blake all S32- and 430's have a very adjustable seat with the lower seat pad extending forward to get behind your knees.

I love the seats especially the ones with dynamics for the pnematic lumbars

[SW03ES]

I love how their is not one comment on "MB sucks"

Yep that just speaks to the quality of our membership. Check out similar threads on CL, they're downright emberassing.

I'll go through for you the differences I see between the 98-00 LS400 and the LS430.

Personally for me the greatest difference between the LS430 and the LS400 is size. I put many many miles on my dad's 98 LS400 (I loved that car, I still miss it and wonder every once and a while if I should have gotten an 00 CPO LS400 instead of my ES) he now has an 04 Ultra in the Flint Mica (great color Flint) which I have driven substantially less (as I do not live with him like I did when he had the LS400 etc). They're both great cars but I can't help but like the LS400 better, maybe because it was my first experience with Lexus, who knows. I'm 6'1" and he's 6'0" and both of us felt comfortable in the LS400 but we both recline our seats more than most people, I think an inch or so taller than me and you'd be tight to fit in the LS400. The LS430 has 3 or even 4 more inches of headroom so thats not going to be an issue at all. The LS400 also has a pathetic trunk for a car its size because the gas tank is between the rear seat and the trunk, but they moved the tank for the 430 and its much larger. As for styling, I dislike the 01-03 LS430s but like the styling on the 04-05 MUCH better, the 98-00 LS400 is still the best looking LS though IMHO.

As far as interiors go, both cars have great interiors, the 430 obviously has more wood and you either like that or don't. The seating position in the 430 is also more upright which gives you a better command of the road, similar to the previous gen S class actually. The 430 also has much better seats like SK said with the adjustable seat bottom legnth and the addition of more levels of heat (the 400 just has on and off) and cooling. The 430 obviously has the edge with features (400s are pretty gizmo-less actually) with the advent of the Ultra package.

As for stereos I personally don't see a difference in the Mark Levinson found in the 430 and the Nakamichi found in the 400. The reason Lexus switched was that Nakamichi refused to allow their stereo to feed through the navigation system (thats why you can't get a 400 with nav AND Nakamichi, all the nav cars have the standard stereo) not because of sound quality. Both are great stereos. As for nav the 430 has a much more advanced DVD system and nav is probably not worth getting on a 400.

As for ride and drive they are very, very similar. The main draw towards the LS and Lexus in general has always been its trademark (and un-duplicated if you ask me, nothing rides like a Lexus) smooth and silent ride. This is pretty much unchanged between the 400 and the 430. The 430 is stiffer (not stiffer in ride but the BODY is more rigid meaning more solid) and the 430s have the added benefit of a sport suspension option which is very rare between 01 and 03 but more common on 04s and 05s (which come with great 18" wheels) if you like that. You may like that coming from a firmer car like a Benz. In the power department the two are similar again, the LS400 is a little bit quicker and has a higher top speed.

So there you have it, thats how I see it. If you like the upright feel of a Benz and value interior space and trunk room or gadgets or the availibility of factory suspension choices or navigation I'd look at LS430s (and do an 04 if you can afford it) otherwise you'll be very happy with an LS400. They truly are wonderful, wonderful cars.

[xsohaib]

I had my first benz when I waas overseas, an E230 W124, 1988 Euro to be specific, very reliable car and never had any problems, though it was a four cylinder 2.3L not much oomph. Even at that point I wanted a pre 91 S-class, I was (and am still) in love with the benzes. So a few years ago I bought the benz a white W126 1989 mercedes 420SEL, beautiful car V8 lots of power (OK not lots but enough) and it is a dream to drive, at about the same time I bought an ES300 1992. However, I have put about 14K miles on the benz since 1999, essentailly because I am afraid that the more I drive it the more it will break down, every trip to the shop has come to around $800 minimum and the problems still aren't over (but I refuse to sell it, its the car I wanted since I was a kid) on the other hand the ES300 has been driven from Alaska to texas, then from Texas to Boston, and then from Boston to Miami (to be shipped overseas), and now I am in the market for an LS 95 or younger. Personally I think the ergenomics on the Lexuses are much better, than the older benzes, but the german cars for some reason have that personality associated with them that I don;t find in other cars (that is if you are willing to deal with it), I am a med student so don;t have the time to deal with all the attention required by the Merc, and hence I am sticking to the LS. I think for daily trouble free driving Lexuses are the best!

Cheers

Sohaib

[Wilfred]

Just out of curiosity, i was considering a 92 S-Class before i brought my LS400. Has anyone owned a W140 Merc? How do they comapre with the LS400?

[90LS400Lexus]

The 1992-99 S500 (or any S-Class) is a beautiful car (or should I say tank- because they are built like one), but I have heard a lot of stories on the Mercedes forums that these cars are quite troublesome. Mainly electrical glitches. The engines and transmission however are reported to be nearly bullet proof. The 1991-older S-Class sedans seem to have far fewer problems and built as "tank-like". They are very costly to maintain as well. Even more to maintain than Lexus if that is imaginable. :D

Just out of curiosity, i was considering a 92 S-Class before i brought my LS400. Has anyone owned a W140 Merc? How do they comapre with the LS400?

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