Is300 Or Es330

[RobsES330]

howdy all, i just joined the club.i know the IS300 and ES330 are two different rides, but i would like to know which one to get. i test drove the IS 300 and loved it. but i have a family and i know the ES 330 is better for the family role. if i get the 2004 IS300 it would come with a better sound system plus HID and Trac control. i live in NY so the ES330 would be better for the snow. i can get an 2005 ES330 for $37 a month more than the IS300. i'm leaning more towards the ES330 but would like some input from the club. p.s. my wife and father-in-law went to the dealership without me so i'm not really sure what the car will come with except heated and cooled seats. and she says the ES330 will come with HID but i won't know for sure until Friday :chairshot: thank you for any feedback :D

[iammikey]

I was pondering the same as you before I bought my ES. The IS has a bunch of neat aftermarket stuff while the ES is one tough car to find parts for. Overall, the ES provides a more comfortable ride with enough get go power while the IS has better OOMPH feel. With kids, the ES is the pratical decision because of the room.

As far as features, get it fully loaded instead of beatting yourself up with could have, would of and should have.

[Lexusfreak]

The ES is the larger, roomier & more comfortable overall if your family is a consideration in the decision. I find the IS is more for the performance minded driver as it's rear drive. If you want a bit more of a 'sporty' feel to the ES, you might want to consider getting the factory AVS (adjustabe variable suspension) system so you can adjust the firmness of the suspension & have it more sporty when your by yourself & softer with the family. I have that feature on my 01 ES & love it. Good luck & welcome to the club! B)

[Lexdiamonds]

I would go with the ES, it has more horsepower and the luxury is the best with the woodgrain.

[bkchig]

I had the same issue back in early August. They had a IS300 Sports Edition and man was it nice. Fun, nimble, quick, and sporty...and then there was the ES330. Large, comfortable, quiet, and logical for my needs. It Oozed "Responsible!!" Ok, to make this short, I choose the ES330 because in reality...if I really wanted a sports sedan...I would get one that isn't that expensive and that small. It's the size of a VW Jetta VR6 (which was what I traded in for the Lexus), cost as much as an Audi A4, and has had the same body style for the last 4 years. Get the 330 my man...And if you want something sporty that will really be a head-turner, cruise around in a 68' Camaro RS Clone like I do.

[TROD23]

we bought the is300 a couple of weeks ago and love it. however, we do not have any kids right now and when we do have kids it will be time to get a bigger car. the trunk is small and the back seat could be tight. i would recommed the IS only if it is not the primary family car. otherwise, the ES is the way to go.

[bkchig]

Oh yeah...I agree with Trod23...I'm actually single. Why did I pick the ES330...because I'm crazy like that...it's actually my first full-size car (the Jetta VR6 was my first 4 door). Oh...I also tote around clients to lunch meeting about twice a week. It was quite some adventure trying to fit a guy and other backseat passenger that are over 5'10'' in the back seat.

the IS is fun...but he's right...the trunk is the size of a small wood crate that you ship fruit in and the back seats are great for golf clubs.

[1990LS400]

I spent a day with an ES330 loaner from the dealer in May and I was surprised, if I ignored the wood and leather, how similar the ES330 is to our V6 Camry in its driving characteristics. I expected far more of a difference even though I know the two are built on the same platform. The ES really is a nice car and in the long run might be less expensive to own compared to the IS since you could probably get by without extra wheels and snow tires and the ES will get better mileage. (Better than you think since you might not drive the ES as hard as an IS.) And the ES interior really is a work of art.

Like iammikey said ... there are far fewer aftermarket parts for the ES. With the ES, you wouldn't be tempted to buy stuff for it. The IS is sold in the U.K. and Europe while the ES is not which is probably why so much aftermarket stuff is available for the IS.

I get to spend a bit of time in Albany at my "adopted" company regional office - I really love the area. Which car would this old guy like to be driving when I drive from Albany to Lake Placid / White Face to ski? That would be the rear wheel drive IS300 Sportcross Wagon with E-shift. Has much more luggage space than the ES too.

And if you are looking for a parking place in NYC, just think of how many more spots the 14 inch shorter IS Sportcross would fit in!

[SW03ES]

PERSONALLY I don't really care for the IS. Its a good looking and fun little car but it rides poorly, the interior is far cheaper than the other Lexus offerings and it is *very* small. We looked at an IS300 for my fiance (I never considered it when shopping for the ES, she loves the IS) and its a neat little car, but you really can do better for the money. The G35 is an example, great car, more grown up looking with a nicer yet still sporty interior. Only tradeoff is in resale.

[FLiP Sp33d]

if you want the sporty feel of an is and the luxury of an es, why not go for a used gs?

[jragosta]

PERSONALLY I don't really care for the IS. Its a good looking and fun little car but it rides poorly, the interior is far cheaper than the other Lexus offerings and it is *very* small. We looked at an IS300 for my fiance (I never considered it when shopping for the ES, she loves the IS) and its a neat little car, but you really can do better for the money. The G35 is an example, great car, more grown up looking with a nicer yet still sporty interior. Only tradeoff is in resale.

Agreed. If I wanted a $30 K sporty sedan, I'd go with the Infiniti G35 or perhaps the Acura TL.

I wasn't very impressed with the IS300.

[SW03ES]

Acura TL is another good choice.

[1990LS400]

"FLiP Sp33d" has a good point. Why spend $30K + or so for a new IS or ES when you can have a like-new several year old GS or LS for the same price or less? The supply of excellent condition, used Lexus - and used cars in general - is incredibly large. We've bought lots of new cars in the past - Mercedes, Volvo, Lexus, Honda, Toyota, Volkswagen - but will probably not buy a brand new car again if used car prices continue to stay this low.

Last year, for less than the price a well equipted new ES or IS, we bought a well equipted 2000 LS400, one of the last 208 built, original retail over $60K, just after it came off a 3 year / 36,000 mile lease.

[SW03ES]

I was faced with the same choice, I chose a new ES over a CPO 2000 LS for a couple reasons:

1. Its new. I can't help it but I was buying my first Lexus and I wanted a new one. The ES was pretty close to the ride and drive of the LS anyways, was fWD, had a bigger trunk and it was new.

2. Its cheaper to maintain. As you know the dealerships have a whole 'nother price book for the V8 cars.

3. DVD vs hard drive navigation.

4. It was new.

5. It was new.

;)

[NeiLtYmE]

2000 LS.... remarkable car.

Not in the winter though...

When you bought your ES, was the cpo LS around the same price ? l

[RobsES330]

thanks for the replys. i now feel better for my choice on the ES. i still don't know what is coming on the car because i wasn't present at the dealership. but i'm sure i'm going to be happy with the ES. its going to be my first new car and i can't wait to bring her home. i was thinking about the G35, it sure has plenty of horsepower 0-60 in 6 secs. and sure enough i foundout a friend's son happens to be a salesman for infinity but thats after i went and leased the Lexus. the dealership is in another state so i don't know if that would have made a diffrence. the G35 AWD would have costed me $350's with $5000 down which i think could have been worth it .the kid told me (because he really is a kid) i could've have gotten a better deal on the ES, but i've been to three dealerships (well two and the wifey to the third) and the third one had the better deal so we went with that one. one thing that made me not want an Infinity is i read that the paint chips. not sure if its true or not. i would like to thank you for replying.

[jragosta]

"FLiP Sp33d" has a good point. Why spend $30K + or so for a new IS or ES when you can have a like-new several year old GS or LS for the same price or less? The supply of excellent condition, used Lexus - and used cars in general - is incredibly large. We've bought lots of new cars in the past - Mercedes, Volvo, Lexus, Honda, Toyota, Volkswagen - but will probably not buy a brand new car again if used car prices continue to stay this low.

Last year, for less than the price a well equipted new ES or IS, we bought a well equipted 2000 LS400, one of the last 208 built, original retail over $60K, just after it came off a 3 year / 36,000 mile lease.

If so, you got a pretty good deal. Still, I'd choose a brand new ES over a 5 year old used LS (you didn't specify the mileage).

In general, with Lexus vehicles, they don't depreciate enough to make it worth while. A 2 year old CPO ES, for example, is only a couple thousand less than a brand new one. I would rather have the brand new one for a lot of reasons:

1. Longer warranty

2. You don't have to worry about whether someone else maintained it properly or abused it on the road.

3. You don't have to rely on the CPO warranty (which - as at least one person here can attest - might not be as strong as the factory warranty).

4. You lose out on any new features introduced recently - like side curtain air bags front ant rear on the ES.

5. Higher maintenance costs.

6. No matter how well the dealer cleans up a used car, it's just not new. Having someone else's scratches and wear and tear would annoy me.

If I only had $10 K to spend for a car, I'd seriouisly consider used. But spending $30 K, I just don't think I'd ever find enough savings to make it worth my while.

[SW03ES]

Yep, almost exactly. They had a black on black 2000 LS with 33,000 miles for $34,500 and my $39,670 ES went for 35k. The LS had everything but nav, but it had Nakamichi and was in near perfect shape. It took extensive driving of them back to back to back to decide lol

One big difference is though that I wanted to lease and the lease wouldn't work out on the 2000 LS because of how the money factors are set up. My payment on the ES is just shy of $500 and the lease payment on the LS would have been $700 and some.

[1990LS400]

Yes, buying a car on E-Bay, from someone you don't know, without research, etc. can lead to disaster. Fortuately it is not too difficult to reduce the risk.

My 2000 LS was a little over three years, three months old (based on the original delivery date of 7/31/2000) when I bought it last fall. It was turned in by the lessee at 36K miles. The small dealer (a friend of a friend of mine) from whom I bought it drove it as his personal car for 2,000 miles. It had 38K miles when I got it and nine months of the 4-year basic warranty left under which the chrome wheels (pitted) and A/C control (tiny bit of debris in display) were replaced. As of today, a little over 22 months of the drive-train warranty is left. By the way, the terms of the lease required the car to be sold at auction. The Lexus dealer did not have the option to buy it directly from the leasing company.

My car was leased and driven by someone I happen to know. As required by the lease, he had the car serviced every 5,000 miles by the dealer.

Knowing the above, having bought an LS new in 1990, having driven it 183,000 miles and knowing what to expect, I viewed buying my used 2000 LS as a low risk proposition. I paid exactly $9,000 less than the local Lexus dealer advertised price at the time for a less well optioned CPO 2000 LS with about the same miles.

I don't now about you guys but $9,000 is quite a bit of money to us and we have lots of other things we like to do like ski, scuba and travel. Heck, $9,000 was more that the total we spend on our last four trips (total 9 weeks) to Europe. $9,000 is a lot to give as a "gift" to a Lexus dealer.

If I want a service warranty, I can buy one at "dealer remit" for much less than CPO warranty retail price. That is something I can do because I work in the insurance industry.

Buying a used LS also meant we did not have to move any money around and I could just write a check and drive it away.

The 2000 LS handled wonderfully last winter when we had a 10" or so snowfall that just about closed down Kansas City. I was completely amazed. With "snow mode" and Blizzaks I blasted by a whole lot of 4-wheel drive SUV's struggling in the snow. It was fun to take curves a little too fast and watch the VSC kick in! The 2000 LS got around a lot better than our front wheel drive V6 Camry (with traction control but no snow tires). Of course I've always loved to drive in the snow and was a master of "hand brake turns" when I was young.

And Toby, my co-worker and participant in this forum, got to buy a really nice 1990 LS400 from someone he knows and trusts (just like I did when I bought my 00 LS) - at least I hope Toby still trusts me after driving the 90 to about 200,000 miles. And I get to "visit" the 90 LS almost every day.

Above all, guys, avoid debt. Focus on building net worth (which I conservatively define as "non-depreciating assets minus liabilities"). And if I start giving lectures on the effects of the increasing rate of economic globalization, we'll have to move this discussion to the General Topics area and/or I'll have to start charging a fee. ;)

[SW03ES]

What was the total cost, if you don't mind me asking? I think the salesman would have gone down to $33k on the one I looked at but it was CPO.

[1990LS400]

Steve, I paid $30,900 for my 2000 LS. I might have been able to get it for less but maintaining the long term relationships involved was more important. The LS had more options than what I asked my friend to find and was mostly on target with the specs (no Nav, no air suspension, white exterior, low miles, minimal flaws) that I gave him. I didn't particularly want the chrome wheels or the Nakamichi - I have to admit that audio sounds very nice - but I could have better integrated my Nokia phone kit using the integration cable I bought in U.K. if it had the standard or Nav audio.

I know my "speaches" on being financially conservative may be getting a little old. But I have seen some very highly paid people lose their jobs and businesses (and cars and houses) over the several years due to the economic downturn, outsourcing, and way too much personal debt.

[SW03ES]

Yeah thats a very good price in the market for that car even today. I definately agree with your advice about maintaining relationships, a lot of people try to wring every last dollar out of the dealership as opposed to treating them with respect and realizing that they need to make a living too. Anyone who says they hate buying a car is really making the situation unpleasant for themselves. Treat a car salesman with respect and reach a fair deal for both parties and you'll have an ally to help you purchase cars at a good price way down the line. The woman I bought my Lexus from and I had a great transaction and she even sends my car birthday cards lol.

Don't worry about the fiscal advice, keep it comin ;)