Service At Lexus, Toyota Or Other

[tmhtmh]

I'm new to the "luxury car" ownership thing and would like some feedback on where to have services performed. If we could keep this thread to the practical end I'd appreciate it. I could care less about the "relationship" aspect of car service. I want good service on my vehicle for a "fair" price.

Several of the things I wonder about are why not just use a cheap (Jiffy Lube, etc.) service for oil changes. No appointment, quick, an easy job requiring little expertise.

Same for tranny fluid replacement. Why have Lexus do it? Can't any decent mechanic do that perfectly fine and for much less? Local Toyotas dealer will service all non-warranty Lexus issues - isToyota a good choice for less?

Obviously, warrany work need to be done at the dealership.

What about non-dealership that specialize in luxury autos and imports? Anyone go that route? Maybe a bit more than jiffy lube, etc. but likely less than Lexus and good work, correct?

I'll be having my 60,000 mi. service on my "new" used 2002 RX300 soon and I want to "get it right". However, I don't want to have the simple part of that service (oil, tranny fluid, etc.) charged at outrageous rates. Any suggestions/

[RX in NC]

We've been down this road before. Do it yourself. Changing oil and transmission fluid really is a piece of cake. The biggest challenge is getting to the oil filter under the exhaust manifold. Once you have a good spring-loaded cap-type filter remover and your trusty socket wrench, you're good to go. Changing transmission fluid in this vehicle is so simple, even a cave man could do it (sorry, Geico)....

[tmhtmh]

Well, RX/NC, if I lived in NC I KNOW where I could get it done - your house. But being that I don't AND there are no cave-man shops around here, what do the rest of you think? Thanks for the input though.

PLEASE, no DIY vs. service shop arguements here, I have absolutely no intention of doing ANY fluid changing myself, nor will I do ANY "real" mechanical work. The most I'd do is replcae the AC air filter IF it's a simple snap-out/snap-in procedure. I also can fill the gas tank and the wiper fluid. That's about it. No interest/desire beyond that.

So, where do the rest of you go for service and WHY? Thanks

[tmastres]

To address the oil and trans fluid questions: those are the two main issues with RX's, oil sludge and trans failure. Assuming you're not a DIY guy you'll have a much easier time collecting warranty repairs if you've had oil and trans done by Lexus. My route has been to find a good import/japanese or even luxury Japanese specialist . I live in an area of about 140k people and we've got several that specialize in Lexus and Infinity only so they're definitely out there. They can perform most any warranty work as well.

You can use quick change places but their personnel change frequently and are usually of dubious knowledge and experience. In any case to avoid sludge I use Syn oil, which many quickie places dont offer so you'd need to buy it yourself and bring it with you and keep the receipts. If you have a good relatuonship ( :D with a quick change place and trust them it might be fine but I wouldnt do it.

Lastly I've had zero luck in getting my local Toyota dealer to service my Lexus. Even though the Lexus dealer is 30 miles away in a different city, they refuse. If you can do it great it'll be cheaper for sure.

Especially for the 60k, I'd avoid doing the dealer thing, there arent many big things done at 60k to make it at all worthwhile.

[lenore]

I agree look in the yellow pages and find a japanese foreign car service shop, call and find out if they do Lexus. Make sure the tranny fluid is Toyota Type IV.

[katzjamr]

I do have my commercial trucks serviced at Jiffy Lube. You would be amazed at how many bad things can happen at the quick change places. Two of the more notable things that happened to me were watching as one of their "technicians" drove my four month old ford pickup over the pit so that one wheel was completely hanging in the air, and listening to the lube guy in the pit say "oops" as he stripped the drain plug on a one year old explorer resulting in a two hour wait for management to verify that yes it was broken, tow to the dealer and two weeks for a new drain pan from ford. As a result of this experience i NEVER go into the waiting room while they service these trucks, i always stand and watch what they do from a safe distance. To this day they still only check the trans fluid level one out of four times without me reminding them. Since i use their synthetic blend, not the bulk crap that passes for oil at those places and change the oil every 3K in each vehicle their cheap oil filters dont seem to be a problem.

As other people have mentioned its important for warranty and the longevity of your vehicle to use toyota spec fluids and filters even if you dont go to the dealer. I understand that Lexus 60K service is twice as costly as say a toyota dealer doing it, ideally i would find a toyota dealer to do your work. Mine is also my first expensive (for me) SUV, and other than doing the work myself, i think skimping on the service is short sighted. Many toyota dealers have a quick lube service with minimal waiting. My lexus dealer is only twenty bucks more than a service at jiffy lube for synthetic blend oil, i think its worth it.

[scoobie]

Well, before you dismiss going to the Lexus dealer, why not get a quote from them, then get a quote from the Toyota dealer and compare. You can also get the quotes minus the oil change and trans fluid change if you trust Jiffy Lube for those jobs.

For me personally, I drive maybe 10000 miles a year, that amounts to 2 oil changes, if Lexus charges $80 for each oil change vs. $20 at Jiffy Lube, I'd save only $120 over a year. I'm not rich, but I won't sweat over $120 and look all over town for the absolute cheapest way to go.

While we're on the subject, an interesting comparison would be total maintenance cost for the entire warranty period (60000 miles), beginning with the first oil change at 5000 mi, and so on, up to the 60000 mi service. The difference in the estimates (Lexus vs. cheaper alternative) divided by 5 or 6 would be your typical savings per year. (Or, if you go with Lexus, then it would be the premium per year for Lexus service.)

[SW03ES]

Well, RX/NC, if I lived in NC I KNOW where I could get it done - your house. But being that I don't AND there are no cave-man shops around here, what do the rest of you think? Thanks for the input though.

Sorry, but that was intolerably rude. If you want people to help you around here, you need to check the 'tude at the door.

[tmhtmh]

Nope, you just must have taken it wrong. I was kidding around and did appreciate his help - just as I said. He's a DIYer, I'm not. That's perfectly cool with me (and him, I'd expect).

RX/NC, hope YOU didn't take it as a swipe at you - certainly not intended that way.

[wwest]

Bad news, really bad news.

Routine maintenance does require any level of skill.

So it doesn't matter where you go or how much you pay, it will be a McD "flipper" graduate doing the routine, scheduled, maintenance on your vehicle.

I'm not sure just what I would do were I not a DIYer.

On second thought...

My Porsche goes to a small but upscale and elite two man shop. Expensive for an oil change but no gofers about.

[LEXIRX330]

Bad news, really bad news.

Routine maintenance does require any level of skill.

So it doesn't matter where you go or how much you pay, it will be a McD "flipper" graduate doing the routine, scheduled, maintenance on your vehicle.

I'm not sure just what I would do were I not a DIYer.

On second thought...

My Porsche goes to a small but upscale and elite two man shop. Expensive for an oil change but no gofers about.

So let me get this right...You think that Jiffy Lube pays about the same as Lexus pays or any other dealership for that matter??? Same benefits??? Same promotions???

You have got to be kidding???

Why such a high turnover at J-Lube, Walmart, Grease monkey, and not at the dealerships? I guess they just like saying they work for Lexus right! Come on!

:whistles: :whistles: :whistles: :whistles: :whistles: :whistles:

[Booyah]

If you dont want to do anything yourself take it to a Lexus dealer and have them do the work! That way if anything goes wrong later, you know who did the work and can take it back to get it fixed....Plus you know it correctly done 99% if the time--no worries.

Taking it to these mom and pop shops can be Ok, Ill never trust anyone there--your just taking your chances and when they screw something up--where do you go, back to the Lexus dealer:)

[SW03ES]

Nope, you just must have taken it wrong. I was kidding around and did appreciate his help - just as I said. He's a DIYer, I'm not. That's perfectly cool with me (and him, I'd expect).

RX/NC, hope YOU didn't take it as a swipe at you - certainly not intended that way.

Smilies people! Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Routine maintenance does require any level of skill.

So it doesn't matter where you go or how much you pay, it will be a McD "flipper" graduate doing the routine, scheduled, maintenance on your vehicle.

So let me get this right...You think that Jiffy Lube pays about the same as Lexus pays or any other dealership for that matter??? Same benefits??? Same promotions???

You have got to be kidding???

He's right that some dealerships do employ people of the same caliber as Jiffy Lube to do things like oil changes. Lexus dealerships however do not (I don't believe Toyota does either). They do use techs of lesser expertise than they do on more complex repairs (obviously, having a master tech change oil would be like having a brain surgeon put a band aid on your boo-boo) but they're all Toyota and ASE certified techs. Jiffy Lube people are not.

[wwest]

Sorry, the ownership/management at a Lexus dealer values the bottom line just as much as their counter-parts at Jiffy Lube. Maybe even moreso given the cost associated with maintaining an upscale image. Next time your Lexus is in for just simple, routine maintenance of some kind find a way to observe who works on your car.

[lenore]

Well to add to this mess, I must remind everyone of the wonderful service Roseville Lexus gave me leaving the sway bar disconnected from the front suspension and rubbing on the brake lines. Oh and the Axle shaft that came out because they didn't install it properly, and oh by the way the hoses and electrical connectors that seem to never get hooked back up. Oh and the wonderful missing three bolts that hold the transmission to the engine block after a tranny change. And you call them any better than Jiffy lUbe.. Give me a break. Incompletence runs everywhere and the only good mechanics I have found are at some of the independent shops. On my other hand I can count the few good dealerships that I have gotten good service.

I have been wrenching cars since I was 12 and I am 56 now. Very few mechanics from my experience do good, safe work. Unfortunately I was not in that trade, but I would have been ten times better at it than a lot of the folks I have dealt with. Logic, and attention to detail make the difference.

[Topshelf]

Logic, and attention to detail make the difference.

Well let's all remember that most of these mechanics are being paid by the amount of time that the book says it should take to do the job. So if the book says it's a 2 hour job, and they get it done in 1 hour and 15 minutes, and then they get a 1 hour job done in that other 45 minute span, they just got paid for 3 hours of work while only doing 2. So speed is definitely the most important thing on these guys minds, which unfortunately puts our biggest concern at the bottem of their list. However, I don't care if it's a Kia dealership or a Lexus dealership, you're going to have both extremes here. Some will be a total money based, screw the customer stealership, while others will provide a good service with friendly people and good work. Sure, they are still money based, but some are just blatant about how much they don't care. Best bet is to ask around for people's experiences with your local shops. One thing people don't have a problem with is bad mouthing others. So it should be easy to find the ones to stay away from. But if you can find a small local import shop that has near spotless garage bays, a small amount of long time employees and a smart !Removed! old guy who knows everything, then you just found the best place to take your new pride and joy. ;)

[tmhtmh]

Well, thanks to all for the suggestions. Seems like there is no "right" answer on this. After reading what you all think and why, I think I see me going to the local Toyota Dealership for now (routine service) while I ask around for a while looking for a good independant import shop. Maybe I find one, maybe not. Meanwhile, maybe I really like the Toyota service and I'm all set.

I also have a new honda Odyssey, so if I could find one import shop to take care of both that would be great. However, that one is still under warranty so I may need to take it to Honda sometimes depending on the issue.

Thanks again for the advise.

[RX in NC]

tmhtmh and SW03ES,

Relax, guys - I appreciated the humor (although if you lived here in Raleigh, tmhtmh, there's no way I'm maintaining your vehicle for you - I already have to keep up with enough as it is and the LAST vehicle I would want to take on would be another freakin' RX. You apparently don't know how much I hate 'em).

Most of us who have decades of experience in maintaining our own vehicles will tell you that if you don't want to do it yourself, spend some time asking around town for a locally-owned independent shop that has a strong reputation and stays busy all the time. Shops like that develop a savvy and loyal customer base because their pricing structure is fair (though not cheap), they usually have technicians who have been employed there for years or decades (meaning that they have developed significant expertise in diagnosing and resolving a wide variety of problems), and the reason they have managed to earn such a respected reputation is that they prove over and over again to long-term customers as well as to new customers that they are damn good at what they do without the overhead of a fancy-schmancy Lexus service department. Don't kid yourself into believing that Lexus dealerships hire only top-notch techs - they wind up hiring a number of young guys who may only be a level or two above the typical DIY-in-the-driveway Joe, and they experience a hell of a lot more turnover than they care to admit. Our local dealership is ALWAYS looking for techs. Many of the inexperienced ones they hire with plans to grow and train them don't work out, so the faces change on a fairly regular basis. If you believe that you're ALWAYS getting the expertise that you're paying for at a dealership, you're going to be sadly disappointed sooner or later.

Different makes and models will lead you to different independent shops. You'll likely end up with one that specializes in Japanese vehicles, not just Lexus. I'm not sure how large a city Rochester is but I guarantee you that if you ask enough car folks and spend enough time looking around, you'll find one....

[backwoods lex]

That is exactly the reason why I try to do all of my car's maintenance myself. That is the only person you can truly trust with your vehicle.

[katzjamr]

I think that one of the key issues not to be overlooked in this discussion is that no matter who does your work if you are under warranty and have a problem that needs to be fixed, it gives the dealer a way out if they find non toyota spec fluids in your car. The Jiffy Lubes of the world (i have used them for a long time, the concept of quick lube grew out of a marketing study at the university of washington and made the professor a very rich man when he opened the pacific northwest ones under the name minit lube) by nature have to have a broad knowledge that is not very deep. Your dealer specializes in just your brand and is set up to service it. I also am beginning to really resent the 15 other services that the quick lube people want to perform on your car other than the basic lube oil filter. Of course, any dealer or shop needs to earn your business. Lastly to wwest (please dont ever stop posting) i do notice which technician services my car at the dealership. This place is small with only ten service bays so its easy to get close, the technician was at least 55 years old. It must have been a slow day a the dealer.

[SW03ES]

Sorry, the ownership/management at a Lexus dealer values the bottom line just as much as their counter-parts at Jiffy Lube. Maybe even moreso given the cost associated with maintaining an upscale image. Next time your Lexus is in for just simple, routine maintenance of some kind find a way to observe who works on your car.

I have, and the only people the three dealers I've used for service employ that aren't ASE and Toyota certified techs are the porters that move the cars around and the people that wash them. As picky as I am you don't think it would make sure who was going to be working on the car?

Certainly the master techs don't change oil, but everyone who works on the vehicles, at least at these three dealerships, are trained service techs.

[Copernicus]

Hi,

I think you should stick with the Lexus dealers because they provide good service, especially since they're knowledgeable about Lexus in general, or supposed to be. Of course, variations exist.

Here in Alaska, I'm charged $39.00 and back home in Florida, it was about $30 or so for a full change and everything, so it isn't that cheaper and they usually check everything out.

I'm not sure if you have any warranty with them, but it is usually in their best interest to check everything they do and maintain your vehicle in the best condition.

I usually have an extended warranty on my vehicles and they've always paid for themselves and whatever I didn't use for example, when I traded in early, they refunded me after prorating, so being that your warranty will be in effect, it is better for the dealer to maintain it well and do an excellent job, because they don't want to be paying to fix the results of substandard work and all work done is again warranteed by them.

For the relatively small increase in cost, the peace of mind is worth it, so I use the dealer exclusively. But if you're adept at doing it yourself or find a good place that can do a consistent good job, then go that way, but maintenance records and things like that will help in cases of resale and trades. I've always used that to retain top value when I trade in a vehicle. The trade-of in value and the DIY hassle and possible problems has to be weighed and considered.

[Macgyver]

I am a DIYer and couldn't see myself handing over 50 to 80 bux for something I can do in 15 minutes. However not everyone is a DIYer obviously. There are good and bad mechanics everywhere. Lexus has them both and the little mom and pop shops have them. Find a reputable mechanic with a company that will warranty their work. Pretty much common sense. In the summer months I won't touch my car b/c its too hot, so I go to jiffly lube for oil changes and I bring my syn oil. I also watch the entire process, because you never know what you might find them doing or not doing. For warranty work I would definately go to Lexus, but I will find out who is working on my car and personally speak to him. If I have a bad vibe for whatever reason for example he seems to be rushing me along or something I will let management know or possibly get my car to another dealership. Speaking to other mechanics to find out if a particular mechanic is something I do also. If I find that it is hard for the mechanics to edify the one in question that is pretty much a sign that he does a rush job. And that has personally worked for me in the past.

[Rhody401]

Hi,

I think you should stick with the Lexus dealers because they provide good service, especially since they're knowledgeable about Lexus in general, or supposed to be. Of course, variations exist.

Here in Alaska, I'm charged $39.00 and back home in Florida, it was about $30 or so for a full change and everything, so it isn't that cheaper and they usually check everything out.

Are you saying the Lexus dealer only charges $39 for the "5k" service routine? (change oil, rotate tires). Wow :) They charge $129.99 here for that same service, while the local toyota dealers do it for about $25 (and theyre factory trained to work on the same engine, with the same tolerances) I haven't tried the Toyota dealer yet, because of so many warrantee issues/flaws, but it sure sounds appealing. ONe thing you can't do with the regular Toyota dealers is the warrantee service.

Mike

[SW03ES]

No, I'm sure he just means an oil change only.