svarog Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 I want to change my air filter, 1995 ES300, I found these filters online http://look.auto-parts-wholesale.com/parts...=1-888-267-1846 They all cost a bit different, so what diference does it make, do some filter better then others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rx-Fan Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 Why not try a K&N performance filter. Here's a site that has the cheapest prices on them that I have ever found: http://www.performanceintl.com/ Part # 33-2052 for '95 Lexus ES300 = $45.26 with FREE shipping Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlmoreno911 Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 I want to change my air filter, 1995 ES300,I found these filters online http://look.auto-parts-wholesale.com/parts...=1-888-267-1846 They all cost a bit different, so what diference does it make, do some filter better then others? ← they actually perform differently...by perform differently I mean some let more air pass through than others also depending on the different material used some clog faster than others... K&N is washable and resuable pays for itself within a couple of years...they also let a hi flow of air through which in turn improves performance... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 I want to change my air filter, 1995 ES300,I found these filters online http://look.auto-parts-wholesale.com/parts...=1-888-267-1846 They all cost a bit different, so what diference does it make, do some filter better then others? ← they actually perform differently...by perform differently I mean some let more air pass through than others also depending on the different material used some clog faster than others... K&N is washable and resuable pays for itself within a couple of years...they also let a hi flow of air through which in turn improves performance... ← This has been discussed several times in thie group. While the K&N filter is washable and might save you a few bucks, the performance gains are going to be insignificant. More importantly, you run the risk of damaging your engine from inadequate filtration or dumping oil into your engine which will foul your plugs - and possibly your O2 filter. I'd suggest staying away. Get a good quality pleated filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyofOne Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 I want to change my air filter, 1995 ES300,I found these filters online http://look.auto-parts-wholesale.com/parts...=1-888-267-1846 They all cost a bit different, so what diference does it make, do some filter better then others? ← they actually perform differently...by perform differently I mean some let more air pass through than others also depending on the different material used some clog faster than others... K&N is washable and resuable pays for itself within a couple of years...they also let a hi flow of air through which in turn improves performance... ← This has been discussed several times in thie group. While the K&N filter is washable and might save you a few bucks, the performance gains are going to be insignificant. More importantly, you run the risk of damaging your engine from inadequate filtration or dumping oil into your engine which will foul your plugs - and possibly your O2 filter. I'd suggest staying away. Get a good quality pleated filter. ← ill only say one thing... 35+ years of filtration, i think they know what they are doing...that is all. (Click here) ok maybe ill say more. i have NEVER EVER heard of a K&N filter ever causing a problem with any engine...ever. you want to talk about inadequate filtration, those cone filters you put on the end are no good, but the panel fliters that sit in your stock airbox have EXCELLENT filtration capabilites, and the fact that you say the oil will get down in the intake, this is true, if you DOUSE the filter in it. you are only supposed to use a little bit. you would have to have the fliter literally dripping in oil when you put it in the airbox to have any ill effects. and even then it would only screw with the MAF... and inadequate filtration...its no wonder NASCAR uses these filters... granted you are entitiled to your opinion, and i can resppect that. the performance gains are insignificant, true enough, but it WILL NOT damage your engine if used, and installed properly. and that is a fact. and if someone cant install an average air filter correctly, they dont belong anywhere near a car... High Air Flow with Excellent Filtration Designed to Increase Horsepower and Acceleration Washable and Reusable Will NOT Void Vehicle Warranty Lasts up to 50,000 miles before cleaning is required depending on driving conditions 10 Year / Million Mile Limited Warranty Emissions Legal in all 50 US States. Economical, a K&N Air Filter Will Last the Life of Your Vehicle Works with Original Equipment Manufacturer Vehicle Electronics Environmentally Friendly, K&N Reusable Air Filters Reduce the Volume of Disposable Air Filters that end up in the Nation's Landfills We Take Air Filters Seriously - For over 30 years we’ve manufactured serious air filters completely unlike traditional disposable filters. Our air filter is designed to achieve high, virtually unrestricted air flow while maintaining filtration levels critical to ensure long engine life. The secret to our success lies in the unique characteristics of our filter medium that was originally developed by K&N all those years ago in the dust, sweat and tears of desert motocross racing. We just wanted to win races and stumbled on a cotton filtration technology destined to be great. Our high flow cotton gauze air filter is washable, reusable and built to last for the life of an engine. The filters consist of four to six sheets of cotton gauze layered between two sheets of aluminum wire mesh. This media is then pleated and oiled to enhance its filtering capabilities and overall performance. The result is an air filter that allows dramatically more air into an engine, is washable and reusable, and will protect your engine for the life of your vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyofOne Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 so svaroq, the short answer to your question, no the type/brand of air filter doesnt make that big of a difference, btu would you rather buy a fram over and over again, or a K&N and never have to worry about buying another filter?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckb Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 so svaroq, the short answer to your question, no the type/brand of air filter doesnt make that big of a difference, btu would you rather buy a fram over and over again, or a K&N and never have to worry about buying another filter?? ← K&N filters can be a pain in the !Removed! to oil PROPERLY. Too much oil=clogged effect, low air flow, sensors and intake tract get oily. Not enough oil=dirt gets by and damage engine not worth the nuisance for little to no gain in hp. Get a factory filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monarch Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 I want to change my air filter, 1995 ES300, I found these filters online ← What about the factory air filter? The reason Toyota / Lexus cars are so reliable and durable is because all the parts, filters and fluids that are used to create a Toyota / Lexus are built to superior standards of performance, design, materials and workmanship. On the other hand, if you did not buy a Lexus for reliability and durability, but for street racing or some other type of brute acceleration purpose, you may want to look at a K&N air filter. Go to an auto parts store and hold a K&N air filter up to a store light. You will be amazed at the thousands of little points of light you can see through the K&N - holes which assure maximum air flow - and holes which allow more dirt into the engine than a factory air filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKperformance Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 Army you should read all the other threads this has been asked and answered before. Any owner who has them says their is a minimal incerase in gas milage and no performance gains. Also their is one with a filtration expert on the boards with some very good veiws. Look after it and your fine,don;t want the head ache then just buy oem ones. Ford has been making cars for years does that mean it is a great product? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 This has been discussed several times in thie group. While the K&N filter is washable and might save you a few bucks, the performance gains are going to be insignificant. More importantly, you run the risk of damaging your engine from inadequate filtration or dumping oil into your engine which will foul your plugs - and possibly your O2 filter. I'd suggest staying away. Get a good quality pleated filter. ← ill only say one thing... 35+ years of filtration, i think they know what they are doing...that is all. (Click here) ok maybe ill say more. i have NEVER EVER heard of a K&N filter ever causing a problem with any engine...ever. you want to talk about inadequate filtration, those cone filters you put on the end are no good, but the panel fliters that sit in your stock airbox have EXCELLENT filtration capabilites, and the fact that you say the oil will get down in the intake, this is true, if you DOUSE the filter in it. you are only supposed to use a little bit. you would have to have the fliter literally dripping in oil when you put it in the airbox to have any ill effects. and even then it would only screw with the MAF... and inadequate filtration...its no wonder NASCAR uses these filters... granted you are entitiled to your opinion, and i can resppect that, but that had to be just about the strangest/most wrong thing i have ever seen on a car forum. the performance gains are insignificant, true enough, but it WILL NOT damage your engine if used, and installed properly. and that is a fact. and if someone cant install an average air filter correctly, they dont belong anywhere near a car... ← As you've pointed out in a different thread, these are not racing cars. What makes sense for a racing car doesn't necessarily make sense for a family car. Racing cars require every ounce of HP they can get. More importantly, racing car engines are rebuilt many times as frequently as a family car. Also, the mechanics working on a racing car have much more experience than the average Lexus owner. I've explained this before. I have a PhD in Chemistry and spent most of my career studying filtration. I'm not relying on a vendor's unsupported claims. The testing that you showed on the K&N site is not quite useless, but close. They're not measuring the right things. This type of filter requires very, very careful installation. A little bit too much oil and you can screw things up. A little bit too little and filtration stinks. But even when properly oiled, it's not as good a filter as a good pleated OEM filter. I'm glad that you've never seen an engine damaged by a K&N filter. That doesn't mean it can't happen. Furthermore, given your extreme bias toward the K&N product, I'm not so sure you'd notice even if there was engine damage. You'd probably blame it on something else. Bottom line is that my Lexus cost $34 K. All my years of filtration testing say that the K&N is not as good a filter as the standard filters. Not to mention that not a single car manufacturer makes the K&N standard. Why not? Obviously because they have to warrant the engine and they don't see the K&N as being adequate. I'll pay the $10 for a good air filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer008 Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 A good reply. People like you make me come back to this site. Testimonials are useless. Placebo/brain/faith/belief can be powerful. We are all guilty. Sound experiments and measurements are needed. Wrt air filters///I agree go for the 10$ one. They give the lowest Si. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svarog Posted October 22, 2004 Author Share Posted October 22, 2004 So general concensus is to go with original lexus es300 filter! Can I get that at dealer or buy somewhere online cheaper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 So general concensus is to go with original lexus es300 filter! Can I get that at dealer or buy somewhere online cheaper ← I wouldn't necessarily say that you have to stick with the Lexus filter. Just one that meets the same specs. For example, ask the Toyota dealer for the part number of the Camry filter from the same year and see if it's the same as the Lexus. Alternatively, if you can find a premium pleated filter that exceeds Lexus specs, it might be a good deal. Other than that, I can't help much - I just have the dealer do all my work. For me, the convenience is worth the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyofOne Posted October 22, 2004 Share Posted October 22, 2004 As you've pointed out in a different thread, these are not racing cars. What makes sense for a racing car doesn't necessarily make sense for a family car. Racing cars require every ounce of HP they can get. More importantly, racing car engines are rebuilt many times as frequently as a family car. Also, the mechanics working on a racing car have much more experience than the average Lexus owner. i know that, my dad and i race his charger frequently, however this particular car does not require a reubild every five races, nascars do require them every 500 miles, so i see your point. I've explained this before. I have a PhD in Chemistry and spent most of my career studying filtration. I'm not relying on a vendor's unsupported claims. :) cool The testing that you showed on the K&N site is not quite useless, but close. They're not measuring the right things. i will research this a little bit more, but i dont see how they could make filters for over 35 years and not know what the hell they are doing...im sorry. This type of filter requires very, very careful installation. A little bit too much oil and you can screw things up. A little bit too little and filtration stinks. not arguing that, you are correct. but even when properly oiled, it's not as good a filter as a good pleated OEM filter. i dont believe that, i dont care how much education you have, i refuse to believe that one without proof. it is in many ways as good or a better filter than a paper filter...depends on the application. call me hard headed, or set in my ways. I'm glad that you've never seen an engine damaged by a K&N filter. That doesn't mean it can't happen. you are right, that doesnt mean it cant happen, but i have been around cars and engines my whole life, and am practically an expert on certian ford and mopar cars...20 years of K&N and bnever seen a problem. Furthermore, given your extreme bias toward the K&N product, I'm not so sure you'd notice even if there was engine damage. You'd probably blame it on something else. that smarts man...i cant believe you said that. that offends me. im not going to ignore the facts, but i know what i know. i have been around engines long enough to know how to troubleshoot and diagnose them properly. dammit i sure as hell would tell someone if the filter caused damage to their engine. and i sure as hell would admit if it caused damage to mine. dont jab at me like that again please. that was completely uncalled for. <_< Bottom line is that my Lexus cost $34 K. All my years of filtration testing say that the K&N is not as good a filter as the standard filters. Not to mention that not a single car manufacturer makes the K&N standard. Why not? Obviously because they have to warrant the engine and they don't see the K&N as being adequate. I'll pay the $10 for a good air filter. again, thats your right. im done here, my opiniopn has been stated. i apologize for being pushy to jragosta, my fault. i was simply trying to make a point, i did it in the wrong way. i edited the post. i dont want to be in this thread cause im not here to make enemies...but i dont feel like being insulted or made to feel infreior, so im out of this thread. problem solved. B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 but even when properly oiled, it's not as good a filter as a good pleated OEM filter. i dont believe that, i dont care how much education you have, i refuse to believe that one without proof. it is in many ways as good or a better filter than a paper filter...depends on the application. call me hard headed, or set in my ways. I'm glad that you've never seen an engine damaged by a K&N filter. That doesn't mean it can't happen. you are right, that doesnt mean it cant happen, but i have been around cars and engines my whole life, and am practically an expert on certian ford and mopar cars...20 years of K&N and bnever seen a problem. Furthermore, given your extreme bias toward the K&N product, I'm not so sure you'd notice even if there was engine damage. You'd probably blame it on something else. that smarts man...i cant believe you said that. that offends me. im not going to ignore the facts, but i know what i know. i have been around engines long enough to know how to troubleshoot and diagnose them properly. dammit i sure as hell would tell someone if the filter caused damage to their engine. and i sure as hell would admit if it caused damage to mine. dont jab at me like that again please. that was completely uncalled for. <_< ← You're acting all offended, but you're doing exactly what I said. I've pointed out that from a scientific perspective these filters are inferior. In a different thread, I explained exactly why. But you don't want to believe that, so you'll ignore all the scientific information in order to feed your bias. That's EXACTLY what I said you were doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monarch Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 Sound experiments and measurements are needed. ← There's more to it than that. Although slick willy aftermarket parts salesmen may present lab test that prove aftermarket air filters filter air as well or better than a factory filter, in actual use the aftermarket filter may still allow alot more dirt into the engine: http://www.saber.net/~monarch/fram.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyofOne Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 i found it. according to the data, you are correct...i apologize for being an !Removed!...but why then, for so many years, has the wool been pulled over peoples eyes? after doing a google search too, theres soem pretty compelling evidence as well. i still stick with my desicion to use them because i knwo how to use them, but anyone who doesnt car should just get a normal filter, because if you do it wrong, it could cause issues. i never knew this. thanks for the info jragosta, i dont knwo what got into me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKperformance Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 Told you their was an expert on filtration. And the same conclusion ,if you have toime to waste looking after it to keep it at peek filtration ,then use it, otherwise the OEM is easiest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 i found it. according to the data, you are correct...i apologize for being an !Removed!...but why then, for so many years, has the wool been pulled over peoples eyes? after doing a google search too, theres soem pretty compelling evidence as well. i still stick with my desicion to use them because i knwo how to use them, but anyone who doesnt car should just get a normal filter, because if you do it wrong, it could cause issues. i never knew this.thanks for the info jragosta, i dont knwo what got into me... ← The bottom line is that 'caveat emptor' is ALWAYS a good policy. And in the case of K&N it's only partially pulling the wool over people's eyes. Their filter is probably a fine filter for race cars or for enthusiasts who like to tweak their cars and understand the risks involved. The only problem is that people take that and reach the conclusion that it's a good general purpose filter - which it isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviej Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 The bottom line is that 'caveat emptor' is ALWAYS a good policy. ← for those that didn't take latin in school. caveat emptor = Buyer Beware!!!!! steviej Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKperformance Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 ahhh lol I only took latin / greek in medial traning. Like i remember that well. But i would hope in medicine they wouldn;t say buyer beware. lmao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 The bottom line is that 'caveat emptor' is ALWAYS a good policy. ← for those that didn't take latin in school. caveat emptor = Buyer Beware!!!!! steviej ← Sorry. caveat emptor = 'Let the buyer beware' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senna4ever Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 But i would hope in medicine they wouldn;t say buyer beware.lmao I was always afraid of surgeons who uttered the word, "Oops". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tundra-lover Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 It's not very fair to jump all over K&N filters, when Toyota Racing Development (TRD) as well as many other manufactures make re-usable/washable free-flow filters. I agree that they would allow more air and contaminants in, but not enough to have Toyota pull their TRD filters off the market. For those of us who change our oil frequently, it shouldn't be a problem (no, I do not have my phD in filter technology). However, many of the off-road racers use a pre-filter with the cone style filter to prevent contaminants from building up or clogging the filter. This may be a good option for daily drivers to use if they want the use of the washable filter, and added protection. For the average commuter car, a three horse power difference may not be worth it? It's up to them to decide. For high-performance; A lot of the new intake systems for Turbo and Supercharged applications only offer reusable style filters. TRD superchargers do allow the use of the factory air box, but most I've seen are running the TRD reusable filter. Anyway, this topic is old and I for one am tired of hearing it every few months. There will always be some sort of extreme idea for each side of the filtration argument. If we all listened to what people told us not to do, they we might not do anything at all. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jragosta Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 It's not very fair to jump all over K&N filters, when Toyota Racing Development (TRD) as well as many other manufactures make re-usable/washable free-flow filters. I agree that they would allow more air and contaminants in, but not enough to have Toyota pull their TRD filters off the market. For those of us who change our oil frequently, it shouldn't be a problem (no, I do not have my phD in filter technology). However, many of the off-road racers use a pre-filter with the cone style filter to prevent contaminants from building up or clogging the filter. This may be a good option for daily drivers to use if they want the use of the washable filter, and added protection.For the average commuter car, a three horse power difference may not be worth it? It's up to them to decide. For high-performance; A lot of the new intake systems for Turbo and Supercharged applications only offer reusable style filters. TRD superchargers do allow the use of the factory air box, but most I've seen are running the TRD reusable filter. Anyway, this topic is old and I for one am tired of hearing it every few months. There will always be some sort of extreme idea for each side of the filtration argument. If we all listened to what people told us not to do, they we might not do anything at all. ;) ← That's exactly what I've been saying all along. There's nothing wrong with these filters for professional / racing use. But for the average commuter, they're a very, very bad choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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