Hites Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 not 300Whp, just 300hp out of a 92 sc4. would exhaust, headers, and bfi do it? what about adding an eram (www.electricsupercharger.com) into the equation? lextreme.com has a desktop dyno example that shows a 40hp gain with just headers; any truth behind this?
bean_8044 Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 Its very possible depending on how restrictive the stock headers are. For the 2nd gen? DSMs they get over 100hp with mild exhaust and intake mods. Youre already at 270 or 280 right? Headers and a good cat back or full system exhaust should put you up there along with an aftermarket intake or BFI. I wouldnt trust an electric fan in the intake either. It may work, but it doesnt seem like its worth it. You could also see some good gains from the S-AFC fuel controller. Ive been very pleased with mine and i get 50km more per tank (500 from 450). You can get that less than the electric supercharger too.
southernsc300 Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 dont get that supercharger, thats a joke. headers, full exhaust, BFI, k&n filter should put you up to 300. also make sure you have done a tune up on ur car, changing your fluids, sparkplugs, wires. stuff like that will help out
AWJ Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 What you guys are recommending will increase flow and enhance performance. As far as it bumping up to 300 ponies - I'll believe it when I see a dyno plot. I have a hard time believing it will move it that far. I think the 1uz in the 92 SC is rated at 240 or so crank hp. That might mean 200 at the wheels optimistically.
Hites Posted March 29, 2004 Author Posted March 29, 2004 were any performance gains seen by leaning out the af ratio with the safc? im assuming you used the apexi safc, correct? what makes you say that electric supercharger is a joke? there are many dyno plots on the website varying from many different cars such as dodge dakotas, 911's, m3's, and mr2 turbos that show average gains of 6% (15hp in sc4 terms). did you even go to the website? it isnt one of those *BLEEP*ty ebay scam fan-thingies. the 92 sc4 is rated at 250; at least thats what every automotive fact-based website ive ever visited says.
AWJ Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 Ok 250. Sorry. Drive line loss still puts it way below that number. Not trying to harp on the idea. It is a good thing to do. I'd give props to any SC4 with full headers and exhaust. Slap a 100 shot of juice on top of it. That will put butterflies in the tummy. It is typically a bad idea to put any restriction in a balanced system though. I personally highly doubt that the electric super charger thing is going to benefit the system. I would think that it would hinder flow. If one would like to try it, by all means, go for it. I'll give it a closer look tomorrow.
jzz30 Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 wellif anyone is willing to spend the money blueprinting the motor should give some power along with a full balancing of the crank and pistons, but i doubt the crank and pistons are that far off balance. cams anyone? does anyone make?
Sadistic Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 I just have a few things to say.. After working at a DSM shop for about a year, and owning a dsm for 3. That 100hp claim from intake and exhaust mods, is a complete and utter fabrication. You could only get that from a complete re-work of the entire intake and exhaust system. From Filter to tail pipe. And that would take thousands. Not saying you're full of it or anything, bean. Just that I think someone exaggerated some numbers some where. Speaking in real world tems. Evo exhaust manifold and 02 housing, 2.5" exhaust back, clipping the turbo, boost controller, and some sort of intake system with all the free mods, would probably net you a good 50 hp at best. This is on a 1st gen mind you. 2nd gen heads flow much worse, so I think the numbers would be even less. To get to the 100 hp mark you would have to up the fuel system, so you could run enough boost to reach that number. From what I've heard those Electric Superchargers work like nitrous. You only get a certain amount of time under boost, and then it has to charge.. Of course I have never seen one, riden in a car with one or want to. Just going by an article that I remember reading.
JPI Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 That supercharger is really a joke! Do we remember that tornado device? This is one of those too. Remember this, it takes four factors for the car to run: compression, fuel, spark and air. Having more air doesn't do any good if there is no fuel. More air and more fuel equal a bigger bang. Bigger bang will equal more horsepower. If in doubt, please buy "Maximum Boost" by Corky Bell. It's a great book. It explaint about forced induction(turbo). Bolts on won't get you 300hp. Put a 100 shot of nitrous in the car isn't bad idea. Install it properly and tune it too, nitrous doesn't like lean condition. Blueprinting your engine won't make it goes faster, but it will prevent your engine from coming apart at higher rpm...say 10k. JPI
mikee72 Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 As a 1G DSM owner for 7+ years, I'll second that call about DSM's and 100 HP gain just from intake and exhaust. Expect 30-40 HP from a full 3" exhaust without touching boost. There's little to be gained by messing with the intake track (with the exception of a FMIC) without raising boost, and raising boost requires more fuel, and some way to control it. Most of the big HP gains floating around come from people running race gas, but who can afford to run race gas on the street every day? Adding 100 HP on pump gas isn't going to be that cheap, but certainly cheap compared to most other cars.
Sadistic Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 Well if you put a full 3 " on your stock turbo, you wouldn't have to touch boost because it would creep until it blew up ;) hahaha
AWJ Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 Damn. You guys make me proud. The only way to make more power is to increase compression or displacement. Maximum Boost - hell yea JPI. I read that book two years ago when I was buying parts for my 1993. Then I read it again last year when I bought my 1995 on the airplane flight going to look at it. I'll probably read it again. And reference it for the rest of my life. I always recommend that book to anyone who asks me anything about forced induction. Someone recommended it to me way back. I'm just returning the favor.
southernsc300 Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 i just realized it was a 92. for some reason i thought it was 97+
alicias Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 what will a torque converter do? i saw rod millen on tv last week so i thought i'd take a look at his products. that was one of them - a torque converter. i've heard of mods from bfi to exhaust and chips and all of that - but this is the first i've heard on torque converters.
AWJ Posted March 29, 2004 Posted March 29, 2004 A reworked torque converter or stall converter will free up some of the loss throught the drive train. This is at the expense of smooth shifting and it will heat the tranny up. You should get an external tranny cooler and bypass the oem auto tranny cooler in order to preserve the transmission if one of these is chosen. It will probably give the most feel of more power aside from nitrous or forced induction.
Hites Posted March 29, 2004 Author Posted March 29, 2004 cams anyone? does anyone make? thats what i would really like after the basic bolt ons, but no company will even make custom cams for the sc4 since it has a frickin gear in the middle of each camshaft :(.
Hites Posted March 29, 2004 Author Posted March 29, 2004 From what I've heard those Electric Superchargers work like nitrous. You only get a certain amount of time under boost, and then it has to charge.. Of course I have never seen one, riden in a car with one or want to. Just going by an article that I remember reading. the electric supercharger i linked only comes on at wot and taps into the battery instead of the alternator. it never needs to be recharged. you fellers should really read everything on the site; i thought that it was just another ebay hunk of *BLEEP* until i read virtually everything on their site. after comparing the ebay ones to the one i linked, i noticed that the one i linked pushes 3 times as much air as the ebay ones. heck, heres some vids that are on their site: http://www.electricsupercharger.com/eRAMvideo.mpg http://www.electricsupercharger.com/eRAM%2...g%20explode.mpg
Hites Posted March 29, 2004 Author Posted March 29, 2004 That supercharger is really a joke! Do we remember that tornado device? This is one of those too. Remember this, it takes four factors for the car to run: compression, fuel, spark and air. Having more air doesn't do any good if there is no fuel. More air and more fuel equal a bigger bang. Bigger bang will equal more horsepower. If in doubt, please buy "Maximum Boost" by Corky Bell. It's a great book. It explaint about forced induction(turbo). Bolts on won't get you 300hp. Put a 100 shot of nitrous in the car isn't bad idea. Install it properly and tune it too, nitrous doesn't like lean condition. Blueprinting your engine won't make it goes faster, but it will prevent your engine from coming apart at higher rpm...say 10k. JPI the 1 psi of boost that the eram makes would actually make the af ratio closer to being the ideal 1:14.7, since almost everybody who owns an sc4 knows that the 1uzfe runs rich at wot.
AWJ Posted March 30, 2004 Posted March 30, 2004 Like I said, it only comes online at wide open throttle. Any other time, it is still stuck in the intake tract. This is an obvious restriction and no good.
jzz30 Posted March 30, 2004 Posted March 30, 2004 hey hites i found a company in japan caled C's makes a 250 degree cam kit (with the gear in the middle ) but it costs a whooping $3400 they also makes a stroker and bore up kit but its another $25,000 costing more than the car a few times over
AWJ Posted March 30, 2004 Posted March 30, 2004 Crane cams would probably do a regrind if you tell them what duration and lift you want. Maybe they can only effect duration. Not sure on that cam stuff. Cam's are just a part of the equation though. They are part of a total package. Just changing the cams is not going to net any significant gain.
Sadistic Posted March 30, 2004 Posted March 30, 2004 Yeah, installing cams on your car would also require supporting mods for the cams. Because you're changing the duration and lift of the cam, you need more fuel, more air, and more exhaust. And even then I don't think a cam on an n/a motor is going to give you a ton of power. That all depends on the duration/lift of the stock cam. And what you choose to go with.
Lex Luthor Posted March 30, 2004 Posted March 30, 2004 Brian at Crower could also probably regrind the cams. I would do that, sleeve the block and use a 4.7 Tundra crank, and a pair of internally gated T25's down near the oil pan at the sides of the block.... :) . Now that's a fun coupe. Seriously, short of forced induction, juice, or increased displacement...there's not much to be gained on the eight, the intake/exhaust/ignition/valvetrain/mgt are very well engineered from the factory.
Hites Posted March 31, 2004 Author Posted March 31, 2004 the intake/exhaust/ignition/valvetrain/mgt are very well engineered from the factory. if the intake is very well engineered, then why do people report such great gains from doing the bfi? you have to be on crack to think the exhaust system is very well engineered. the damn thing is press bent, has pipes pressed together to merge them into a single pipe, and the manifold is absolute crap with one pipe coming in at a 90 degree angle. every thing else is quite well, though.
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