Saw The Ls460...finally

[Rx330driver]

lol

[SW03ES]

Everybody gets too worked up over this whole "the car looks like this other car" BS, cars are basically the same shape, there's only so many variations on a theme.

[lexuus]

i think ive mentioned that this car will likely be my next car if nothing changes. im just saying that its too plain, but other parts of the car make up for it. One little flaw (IMO) does not change the way i look at the car. It still a great car. Its just not perfect

i dont want to sound like i hate the car, im just pointing on that dash is nice, but not really that special. Like Mercs, all their models have different looks, and so far, their flagship is the only car with the new Command controller. However, ALL lexus cars have those same buttons on the dash and perhaps some people like the simiplicity, but im just saying i could go for something more interesting.

just let the man share his opinion. hes not trying to convince u that the interior is bland hes just stating his thoughts.

also for the whole camry v. ls thing, those who care enough about cars probably will be able to tell the difference between the two, but i mean as long as its not 80% identical who cares?

[bartkat]

Good grief.

It's L Finesse guys. Why shouldn't a line of cars have some family resemblence? First the GS, then the Is, then the ES and now the LS. If one can't tell the differences though, after at least looking at the cars and watching some drive by, and even driving them, then perhaps one should be driving one of the many lesser automobiles out there and acting so disappointed. :chairshot:

[SW03ES]

just let the man share his opinion. hes not trying to convince u that the interior is bland hes just stating his thoughts.

I'm not stopping him from sharing his opinion, I'm simply discussing it with him. Why dont you do me a favor let me share my opinion also. Stay out of things that don't involve you, Rx and I know each other and as you can see by our laugh over my last comment everything here is light hearted.

[Rx330driver]

sometimes its just healthy to have these discussions!

barkat, i dont think were talking about the outside of the cars, but the inside.

[RFeldes]

A review by Fortune senior Editor...http://www.cnn.com/2006/AUTOS/12/01/lexus_review.fsb/index.html

[bartkat]

sometimes its just healthy to have these discussions!

barkat, i dont think were talking about the outside of the cars, but the inside.

See post #21.

BTW, I'm talking about the whole car.

[lexuus]

just let the man share his opinion. hes not trying to convince u that the interior is bland hes just stating his thoughts.

I'm not stopping him from sharing his opinion, I'm simply discussing it with him. Why dont you do me a favor let me share my opinion also. Stay out of things that don't involve you, Rx and I know each other and as you can see by our laugh over my last comment everything here is light hearted.

was my post ever directed towards you individually? i believe it wasnt so im not quite sure why your last post is directed individually to me.

[SW03ES]

sometimes its just healthy to have these discussions!

And enjoyable. After all its why we're all here. You're a PITA sometimes, but I am too LOL

was my post ever directed towards you individually? i believe it wasnt so im not quite sure why your last post is directed individually to me.

Right. I must have been mistaken then, silly me.

[Rx330driver]

sometimes its just healthy to have these discussions!

barkat, i dont think were talking about the outside of the cars, but the inside.

See post #21.

BTW, I'm talking about the whole car.

!!!! an apology is in order...my mind was screwed up

i read your post wrong

[lexuus]

hopefully ur not trying to be sarcastic with text, it doesnt work and im sure u know that.

[SW03ES]

hopefully ur not trying to be sarcastic with text, it doesnt work and im sure u know that.

I think we've both done a pretty good job of it here.

[jainla]

REEEErrrrrr....."Bowl of milk, table four.....":chairshot:

Anyway back on topic i think I understand what RX is getting at. BMW and MB, love them or hate them have a certain *it* factor. Part of that is the decades of history that both brands have in the marketplace; and also the willingness to rebel against that history.

The Germans currently are moving very aggressively towards the ultra modern design language that they think will lure younger buyers. The recent S and 7 series cars have been dramatically different from past versions, and people seem to either love it (S, although the current car looks a little riced out for my taste) or hate it (poor 7 series and it's Bangle butt). Either way you can't ignore them. It's a risk but brands have to evolve to remain current. Just ask Jaguar.

Lexus doesn't have that *it* factor---yet. Until recently the Lexus cars were sold as Toyotas in Japan and I think their exterior styling suffered a bit so they could have that 'Toyota Family' look. Only recently has Lexus been formed as a separate group inside Toyota with it's own stylists and engineers. While I'm sure many technical parts will continue to be shared with Toyota, Lexus is creating its own identity beyond merely being a marketing organization to becoming a more separate division and a worldwide brand.

L-Finesse is the first step in making Lexus cars stylistically and asthetically different from Toyotas. I think as time moves on the brand identity will become more fully formed; and Lexus will feel confident enough to take styling risks like the Germans do.

The same extends to the interior as well-- MB and BMW used to have more normal, conservative interiors but now not so much. I admit I was very taken with the idea of iDrive, until I actually tried to use it. But even if it bombs it gives BMW something distinctive in the marketplace. Too bad MB took Comand the same way; the controller is smaller and I think harder to use but the menus are simpler.

Lexus chose to eschew this rush to modernity and avantgarde design with a more conservative approach; so there may be less zing in the interior but after sitting in both of its competitors it's really the car I'd rather live with on a day to day basis. And I don't care what anybody says MB interiors have been on a steady downward spiral since the accountants took over circa 1995.

I do wish there was some more common elements between all the L finesse cars; but the LS I think looks much better in person than in certain photographs....

[SuperCoupe400]

I too believe that Lexus will someday grow some balls and start creating their very own own design cues - as they did with the SC and IS.

Though I must say that in the earlier years I felt their approach to interiors, both with materials and controls, was too understated and conservative. I know that many buyers prefered this approach, as I'm certain many of you do. However, I have always loved gadgets. The more buttons to push, the bigger the grin on my face. :D I could care less about dumbed-down simplicity where one knob performs 20 different functions - make the cockpit LOOK like that of an $80k car! Not that of a point-a-to-point-b Datsun And on the LS460 I think they've pretty much satisfied my lust for buttons, lights and switches.

[SuperCoupe400]

Anybody that thinks the Camry looks like the LS460 hasn't seen an LS460 in person lol.

It'll grow on you, I was unsure at first but its grown on me greatly.

SW03ES, I see your point here. Really I do. I think when you're so close to the action it's hard to take a step back and see the big picture. It really is quite easy to tell the two apart - when you live and breath Lexus. But to an outsider...or heck, even an insider who happens to drive another model, these things can begin to blend together real quickly with barely legible seams in between.

Case in point: With the exception of all you antique and collectible auto enthusiasts, who among you can REALLY tell the difference between a 1920 Oldsmobile 37A and a 1922 47 if you saw them both drive by you on the road? As far as I'm concerned, just about ALL of those pre-historic cars look alike - Ford, Olds, Buick, etc. But to someone who pours over these cars an oval shaped tail lense in the following year's production model versus a round one the previous year makes all the difference in the world, and thus classifies it as a whole new animal. And for most folk, that's just not enough to create a distinction.

[SW03ES]

SW03ES, I see your point here. Really I do. I think when you're so close to the action it's hard to take a step back and see the big picture. It really is quite easy to tell the two apart - when you live and breath Lexus. But to an outsider...or heck, even an insider who happens to drive another model, these things can begin to blend together real quickly with barely legible seams in between.

But the same is true of BMWs and Toyotas, people who have no concept about cars confuse the two of those too. Or they think Kia Amantis are Benzes...

[SuperCoupe400]

SW03ES, I see your point here. Really I do. I think when you're so close to the action it's hard to take a step back and see the big picture. It really is quite easy to tell the two apart - when you live and breath Lexus. But to an outsider...or heck, even an insider who happens to drive another model, these things can begin to blend together real quickly with barely legible seams in between.

But the same is true of BMWs and Toyotas, people who have no concept about cars confuse the two of those too. Or they think Kia Amantis are Benzes...

Touche, SW, touche indeed.

You're right on the money there. Especially with the BMWs. Heck, if I weren't really into cars like I am, i'd probably be no better than my wife is about spotting a 323i over a 318i. You just about had me rollin' with your Kia Amanti slam. Though that car is definately dealing with much more than a Benzo complex. It's got a little Jag thrown in (headlites), and pinch of Bentley Arnage T (tail lenses & general rear styling), and a dash of Benz / Chrysler 300 (grill) for flavor. What a Frankenstien! {but it actually doesn't look half bad, imho}

[jainla]

make the cockpit LOOK like that of an $80k car! Not that of a point-a-to-point-b Datsun And on the LS460 I think they've pretty much satisfied my lust for buttons, lights and switches.

LOL--Just like computers that aren't computers without blinky lights.

I agree; you could probably own a BMW or MB with iDrive and never find half the features buried inside the menus...occasionally I want a persistent display of what's playing on the stereo but otherwise i think Lexus has made the right choices as to what gets its own button and what goes on the touch screen.

The LS460 without the touchscreen...now THATS a lot of buttons!!!

But the same is true of BMWs and Toyotas, people who have no concept about cars confuse the two of those too. Or they think Kia Amantis are Benzes...

I think it's just the tyranny of the windtunnel these days; sometimes I feel like the previous Honda Accord and previous BMW 5 series were kissing cousins...

[hvaughan]

Well, as the ex-owner of three MB's, I can tell you that it's great not to take my 2002 LS 430 to the shop every month. In fact the car is 5 years old has has been in the shop once- to replace the trunk release. That's worth a lot to me.

[SuperCoupe400]

Well, as the ex-owner of three MB's, I can tell you that it's great not to take my 2002 LS 430 to the shop every month. In fact the car is 5 years old has has been in the shop once- to replace the trunk release. That's worth a lot to me.

Preach on, hvaughan. Preach on! :D

Reliability is one trait that will NEVER go out of style. It feels good driving the #1 auto, doesn't it?

I happen to work at Ford (dealership design and 3D illustration) and I don't mind one bit driving my SC in to work everyday. I don't do it to purposely thumb my nose in their faces, but I can't help it if our engineers and top brass haven't gotten their act together well enough to compete with the likes of Lexus.

[nc211]

Well I've finally seen the 460 in person. There was a light blue one in the parking lot of the hotel in Newport Beach this past weekend, and next to it was a 05 or 06 white 430. I've got to say...I liked the 430 better. The 460 was the L version, and something about it just didn't jump up at me. I don't know why, except maybe as I've stated before, a lot of Toyota's are starting to look similiar I guess? I just felt like the 430 looked a bit more "mature". No doubt the 460 was nice! And I spent probably 30 minutes looking at both cars. But my verdict is still on the 430. Of course, my decision could be bias due to the fact that it will take me 6 years to afford the 2007 460, as where the 02 430's are starting to come into range.

[SuperCoupe400]

Well I've finally seen the 460 in person...I liked the 430 better... a lot of Toyota's are starting to look similiar...the 430 looked a bit more "mature"...Of course, my decision could be bias due to the fact that it will take me 6 years to afford the 2007 460, as where the 02 430's are starting to come into range.

Nicely put nc211. I second that. I'd also never be able to afford a brand new (or even 1 or 2 year old) LS. And I fell completely in love with the 430 two years ago at the autoshow.

I've been seing a lot of IS's in the past few days and now I'm not even sure which one favors the Camry more, the IS or the LS460?

I said it before, and I'll say it again. This LS460 still seems to me like big brother imitating little brother(Camry) - not cool...Not cool at all. <_<