jcrome04 Posted January 21, 2008 Posted January 21, 2008 So I had my 97 LS checked out at the local dealership, they said the carbon canister was full of gas which was causing raw fuel to drain out of it, and was sending gas back into my engine instead of the vapor, which would cause my car to die... He said it was from overfilling the gas tank. I have always topped off my tank, never to the point where it spilled out though, but is this even possible??? After top off after top off had it finally started to spill out of the carbon canister??? It never did anything like this until I had my fuel filter replaced. Any help??? pu pu pu pleeeeeease :cries:
eatingupblacktop Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 You mentioned that you had fuel leaking right after changing the filter. How much was in the tank then?
jcrome04 Posted January 22, 2008 Author Posted January 22, 2008 I ran it practically dry before he changed the filter. For some reason he thought it was behind the tank so he wanted me to come back when it was near completely empty...
4.0 LS TECH Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 Yeah thats where it's coming from is the charcoal canister!! He mistakingly loosened one of the banjo fittings on the return line cause he thought it was the filter, then re-tightened it as soon as he realized it wasn't the filter! Maybe when he said he loosened the banjo fitting, he actually took it all the way off. then when realising it was wrong, he put it back together with out one of the washers in place. I made the same mistake on my bosses ls400 when i did an engine in it. loosened one of the banjo fittings on a fuel rail, and when i put it back together i didnt realise that while threading the bolt in i lost the washer. though it was tight and looked normal at glance, it poured fuel out real fast when the key was in the on position. later on close inspection i noticed the missing washer. but even then it didnt look like it would leak out that much. but now youve taken it to the dealer. the tech may have looked at it, and laughed seeing it missing a washer. and then decided to just sell you a whole canister. just a thought, it might actually need the canister. also question direction of flow of the filter. backwards filter possibly causing the fuel to back up into the canister or else where?
eatingupblacktop Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 I ran it practically dry before he changed the filter. For some reason he thought it was behind the tank so he wanted me to come back when it was near completely empty... So let me make sure I've got this right. Your tank was nearly empty when it started leaking?
jcrome04 Posted January 22, 2008 Author Posted January 22, 2008 Ok the TANK itself has never leaked, it's leaking out of the CARBON CANISTER. Would the washer missing from that banjo fitting make fuel backup into the carbon canister? Or are you talking about fuel leaking from where the fitting is? And yes the tank was nearly empty when fuel started spilling out if the carbon canister. Since my car is at the dealership I can't snap a pic so I used my artistic skill to make a paint creation of the fuel filter. B) There are NO leaks ANYWHERE near or on the gas tank. It's all coming out of the carbon canister. Aparently it's "full" of raw fuel. The gentleman at the dealership told me it's from constantly overfilling the tank, thinking about that I remember kind of smelling a gas smell after filling my tank a couple of times but nothing too dramatic. However I had ZERO problems until this guy messed with my tank, then replaced my fuel filter. Thankfully he has offered to take care of the expenses. I wonder if he knows the carbon canister is $386.90 installed, and they already want $140 for diagnostics!
steve2006 Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 I am a bit confused here are we refering to the fuel filter behind the rear wheel arch or the fuel purge canister located in the engine bay?
jcrome04 Posted January 22, 2008 Author Posted January 22, 2008 BOTH! hahah. We're trying to figure out if the fuel filter was backwards, causing fuel to backup into the carbon canister and spillout through there. Instead of the CC returning vapors to re-burn in my engine it was sending raw fuel back into the engine causing it to bog down and die after a bit of driving.
Leadfoot Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 so I used my artistic skill to make a paint creation of the fuel filter. B) There are NO leaks ANYWHERE near or on the gas tank. It's all coming out of the carbon canister. Aparently it's "full" of raw fuel. Nice job on the artwork, I want to understand the stock circuits first, can anyone confirm if the fuel filters have a one way valve. I am fairly sure the 90-97 years have a fuel return line from the fuel rail on the engine right? The EVAP system also has a vacuum line from the tank. If the outlet from the pump and filter are sent up the vac line it will fill up the canister pretty quick. The techs should be able to tell you which line is which and if they are correctly connected. Surely the quickest way to diagnose is Disconnect the filter outlet to prove its pumping out OK, if so reconnect and disconnect the fuel rail inlet to prove its getting to the engine bay, if so reconnect and check out the function of the VSV, the evap control valve.
eatingupblacktop Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 It's been a "dense head" day for me today, but I think I'm beginning to understand. "The gentleman at the dealership told me it's from constantly overfilling the tank, thinking about that I remember kind of smelling a gas smell after filling my tank a couple of times but nothing too dramatic. However I had ZERO problems until this guy messed with my tank, then replaced my fuel filter." Now fill me in, exactly how do you "overfill" your tank? Do you mean topping it off? If so, I think most everyone does that. I squeeze in as much as I can everytime I'm at the pumps, especially if they've dropped the price. Does this mean I've got to check out my canister in case the same thing happens to me? I've never smelled gas except at the nozzle at the pump. Does anyone else top off their tanks?
4.0 LS TECH Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 Ok the TANK itself has never leaked, it's leaking out of the CARBON CANISTER. Would the washer missing from that banjo fitting make fuel backup into the carbon canister? Or are you talking about fuel leaking from where the fitting is? I was thinking the fuel filter being backwards would cause the fuel to get backed up and spill out. also a missing washer on the banjo fitting could cause fuel to leak out even if everything else is good. If it has a leak then you wont have any fuel pressure. no pressure means it will bog down because the injectors wont have the fuel and pressure needed to operate.
4.0 LS TECH Posted January 22, 2008 Posted January 22, 2008 I always top of my tank. done it on every car i own. and ive never had a problem.
jcrome04 Posted January 23, 2008 Author Posted January 23, 2008 Ok well my car would drive just just fine for a few minutes then bog down and then die. I have no idea what overfilling a gas tank means.... sounds like Bs but whatever i just want this thing fixed it's *BLEEP*ing me off. So after all the times i've asked...which way is the fuel filter supposed to go?????? and if a washer is missing from the banjo fitting WHERE would it leak out from??? It's not leaking from the tank. It's draining out of the carbon canister. and how would gas be getting sucked into the carbon canister?????????????????? Im soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad lol whyyyyyyy whyyyyy whyyyyyyyy me! anyways....The mechanic said he'd cover the expenses so whatever they can replace the whole fuel system if they want! haha
bdgnbln Posted January 23, 2008 Posted January 23, 2008 So I had my 97 LS checked out at the local dealership, they said the carbon canister was full of gas which was causing raw fuel to drain out of it, and was sending gas back into my engine instead of the vapor, which would cause my car to die... He said it was from overfilling the gas tank. I have always topped off my tank, never to the point where it spilled out though, but is this even possible??? After top off after top off had it finally started to spill out of the carbon canister??? It never did anything like this until I had my fuel filter replaced. Any help??? pu pu pu pleeeeeease :cries: well only 2 things i could think of would be one yes filling to much when the handle stops dont try to put more gas in 2nd i believe there is a orifice float in the tank that is supose to close when the tank is full so fuel wont go into the canister if the float is stuck open then gas can back in
jcrome04 Posted January 23, 2008 Author Posted January 23, 2008 ok so I don't think topping off a tank should be a problem at all, never has been on any of my vehicles or anyone's that i know. So I would lean more towards the float being stuck open?? What would a remedy for this be?? Maybe I can bring up something to the dealership.
Leadfoot Posted January 23, 2008 Posted January 23, 2008 So I would lean more towards the float being stuck open?? I can't see a float listed in the parts diagram, so I don't think there is one. I am also struggling to find a reason for fuel to be jumping from the pressured fuel delivery system (which is now presumably back in its stock form) and the vacuum EVAP system. How is it physically making the jump? I still think you need to double check the all the lines are going to the right places. There will be an answer.
jcrome04 Posted January 24, 2008 Author Posted January 24, 2008 Well i've heard from an "inside source" my mechanic may have tried to force fuel into the lines to plumb the system or something since it was pretty empty... then is copping it off to me like he doesn't know whats going on... I'm not sure exactly what he did but it sounds like he did do something extremely retarded and i'm never going to go back to him again....Maybe he did screw up some lines.... I'm going to the dealership tomorrow to let them know about the lines. I don't know if they had checked them or not. Leadfoot I just want to give you a huge thanks you're a big help!! I'll keep you posted on what happens tomorrow, they are supposed to get the new carbon canister installed. Cross your fingers!!!!!
Iowa Posted January 24, 2008 Posted January 24, 2008 Hi, I want to ask for an advice from you guys about my going to buy 1996 Lexus ES300 (177K). If it was maintainced well, shall I buy it and run it for another 50k without any major problems (tranny, engine, etc.) Off couse, I will keep to maintaince the car well. Any experience about problem with this car at this mileage? Please help me. Thanks,
jcrome04 Posted January 24, 2008 Author Posted January 24, 2008 ..LS forum, and completely different topic.......but you can generally never go wrong with any Lexus.
bdgnbln Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 Well i've heard from an "inside source" my mechanic may have tried to force fuel into the lines to plumb the system or something since it was pretty empty... then is copping it off to me like he doesn't know whats going on... I'm not sure exactly what he did but it sounds like he did do something extremely retarded and i'm never going to go back to him again....Maybe he did screw up some lines.... I'm going to the dealership tomorrow to let them know about the lines. I don't know if they had checked them or not.Leadfoot I just want to give you a huge thanks you're a big help!! I'll keep you posted on what happens tomorrow, they are supposed to get the new carbon canister installed. Cross your fingers!!!!! ill print out the evap digram and bring it home from work and post it
bdgnbln Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 Well i've heard from an "inside source" my mechanic may have tried to force fuel into the lines to plumb the system or something since it was pretty empty... then is copping it off to me like he doesn't know whats going on... I'm not sure exactly what he did but it sounds like he did do something extremely retarded and i'm never going to go back to him again....Maybe he did screw up some lines.... I'm going to the dealership tomorrow to let them know about the lines. I don't know if they had checked them or not.Leadfoot I just want to give you a huge thanks you're a big help!! I'll keep you posted on what happens tomorrow, they are supposed to get the new carbon canister installed. Cross your fingers!!!!! ill print out the evap digram and bring it home from work and post it need help getting image posted any help would be great not much of a computer guy
jcrome04 Posted January 25, 2008 Author Posted January 25, 2008 ummmmmm just do photobucket.com thats the only way I know how to! hahahaha. Oh and just like always my part "didn't come in" today so maybe it will be in tomorrow. I swear to god they do this crap on purpose it *BLEEP*es me the hell off. something always goes wrong at the local dealership it's a joke. I've been out of my LS400 over a week now and i'm kind of on edge......lol
Leadfoot Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 ummmmmm just do photobucket.com thats the only way I know how to! hahahaha. Oh and just like always my part "didn't come in" today so maybe it will be in tomorrow. I swear to god they do this crap on purpose it *BLEEP*es me the hell off. something always goes wrong at the local dealership it's a joke. I've been out of my LS400 over a week now and i'm kind of on edge......lol Yes, it is very trying, see my thread about the continuing saga of my gauge needles not working. Hmmmm. Nothing to do but take a deep breath, hold for 10 seconds then exhale.
jcrome04 Posted January 25, 2008 Author Posted January 25, 2008 Yeah I think i read that one! That would stress me out sooooooo bad, but it's true there's nothing to do about it but just relax and wait!! I'm on my way to the shop so I'll keep you posted as soon as i get ANY info at all on her :(
jcrome04 Posted January 26, 2008 Author Posted January 26, 2008 Wow...so Friday has basically come and gone... still no carbon canister at the dealership. Pretty cool. Possibly tomorrow, but not likely. This is getting ridiculous. I've been out of my LS 8 Days now....
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