Bill es300 Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 I now see that the RX is being added to the list of cars affected. The Lexus sales staff all state , just a floor mat problem that doesn't affect RX's. My wife and I are poised to purchase an RX, however my wife and I are sceptical, about the Lexus answer, and have put the brakes on regarding a purchase. This from die hard Lexus fans, we are keeping our 1999 Lexus ES 300 for now. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Petree Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 I haven't seen the RX on the list of affected cars. The only Lexus models under the recall are the IS and ES. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill es300 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Share Posted January 25, 2010 I haven't seen the RX on the list of affected cars. The only Lexus models under the recall are the IS and ES. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill es300 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Share Posted January 25, 2010 I haven't seen the RX on the list of affected cars. The only Lexus models under the recall are the IS and ES. I viewed on NBC news the other night an RX owner who stated that his wife had experienced the same problem. I don't know if this was a single incident or one of many. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 You have to bear in mind that people say they have "experienced" the issue when they really haven't at all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Considering all of the other elements that go into an automobile, of which Toyota in general seems to be the best at building, a floormat would not be the one element that would steer me clear of Toyota. It's a floormat. Either get the fix, or put some velcro under it to make it stay in place. I'm not trying to belittle the problem, as it clearly is a potential fatal flaw. But, I just can't get my head completely around the idea that this is the "nail" for Toyota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I just looked at the list for the latest recall, the RX isn't on it...no Lexus is actually. I think its quite remarkable Toyota is actually going to stop selling the effected cars until they devise a fix... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc211 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 The lead story last night on the local news (couldn't find the remote in time to change the channel) was an interview with a lady who had a 07' ES that had a throttle, which ultimately resulted in the death of an innocent guy standing on the street corner. The car took off, hit a wall and then the guy. I haven't been paying too much attention to this, as I though the problem was just a floormat coming loose and resting on top of the throttle. But, I guess there is a problem with the actual mechanics of the throttle itself. That's a whole different story in my book. I can already hear the lawyers lining up for this one. GM's new advertising slogan: "Sometimes being on the side of the road isn't so bad afterall!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RX in NC Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 It's not just a "floor mat issue" any longer. My hat is off to Toyota for biting the bullet and deciding to cease sales and production of the affected models, but they may be looking at a potential public relations nightmare that could haunt them for years. It depends upon how quickly they can discover the cause, engineer a permanent fix, and then get it installed on every affected vehicle out there. This will take months, and the million-dollar question comes down to whether Toyota has been using the floor mat story as a cover-up to the real problem.... My 80-year-old mother traded her 1997 Accord in on a 2010 Camry late last summer because her local Toyota dealership was far more aggressive with their trade-in offer than her long-time Honda dealership was. Once Mom worked her best deals at both dealerships, a new Accord and a new Camry were within $200 of each other so her decision came down to the trade-in offer. Honda took for granted that they were going to sell her a new Accord and didn't work hard enough to keep her business. But now Mom is wishing that she had chosen the new Accord instead.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 Yeah I too am impressed by thier willingness to do what they've done... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amcdonal86 Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 I just looked at the list for the latest recall, the RX isn't on it...no Lexus is actually. It's only a matter of time... Seems to me that if it's not a problem with the floor mats, it has to be some sort of problem with the drive by wire system. And I highly doubt that this would just be limited to the Toyota brand. But we shall see! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The G Man Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 So far, Toyota have state that they will recall all vehicle for the floor mats, sticky gas pedal and the gas and brake interlock software. The software will monitor vehicle speed when the brake pedal is being depress, if the car does not slow down when the brake is apply, it will cut throttle to prevent a run away situation. A lot of European cars have this safety feature, Toyota use to have this software in place about 10 years ago, but for what ever reason, they have gotten rid of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 It's only a matter of time...Seems to me that if it's not a problem with the floor mats, it has to be some sort of problem with the drive by wire system. And I highly doubt that this would just be limited to the Toyota brand. But we shall see! I personally am very interested to see what the ACTUAL issue is here...I think like you that the issue is in the DBW system. Articles say that Lexus started using it in '02, but my dad's '98 LS400 had a DBW system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cduluk Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 I hope this possible flaw with toyota quality will cause them to really improve in the future. We've been noticing a slight decrease in quality lately... Sometimes it takes something really big to get someone thinking <_< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The G Man Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 I personally am very interested to see what the ACTUAL issue is here...I think like you that the issue is in the DBW system. Articles say that Lexus started using it in '02, but my dad's '98 LS400 had a DBW system. I believe the cars affected started using DBW in 02, thats the same time Toyota got rid of the brake/gas padel safety override. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMEONE ELSE'S GOT MY NAME Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 Here's the deal: http://www.cbc.ca/fp/story/2010/01/27/2491...l#ixzz0drYDV8so In short, Toyota grew so fast, that their primary supplier (Denso, a Japanese company, but manufacturing is still done world wide) was not able to make parts fast enough. So the brake part in question was outsourced to CTS (an Indiana based company, making parts world wide ... though the defective parts were made only by their canadian location). Since Lexus quantities a much lower, you won't ever see the kind of defect numbers you see with toyota. Btw, the parts also go on the Pontiac Vibe, and Fords made in China ... so Toyota isn't the only buyer ... their simply the largest. That fact makes them the biggest target, just like when GM was on top of the world. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The G Man Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 Even though the brake pedal recall doesnt affect any Lexus, there are still a number of report of ES speeding out of control, such as that state trooper in CA that die. Most of the time, these kind of accidents are impossible to trace as to the source of the fail compontent, if electronics is to blame, them is near impossible to trace. The fact is that the public may or may never know what really happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 I don't think they ever had such a safety override... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMEONE ELSE'S GOT MY NAME Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 I don't think they ever had such a safety override... Good news is that Toyota hardware/software is now complete that will cause the 'fly by wire' accelerator to disengauge if/when the brake & accelerator are applied (or stuck) simultaneously. . . . . . . snipMost of the time, these kind of accidents are impossible to trace as to the source of the fail compontent, if electronics is to blame, them is near impossible to trace. The fact is that the public may or may never know what really happen. It's true that it's "near impossible" to trace. But pinpointing with 95% accuracy is do-able. If for example, there are after market mats, thrown over the top of OEM mats, then you have a known issue. If you have a driver who has never been shown how to shove a car into neutral, then you have a contributing cause, traced to within 95% accuracy. Few things in life are beyond all probability, & - 100% always a certain way. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The G Man Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 A good example would be that state trooper from CA who die when his ES speed out of control. He was a driving instructor for the state police and most certainly would have known to throw the car into neutual. Also, did you guys see the pictures from that accident, there wasnt much left of that ES, how on earth can they determine it was the floor mats that cause the gas pedal to get stuck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 They were able to recover the floor mat, and it was a rubber floor mat from an RX, not the ES. Its all just assumption... So what are you saying, that the electronic throttle malfunctioned causing the vehicle to accelerate out of control, and the engine control computer malfunctioned not allowing the transmission to be put into neutral...at the same time. The chances of that happening have got to be incredibly, incredibly small. You're talking about two systems which work together, but are not dependent on each other to function. Occam's razor, its far more likely that he just did not put the transmission into neutral. Training aside when your family is in the car and screaming and crying...sometimes people don't make the same choices in a crisis that they do in a more controlled situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The G Man Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 They were able to recover the floor mat, and it was a rubber floor mat from an RX, not the ES. Its all just assumption...So what are you saying, that the electronic throttle malfunctioned causing the vehicle to accelerate out of control, and the engine control computer malfunctioned not allowing the transmission to be put into neutral...at the same time. The chances of that happening have got to be incredibly, incredibly small. You're talking about two systems which work together, but are not dependent on each other to function. Occam's razor, its far more likely that he just did not put the transmission into neutral. Training aside when your family is in the car and screaming and crying...sometimes people don't make the same choices in a crisis that they do in a more controlled situation. I am sure what happened, just like the government and Toyota really dont know what happen. They think its the floor mat because its not the right one, but there is no way to know for sure. If this can happen to a driving instructor, it can happen anyone, that is all I am saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 I am sure what happened, just like the government and Toyota really dont know what happen. They think its the floor mat because its not the right one, but there is no way to know for sure.If this can happen to a driving instructor, it can happen anyone, that is all I am saying. I agree, they don't know. However I am 100% sure had he put it in neutral he would have regained control of the car. He panicked and neglected to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The G Man Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 I am sure what happened, just like the government and Toyota really dont know what happen. They think its the floor mat because its not the right one, but there is no way to know for sure.If this can happen to a driving instructor, it can happen anyone, that is all I am saying. I agree, they don't know. However I am 100% sure had he put it in neutral he would have regained control of the car. He panicked and neglected to do that. Just think, if a professional driving instructor for the state police can panic and not put the car into neutral, it can happen to anybody. Sometimes there is just no time to do that after spending some valuable time trying to stop the car by using the brakes. Sometime you might be box in on the highway with a car in front of you and dont forget all the inexperience drivers out there and the senior citizens with slower reaction time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 I agree...anyone can do that. Saying however that neutral wouldn't solve the issue isn't true though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.