bbsal Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 not to sound affensive but what focas group helped them decide on everything for the new es because i counted way more people here that dislike it then people that like it.im on the border line of dislike and like.i dont like the doors and i still think its to clunky looking and the back of the car sits to high and looks very weird.but we all have opinoins and of course owners of the 02 03 is going to say they like it better and owners of the 92 01 will say otherwise.overall i think they could of did better on the outside of the car.interior is nice though.as for the gs300 400 i think its way way nicer then the es.more power better looking and just overall a beatuy of a car but again this is just me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbsal Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 ok i went thru a ton of posts and did some math and heres my results of what people on here think.78% say the older models were better and about 22% like the new ones or would buy one.hmm i think lexus needs to take a look at this web site and add it to there focas groups!i think thats a very high margin of people that dislike it.i didnt add myself in it because im on the border of like and dislike but a little bit more dislike then like. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Think of it this way though, the new ES sells way better than the old one did, it recaptured the best selling luxury car title from Acura. The focus group must have done a fairly good job. No reason for Lexus to look at the site, the new ES is a huge success. Also keep in mind that our members here are not neccisarily the same demographic as the focus group, they're younger, and they aren't the first owners of the cars typically. In theory they wouldnt have even been invited to the focus group in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbsal Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 true.like i said im on the border line of it.everyone of course is going to think there car is better thats just human nature!i am a big fan of the interior of the new ones.i think they did a excellent job in that department and agree the old ones like mine are just to plain on the inside.not enough wood grain and alot of other things.overall it probably is better then the old ones im just taking awhile to get used to looking at them on the road.maybe after the 04 is out i will start to like them even more.i hope anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 The 04's going to look exactly the same. It took me a while to warm up to the new one, but I like it more every day now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbsal Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 yea i think i will come around eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corky Posted August 17, 2003 Author Share Posted August 17, 2003 We have the ES '98 and we're lucky enough to be in a position to beable to buy the new 2003 ES300 but I'm still trying to "warm" to the new style and colors. I love the two tone on our older Lexus..one of the first things that attracted me to the car. Honest, as we left a restaurant last night there was a 2002 Silver ES parked next to our '98 Sage and I truly do like the older style best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbsal Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 yea its going to take alot of warming up to get used to the new body style.i have a 95 and love the styleing of it and so of course im not thrilled of the new style yet.nice interior though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedRacer959 Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I feel the same way. If Lexus (toyota) is so set w/ focus groups, then who was on that panel? I would have said they were smokin' crack and go back to the drawing board. :snoooorrrtttt: But serioulsy, I think it's nice, but just leaves a lot to be desired. I'll probably end up buying one anyway. Maybe a 330 if they go 0-60 in 7.2 like they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I feel the same way. If Lexus (toyota) is so set w/ focus groups, then who was on that panel? I would have said they were smokin' crack and go back to the drawing board. :snoooorrrtttt: But serioulsy, I think it's nice, but just leaves a lot to be desired. I'll probably end up buying one anyway. Maybe a 330 if they go 0-60 in 7.2 like they say. Just remember, it sells 25% better than the old one did ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AusJapanLexus Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 Hey guys. I have been pretty quiet the last week or so.. But anyway noticed this post, and have actually read a few other posts.. I dont mean to bag someone on these boards, but cant keep my tongue in my mouth any longer.. I am sorry SW03ES, but you need to get off the stats dude.. To be honest, stats are the figures released by companies, because thats what they want you to believe.. To be honest. Regardless of consumer groups. Car writers and critics, and even these so called focus groups. I make a decision on what I actually like!. If I dont like it, I simply dont like it. And well. I dont like it!. Not enough to move into the new model. I will look to getting either the new LS, or even the brand new Toyota Crown here in Japan. The new ES300 looks like a really large badly made plastic toy car!. Percentages and figures aside. Everyone that I have spoken to hates it, and or still undecided. And I am even speaking for alot of Japanese friends. And hell, its thier people that designed the thing? If you like, it, then thats why you are driving it.. I am not going to knock you for that.. Each to thier own!.. But if people say they dont like it. Just appreciate it in your own special way, and accept thier opinion. They are not being rude or sarcastic. But they are just expressing thier feeling?. In saying that, they are not expressing thier feeling in order to upset you.. Leave the stats for the Lexus people, and just enjoy the boards!.. We all like different things I guess??? Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H8R Proof Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 To be honest, stats are the figures released by companies, because thats what they want you to believe.. Yes, I do believe this is true. Just like the government/CFDC wants us to believe there isn't a cure for the common cold. But that's an entirely different can of worms... I make a decision on what I actually like!. If I dont like it, I simply dont like it. And well. I dont like it!. Me too, and me either, respectively. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H8R Proof Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 :snoooorrrtttt: Umm, *what exactly* is this li'l guy doing?!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 18, 2003 Share Posted August 18, 2003 I dont mean to bag someone on these boards, but cant keep my tongue in my mouth any longer.. I am sorry SW03ES, but you need to get off the stats dude.. To be honest, stats are the figures released by companies, because thats what they want you to believe.. I was being funny Chris, notice the winky face next to each of my comments? Everyone can like whatever they like, I don't care. Just an attempt at levity On the subject of the stats though, I get them from an independent industry source. Check out www.automotivenews.com its one of the most respected industry publications there is. The stats are real. Think of it this way, if everyone made up their own stats, why wouldn't everyone's cars be the top sellers? BMW beat Lexus this year in total sales by the way... Everyone has the right to express their opinion, I was simply showing that Lexus' design trend must be popular as a whole because the only people that matter to a company, the buyers, are speaking with their checkbooks. They're buying it. I have no problems with opinions, its when people feel their opinion is the only truth does it begin to bother me. For some reason a lot of the new Lexus' meet trouble with the enthusiasts, but hit it off big time with the general buyers. My posting of the stats originally wasn't to show that these people's opinions were wrong, just that Lexus doesn't have to go back to the drawing board, and they didnt make some huge mistake because the car is a successs. The posts of the stats after that were a joke... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AusJapanLexus Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 Fair enough, point taken!. As for me chastising you. I wouldnt even begin to call it that. If I were to chastise, then feeling's would have been hurt.. I enjoy these boards, and so would never go as far. I read what you wrote. And I also understand that alot of trueth is actually said in Gest??.. I honestly do think after your reply that you are a person to be taken heavily on stats.. You can quote me stats all day, and even tell me about respected this and that. And to be honest, I couldnt care less if you you got those stats from Martha Stewart.com. (well she was supposed to be respected also?) But as I said, figures, right or wrong, or even made up. At the end of the day, it comes down to what people like, and dislike. As I said. You like it! Wonderfull.. As for me, and I will be honest with this stat. 100% of people that I have talked to. Either dont like like it, hate it, or really dont know what they think? This made up of people from the U.S, Europe, Australasia, and here in Japan. Now they are stats that I trust!!! My friends and family's opinion. Not some book or magazine, or website.. Like I said, they can tell us anything they want to.. Friends have to look you in the eye! Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 The point of my quoting the stats is to show that for the most part, buyers are satisfied with the new design. My goal was never to tell anyone that their opinion doesn't mean anything, just to show that the car is doing very well in its market. 55,000 people liked the new ES enough to pay $35-40,000 for one in 2002. If you're not one of those people, thats fine. They're out there though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piggyncsu Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 even if i had the money for the new es, i wouldn't get it...i LOVE the old style, don't like newer cars, dunno why....for example the toyota 4runner...freaking crackheads designed the new one.... not like i'll ever own a new lexus or toyota or anything over $8k ;) doesn't bother me, ill take the car i have *cough* and fix it up to my dream car (one-tone damnit) and that's fine with me... once that es comes out, ill look at the comments from owners and decide if it's even worth my money...i mean, it's all statistics right now, no one knows anything hands on..if that makes since...no one outside the company (the little guys) have any idea how it REALLY is.. *Sigh* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbsal Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 i think we all have a opinoin and nobody should take it the wrong way.i posted some stats just by this forum to show that theres more people that dislike it then people that like it that was it. i dont think sw03es was trying to be a !Removed! he was just trying to show his set of stats that showed differently to what i see.most people i talk to also dont like the new es and i guess a new body change just takes some getting used to before you will start to like it.im still in the middle so i cant say i hate it but i sure dont like it yet. point is this forum is all about opinoins and thoughts so i think everyone should be able to say what they think and nobody should take it the wrong way. ok i said enough!lol..everyone just enjoy this forum! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 point is this forum is all about opinoins and thoughts so i think everyone should be able to say what they think and nobody should take it the wrong way. Precisely ;) ....for example the toyota 4runner...freaking crackheads designed the new one.... I actually really like the new 4 Runner LOL. It sells better than the old one too ;) You also have to keep in mind that more goes into redesigning and ultimately purchasing a car than just the styling. Comfort, room, utility, design, ergonomics. Take the 4 Runner (please!, another joke Chris lol) its MUCH larger and more useful than the old one which was actually pretty tiny. It has a lot more power, and a much better powertrain/drivetrain. Makes it an option to people who it wasn't an option to before. Styling is always a matter of opinion. Same can be said of the ES, its larger, rides better, is quieter, has more of a "big car" feel, closer to the LS. Has added features like the navigation system the old one didn't have. Lots of problems inhertant to the old one have been resolved. Lots of reasons to buy the car other than style. I didnt like the style so much before, but after owning it its grown on me. I think what you're seeing is the change in the era of these cars. Piggy said she doesn't like any new cars at all. Think about look, every era of cars has a "look". 80s cars, 90s cars. You look at a square Dodge sedan and you know its from the 80s. You look at one of the Lexuses like the first gen LS or second gen ES and you know "90s" What you're seeing is "00s". Look at all the new cars people have been having trouble with, the new BMW look, the new Lexus look, all the new cars from Chrysler. Its the end of an era we're all used to and the beginning of another. As Americans we dont like change... I'm all down for it though, I thought the 90s were boring. Bring on the different. I love them all, the SC430, the ES, the new 745Li, all cars that aren't "cookie cutter" like everything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 once that es comes out, ill look at the comments from owners and decide if it's even worth my money...i mean, it's all statistics right now, no one knows anything hands on..if that makes since...no one outside the company (the little guys) have any idea how it REALLY is.. I'm confused. The ES we're talking about is the 02/03 version, I have one, as do several other forum members. Its been out for almost 2 years. The statistics I've been talking about are the sales figures from last year compared to the old model. Just trying to clarify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 But serioulsy, I think it's nice, but just leaves a lot to be desired. I'll probably end up buying one anyway. Maybe a 330 if they go 0-60 in 7.2 like they say. I'm not so sure about the new 0-60 projections to be honest. They projected the current one at 7.8, and in reality its more like 8.0 or even higher. I doubt the new engine will bring it down any more than half a second. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 19, 2003 Share Posted August 19, 2003 Open and ready for business... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedRacer959 Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 I just think we all need a hug Oh, by the way H8R Proof this thing: :snoooorrrtttt: is a smiley face sorting a "line" of cocaine I assume. :) SW03ES, Are you telling me that the STAT that I got off of the LOC (from you) IS WRONG?!?!? http://www.imakenews.com/autospies/e_artic...le000175132.cfm ES 330 (Preliminary) * New 3.3L V6 E/G (3MZ-FE) * 225hp @ 5600rpm * 240lb-ft @ 3600rpm * ULEV-II classification * 10.8:1 compression ratio * 7.2sec 0-60mph * 15.5sec 1/4 mile * est. 20/29 city/hwy mpg rating I don't know what to believe anymore!!! Oh, this is all in humor btw :) No need to tear me a new one. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW03ES Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 LOL, I'm not going to tear anyone a new one! I'm not a monster lol. See, technically the information that I posted from AutoSpies isn't a stat, its a projection. Nobody has independently tested or even seen the car yet, and the possibility is definately there that the info AutoSpies has is bad. Generally I never trusted them before because of all the photoshoppied pictures and stuff on their site, but they had a similar list about the new Ls430 (pictures were way off) and they were 100% correct. So I'm somewhat confident that their info about the ES330 is right too. See, you can still believe! lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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