nc211 Posted January 3, 2006 Posted January 3, 2006 I've got a 95 LS400 with that soft black paint. She's in need of a buff soon. I have been told that Zaino is great stuff! Any opinions on this? I'll be using a random orbital...and of course clay bar before putting any wax or polish on the car.
SW03ES Posted January 3, 2006 Posted January 3, 2006 Zaino is an excellent product but there are some things that you need to be aware of before you decide to go that route. 1. Zaino is simply a good product among dozens of good products. It has an almost cultlike following and people will hold it up to solve all problems from rust to scratches to whatever. It won't do that, its simply a last stage product (LSP), one of the longest lasting, but its not a miracle elixer like some people make it out to be. 2. Zaino is a true Polymer like Klasse. That means you can't use polishes with any kind of oils or anything like that on the paint surface beneath it, its only compatible with certain compounds too that are absolutely devoid of fillers, so that it can bond and crosslink with the paint. That means the paint surface has to be actually as perfect nas it can be underneath it, meaning a lot more and a lot more professional polishing needs to be done beforehand. Zaino will magnify any surface imperfections beneath it. 3. Zaino is layerable, but only if you make sure to not use any products when washing that aren't compatible with the system. 4. Zaino, being a polymer with no oils, leaves a very high reflective shine. Some say its plasticky and lacks depth, I personally think it only looks good on light colored cars. It also, at least in my experience, magnifies the appearance of things like door dings because its so reflective. I'm not saying don't use it, I'm just making you aware of the specifics of how it works as a product.
Toysrme Posted January 3, 2006 Posted January 3, 2006 (edited) Zaino is good. Huge cult following. I like Klasse better when it comes to a synthetic wax. The base All-In-One is it's own strong cleaner wax, and it looks different, based on how you apply it. If you layer 2+ coats of Sealant Glaze on it, it can get a deep wet look like most Carnauba waxes that synthetic waxes just can't duplicate. If you stick with AIO, or add a coat, or two of SG, it will be very reflective like a traditional synthetic wax. It's also extremely easy to use following the wipe on, wipe off method. It not only last an amazingly long time on the car (it's an acrylic wax), but you use very, very little of it. IMHO I think you're missing the boat using Zaino on dark colors. Zaino is a reflective wax that looks better on light colors. You really want a Carnauba on dark colors. They give blacks, reds, and blues a very deep, wet look that can still be reflective at certian angles. 1) Strip it all off with some dawn soap. 2) Clay bar it to clean it. 3) Polish it. Meg's Dual Action Cleaner Polish (DACP) 4) One Glaze coat. I like Vanilla Moose. (VM) 5) 2 coats of a high quality Carnauba wax. I'm still in love with Carnauba Moose, but PS21/S100 (Some stuff, S100 is 1/2 the price as PS21 & found in Harley shops) looks identicle. Grab an OXO brush to wash with, and a pair of quality, large Waffle Weave microfiber towels to dry it. Washing/drying will get cut down to a 5-10 min affair you can actually do in the morning. A quality Quick Detailing spray will help wax last if you do that every few days. Quality Microfiber towells to buff with, Terry cloth towells to apply & work on your interior. Might wanna get some good foam applicator pads also. Use 2 part Lexol on your leather. Nothing will get close. Meguiar's 2 part is pretty good & if you just want to clean leather, a woolite + warm water solution is extremely hard to beat. In conclution. If it were me, I'd quit using Zaino on this car, Strip & clean what's on it off & Use a VM+2*CM/PS21 combo. Edited January 3, 2006 by Toysrme
SW03ES Posted January 3, 2006 Posted January 3, 2006 I agree. Toys- I've heard you mention the OXO brush before, do you like it? No marring?
cantsleepnk Posted January 3, 2006 Posted January 3, 2006 (edited) I agree with both opinions. I used Zaino on my black car and I didn't like that mirror look and frankly I wasn't impressed with the durability either. Zaino by itself is not a polish although now they have a dedicated polish . The most important step in the detailing process is the polishing step. When you're satisfied with the paint condition after polishing then top it off with an LSP. No wax will give you good results if the prep work is incorrect. There are many good products out there. Don't just limit yourself to one. Edited January 4, 2006 by cantsleepnk
Toysrme Posted January 3, 2006 Posted January 3, 2006 (edited) Ya. I love my OXO brushes. The normal brush isn't strong enough to knock most stuff off the car. You have to use a fignernail, or a cloth to get those. They really are soft. You'll know what I'm talking about if you ever get a chance to use one a few times. The thing is probably safer to use any anything else, because you use so much less pressure with it. I was highly concerned about scratching, but after 2-3 years on many, many cars, & reading a few posts about them being OK on Autopia (Back in the day) I can say mine's never left a single scratch. Do yoself a favor & buy the two tire brushes too. It just makes washing so freaking fast if you're in a hurry it's insane. I've virtually quit using my QD sprays. It takes the same amount of time to wash the car, as QD the whole dang thing LoL! Cheaper than the qd spray too lol! To me, blacks just *have* to be polished, then glazled. Next to know-one uses clear coats on black. They're all SSP (Single State Paint). it makes them look much, much better once you build a bit of oily stuff on them like a petrolium based glaze & a carnauba wax. Edited January 3, 2006 by Toysrme
nc211 Posted January 4, 2006 Author Posted January 4, 2006 Wow!! Ok, thanks guys...thanks steve... Ok, Zaino is out. So..help me here...I've got an 11 year old LS 400...black...white pits on the paint...an over-the-counter orbital..and a limited capacity to detail. I want a newer car look....not new car.. basically...what would you guys recommend I buy at the store to apply after a clay bar? I'm sorry, but I will not put dish soap on the car...just won't do it.. I'll clay bar it to death...but that's as far as I go. ;) After clay bar....hit it with the orbital on some polish? wax? compound?.....then what? I'm lost here.... :cries: swo....i follow you man....
ArmyofOne Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 Wow!! Ok, thanks guys...thanks steve... Ok, Zaino is out. So..help me here...I've got an 11 year old LS 400...black...white pits on the paint...an over-the-counter orbital..and a limited capacity to detail. I want a newer car look....not new car.. basically...what would you guys recommend I buy at the store to apply after a clay bar? I'm sorry, but I will not put dish soap on the car...just won't do it.. I'll clay bar it to death...but that's as far as I go. ;) After clay bar....hit it with the orbital on some polish? wax? compound?.....then what? I'm lost here....:cries: swo....i follow you man.... Meguiars NXT. that is my reccomendation. after a clay.
nc211 Posted January 4, 2006 Author Posted January 4, 2006 Mequires NXT is it...thanks army...as usual.. :D Wow!! Ok, thanks guys...thanks steve... Ok, Zaino is out. So..help me here...I've got an 11 year old LS 400...black...white pits on the paint...an over-the-counter orbital..and a limited capacity to detail. I want a newer car look....not new car.. basically...what would you guys recommend I buy at the store to apply after a clay bar? I'm sorry, but I will not put dish soap on the car...just won't do it.. I'll clay bar it to death...but that's as far as I go. ;) After clay bar....hit it with the orbital on some polish? wax? compound?.....then what? I'm lost here....:cries: swo....i follow you man.... Meguiars NXT. that is my reccomendation. after a clay.
ArmyofOne Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 Mequires NXT is it...thanks army...as usual.. :D Wow!! Ok, thanks guys...thanks steve... Ok, Zaino is out. So..help me here...I've got an 11 year old LS 400...black...white pits on the paint...an over-the-counter orbital..and a limited capacity to detail. I want a newer car look....not new car.. basically...what would you guys recommend I buy at the store to apply after a clay bar? I'm sorry, but I will not put dish soap on the car...just won't do it.. I'll clay bar it to death...but that's as far as I go. ;) After clay bar....hit it with the orbital on some polish? wax? compound?.....then what? I'm lost here....:cries: swo....i follow you man.... Meguiars NXT. that is my reccomendation. after a clay. there other good ones, but NXT is my favorite. personal opinion, but it looks great, really brings out the darker colors. made my lex look great EVERY time. but beware, it will only last about a month. but you wount have to reclay every month, just rewax. if you want the stiff that lasts longer, Meguairs Gold Class Paste wax will do almost as good of a job, and last 3-6. but for me, i would rather reapply once a month than have less of a finish.
SW03ES Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 If you're looking for a one step, NXT is probably a fairly good choice. You'll get much better results if you take the time to polish out the paint first. What type of orbital do you have? Check out the "What do I do first?" sticky I wrote a while back up on top of the forum, that will answer a lot of your questions as far as procedure goes. As for the dish soap, once and a while isn't going to hurt anything. The purpose of it in the Zaino regimen is to make sure there are no oils on the paint surface. Repeated use of dish soap will dry out the seals and weatherstripping etc but once every 6 months or so to apply the product won't hurt anything. If you want to use a made-for-Automotive-use alternative there are several like Prep-Sol, ABC wash, P21S makes one. Sal just puts dish soap because he figures its something everyone will have. Toys- I'll have to try one right before polishing sometime and see what I think... An interesting thing about clearcoat finishes and black. Actually as of the last few years almost ALL blacks are now clearcoated, including Lexus black after about 2001. You can definately tell the difference in the luster. I think it probably has something to do with the newer VOC requirements. nc211's 95 is definently single stage though.
Toysrme Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 Wow, CC'd black. I wonder how bad it shows flaws? That was always the reason nobody ever use to do it. I gave my grandfather some NXT. For a fairly easy to find store bought wax, I thought it was pretty good. I really liked the lubricity of the soap more than anything else. Very good for store bought. They have an '04 Taurus. It was a brown/gold/green metal flake. I honestly didn't like how NXT looked on it, so I just wash it with dishwashing soap to strip any waxes, then Klasse AIO+2*SG. I do that about every 6-9 months, and he washesh it every other-third week. I can tell when he washesh it every 2 weeks, 'cause the klasse will still bead water fairly well after 6 months. Now that I've run out of Clearkote wash, and 2 gallons of blue coral. Good old blue coral... Been around for decades, still costs a dollar a gallon ROTFLMAO! I'm thinking about buying some NXT soap for myself. I don't really feel like buying more sonus wash. Sonus makes a hella good washing shampoo too. The guy up the street uses it on his vette after I introduced him to Autopia. It'd use it, but I don't wanna pay for it lol! Clearkote is great stuff tho. The guy formulated everything himself, then spent years riding around the soutwest (Texas) selling it. How cool is that LoL! Vanilla Moose is the best glaze I've ever used. Carnauba Moose is the best Carbauba I've ever used. You can even get a descent use with it in full sun! WTF!? I apply it by hand & take it of with a MF bonnet on my PC tho. Still... No other carnauba can do that. Quikshine is a good QD spray. Comes by the gallon. Everything else is just so-so.
nc211 Posted January 4, 2006 Author Posted January 4, 2006 I've got a standard issue, Lowes GNC 10 inch orbital, nothing fantsy or anything. In the past, I have usually washed the car with normal blue coral car wash, then clay bar everything, then polish, then wax. It's just too much for me to do now by hand. The last time I did this was back in June of 04', and it took me two days! I know...i know...bad lexus owner for not doing again in the past 18 months..but she still beads! But not much. After I wash the car, I would usually spray some of that eagle 1 wax as you dry stuff to help extend the life of the wax. So if I use dish soap this time, should I use the suds of the dish soap to act as a lubricant for the clay bar? Or would that be too harsh? I've got several little white pits in the paint now, especially on the roof "always been there". Any suggestions on, or if possible, to fix those? Would the buffer take care of them? I've pretty much accepted the car's age and her cosmetic flaws, and she's got a few door dings here and there. Is the NXT a wax or polish, or both? I'm off to go read your write up SWO! ;) If you're looking for a one step, NXT is probably a fairly good choice. You'll get much better results if you take the time to polish out the paint first. What type of orbital do you have? Check out the "What do I do first?" sticky I wrote a while back up on top of the forum, that will answer a lot of your questions as far as procedure goes. As for the dish soap, once and a while isn't going to hurt anything. The purpose of it in the Zaino regimen is to make sure there are no oils on the paint surface. Repeated use of dish soap will dry out the seals and weatherstripping etc but once every 6 months or so to apply the product won't hurt anything. If you want to use a made-for-Automotive-use alternative there are several like Prep-Sol, ABC wash, P21S makes one. Sal just puts dish soap because he figures its something everyone will have. Toys- I'll have to try one right before polishing sometime and see what I think... An interesting thing about clearcoat finishes and black. Actually as of the last few years almost ALL blacks are now clearcoated, including Lexus black after about 2001. You can definately tell the difference in the luster. I think it probably has something to do with the newer VOC requirements. nc211's 95 is definently single stage though.
blake918 Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 I've got several little white pits in the paint now, especially on the roof "always been there". Any suggestions on, or if possible, to fix those? Would the buffer take care of them? I've pretty much accepted the car's age and her cosmetic flaws, and she's got a few door dings here and there. PC 7424+a good cutting pad+SSR3. It won't make them go away, but they will be greatly minimized. ;) I love Collinite IW. I like the look it gives, it glows but not anything that's going to blind you. Here is a before and after: eeeek: Lookin much. much better: It looks even better when you are a just a foot or two away:
SW03ES Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 The reason its taking you so long is you don't have your process down. Once you get it down and if you're using the right pads and tools it'll take you 4 hours tops. I can do my car completely in 2 hours, wash, clay, polish, and seal.
nc211 Posted January 4, 2006 Author Posted January 4, 2006 What's your hourly rate? hahahaa...I need to make a property inspection in DC anyway "tyson corner area". yeah, i can't argue with not having my process down. i actually make a day out of it, with several breaks and distractions....hmmm...that might just apply to everything I do. :whistles: The reason its taking you so long is you don't have your process down. Once you get it down and if you're using the right pads and tools it'll take you 4 hours tops. I can do my car completely in 2 hours, wash, clay, polish, and seal.
SW03ES Posted January 4, 2006 Posted January 4, 2006 I charged $80 an hour or so when I did it ;) You should shoot me a line when you come into DC, I'd love to get together for some lunch or something!
nc211 Posted January 4, 2006 Author Posted January 4, 2006 Dang...$80 an hour huh...you must be union! Hahahaha I'm actually trying to get the new guy to make the run up there for me. I call it the "initiation' phase...here kid, take this camera, take that company car, go to this address, ask for Allen, and take a bunch of pictures for me...thanks. Once he's cooled down, I usually take him out for a few beers and let him rant for a while. I usually cut him off right around complaining about his compensation. hahaha
ZINFANDEL22 Posted January 5, 2006 Posted January 5, 2006 I charged $80 an hour or so when I did it ;) You should shoot me a line when you come into DC, I'd love to get together for some lunch or something! From some of these pics I see from the pros they should get that kind of money its hard work. So a 96 es is soft black correct? I am planing on these steps let me know if anyone disagrees... wash,clay,porter cable,not sure on pads yet havent bought them yet but looking at steves site he recomended,menzerna polishes,wolfgang paint sealant, menzerna full metal jacket,s100,pinicale liquid wax just to have the last 3 around for waxes,and of course I must try the 303 protectant. :whistles: Let me know what you all think,like nc its pretty much my first time with a machine but I have clayed and did the cleanse with zaino and zymol in the past with their waxes all by hand. I love to clean my cars.
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