Need More Advice Re: Valve Cover Gasket

[palacie]

Hi all,

I need more advice regarding my valve cover gasket problem. I took my car to my friendly neighborhood garage today, the one who did the work about a month ago when mice ate through a lot of wiring and the one whom I 'thought' had told me they also changed the valve cover gaskets. Well, it turns out that they hadn't done that. The owner's wife said that she told me at the time that it needed doing.

So, the mechanic took another look at it and said that the valve cover gasket was leaking oil onto the exhaust. They gave me a price of about $300.00 to replace it; they said the part itself was only about $20.00 but that it was about 3 or 4 hours labor @ $68.00 per hour. Does that sound about right in southern California?

Another thing.... I asked them about the rear valve cover gasket and was that alright? She said that there 'isn't' any valve cover gasket in the rear but you guys are mentioning the front and rear ones all the time. So, what is that all about? Is there another name for the one in the rear? Now, I'm really confused....

Is it safe to drive the car for awhile this way, with the burning smell after driving it, but no oil leaks on the driveway? I don't want to do any more damage.

One last thing.... I asked her about the PCV valve (I hope that's the right name)and she said that if there was a problem with that, the engine warning light would come on. Is that correct? My car is a '93 with about 74,000 miles on it. I don't know if it's ever been changed because I bought it used.

Your answers will sure be appreciated.

Shirley

[khhoang]

Hi,

you should read my post on 2nd page in "Pinned: Tells Us About Your Car And Its Mods Or Problems" about parts and labor costs of FRONT & REAR Lexus vs. independent mech valve cover gaskets (yes, there is a rear VC gasket in the ES) and PCV valve (and while they're at it, fuel filter & spark plugs). To my knowledge, engine light will NOT come on for a clogged/failed PCV valve. A clogged PCV (a $7 part & DIY change) will cause the potential for oil leaks, i.e. thru VC gaskets, rear main seal, etc. Cosmetic-wise your engine will look very ugly due to the oil leak and sooner or later your driveway also.

Good luck!

[ArmyofOne]

yore mechanic is full of *BLEEP*. the CEL will not come on. the rear valve cover does have a gasket.

have you considered the thought that it could be a rear main seal? thats the seal between the engine and trasnaxle, about $800 repair P&L.

[khhoang]

yore mechanic is full of *BLEEP*. 

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lol i agree.. i would think twice about going back to these people. find yourself a shop who knows what they're doing.. and saying!

[ArmyofOne]

yore mechanic is full of *BLEEP*. 

←

lol i agree.. i would think twice about going back to these people. find yourself a shop who knows what they're doing.. and saying!

←

khhoang, you rpost is not entirely accurate...my car has had a MASSIVE oil leak for arund 35K miles, and its motor is perfectly sound.

driving with an oil leak will not decrease the reliability fo the engine, so long as you keep oil in it.

[bartkat]

I think he was agreeing about the part where the PCV would not throw a CEL. :D

[ArmyofOne]

I think he was agreeing about the part where the PCV would not throw a CEL.  :D

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sorry i was referring to this comment:

Mechanically your engine will get worse definitely not better with an oil leak

[khhoang]

post edited.. sure if you keep adding oil then of course you wont drive dry. but what if you dont keep adding oil and your engine goes dry or too low, would that cause mechanical failures in the engine? personally i would recommend solving the leak problem asap rather than adding a quart every week or so and dragging it out. i agree, you can drive around for months with an oil leak(s) but at a cost in the long run.

[steviej]

Shirley,

your ES has two valve covers, front and rear. It is a V6 engine so it has two cylinder heads and two valve covers. Your mechanic may think it is an inline 6 (some Lexus have this type of engine) in which there would only be 1 long valve cover.

The price is about right, though I would have expected a little less on the hours needed since the front cover is very easily accessable. The rear cover is not so readily accessable.

It is driveable temporarily. however keep an eye on your oil level at least weekly and keep your nose pinched (to avoid the odor). Just remember, little leaks become big leaks if not repaired in due time.

As for the PCV valve:

It is not a sensored part, meaning there are no electronics directly connected to the part. Direct failure or partial malfunction of the PCV will not set off a CEL (check engine light) as an O2 sensor, knock sensor, ABS sensor, throttle position sensor, or similar would. However, failure or partial malfunction of the PCV will have a trickle effect where problems will manifest themselves elsewhere. These problems will then create conditions that may set off other sensors that will inturn trigger the CEL.

Again, get a second opinion. Try a Toyota dealership, too. The motor is the same as a 93 Camry and their hourly rate is a little less than Lexus.

steviej

[palacie]

Shirley,

your ES has two valve covers, front and rear.  It is a V6 engine so it has two cylinder heads and two valve covers.  Your mechanic may think it is an inline 6 (some Lexus have this type of engine) in which there would only be 1 long valve cover.

The price is about right, though I would have expected a little less on the hours needed since the front cover is very easily accessable.  The rear cover is not so readily accessable.

It is driveable temporarily. however keep an eye on your oil level at least weekly and keep your nose pinched (to avoid the odor).  Just remember, little leaks become big leaks if not repaired in due time.

As for the PCV valve: 

It is not a sensored part, meaning there are no electronics directly connected to the part.  Direct failure or partial malfunction of the PCV will not set off a CEL (check engine light) as an O2 sensor, knock sensor, ABS sensor, throttle position sensor, or similar would.  However, failure or partial malfunction of the PCV will have a trickle effect where problems will manifest themselves elsewhere.  These problems will then create conditions that may set off other sensors that will inturn trigger the CEL.

Again, get a second opinion.  Try a Toyota dealership, too.  The motor is the same as a 93 Camry and their hourly rate is a little less than Lexus.

steviej

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Thanks very much for your reply. Yes, I will have to get another opinion. My car does not leak oil at all and every time I check it, it is at the full line. The smell is not real strong, not noticeable at all until I get out of the car. But, again, I do want it to be taken care of.

Re: the PCV valve, do you have any idea what replacing that might cost? I guess it's one of those things I should do at 74,000 miles as a preventive measure. However, my last attempt at preventive maintenance, (the timing belt job) sure did work out as I had hoped. As I've said in my previous posts, my car was shifting like a dream and it was only 'after' the timing belt replacement, that it began to hesitate and shift roughly into gear when cold. It's just hard to believe that this big difference is just a 'coincidence'. But, I guess I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. Now, I've lost faith in TWO mechanics. I guess they see an older lady come in and know they have a soft touch.

Thanks again,

Shirley

[steviej]

the PCV valve is a $7 part but they will get you for a minimum of 1 hours labor. It actually takes about 20 minutes from start to shutting the hood.

Have done as part of the valve cover gasket repair.

steviej

[ArmyofOne]

the PCV valve is a $7 part but they will get you for a minimum of 1 hours labor.  It actually takes about 20 minutes from start to shutting the hood.

Have done as part of the valve cover gasket repair.

steviej

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the las ttime i ahad a place change a PCV valve, it was 56 dllars.

i wouldnt lose faith in all mechanics just yet.

the only reason i havent done mine is becuase that snot the only place mien is leaking. i have every seal onthe motor dripping oil except for the rear main seal.

speaking of rear main seal, is it possible that thats what is leaking?

[palacie]

the PCV valve is a $7 part but they will get you for a minimum of 1 hours labor.  It actually takes about 20 minutes from start to shutting the hood.

Have done as part of the valve cover gasket repair.

steviej

←

the las ttime i ahad a place change a PCV valve, it was 56 dllars.

i wouldnt lose faith in all mechanics just yet.

the only reason i havent done mine is becuase that snot the only place mien is leaking. i have every seal onthe motor dripping oil except for the rear main seal.

speaking of rear main seal, is it possible that thats what is leaking?

←

I have no idea if it's the rear main seal. All I know is that two different mechanics have said the valve cover gasket, the first one was the guy who did the timing belt replacement, etc., and the second was the one who did the work about a month ago when mice ate through some wiring. Of course, I don't trust either one now, due to other contradictory stuff they have said. For example, the timing belt guy said I need a transmission flush; the second said my fluid looks fine w/good color. The first one also told me my axle shafts are shot and the bearings are dry, even though there are no symptoms of that. The first one said I need a PCV valve to the tune of $87.00; it was the second one that said the engine warning light would come on if I did. See why I have no faith? I guess a 3rd is in order at this time.

Shirley

[Lexusfreak]

the PCV valve is a $7 part but they will get you for a minimum of 1 hours labor.  It actually takes about 20 minutes from start to shutting the hood.

Have done as part of the valve cover gasket repair.

steviej

←

the las ttime i ahad a place change a PCV valve, it was 56 dllars.

i wouldnt lose faith in all mechanics just yet.

the only reason i havent done mine is becuase that snot the only place mien is leaking. i have every seal onthe motor dripping oil except for the rear main seal.

speaking of rear main seal, is it possible that thats what is leaking?

←

I have no idea if it's the rear main seal. All I know is that two different mechanics have said the valve cover gasket, the first one was the guy who did the timing belt replacement, etc., and the second was the one who did the work about a month ago when mice ate through some wiring. Of course, I don't trust either one now, due to other contradictory stuff they have said. For example, the timing belt guy said I need a transmission flush; the second said my fluid looks fine w/good color. The first one also told me my axle shafts are shot and the bearings are dry, even though there are no symptoms of that. The first one said I need a PCV valve to the tune of $87.00; it was the second one that said the engine warning light would come on if I did. See why I have no faith? I guess a 3rd is in order at this time.

Shirley

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Hi Shirley,

I totally agree with steviej & would advise getting the PCV (also the fuel filter is a good idea and not too expensive) valve replaced at the time you get the other work done (have you ever has the transmission fluid flushed before?). I am very suprised that one mechanic said there is only 1 VC gasket, but as steviej also mentioned, he might have thought it was an inlind 6 cyl as opposed to a V6.

Do you have a 3rd mechanic you can take the ES to? Perhaps from the advice of friends or family of a 'more trusted' person that has more experence with your car (pretty much the same as a Toyota Camry remember)? Keep us posted.

[jahon]

I have a 93 es300 and replaced the front and rear valve cover gaskets myself. I wouldnt trust that mechanic as far as I could throw him. I am not a certified mechanic and even I know there is a rear valve cover gasket by just looking at it. Also, it is very laber intensive, it can take a few hours to take apart and a few hours putting back together because you have to take everything that is over the rear valve cover gasket off which includes the throttle body and wires etc.. It is very important to change the rear valve cover gasket if it hasnt been changed before because it is most likely dried up and leaking already. I would suggest changing out the gaskets first then drive it around for a while to see if it still leaks. After the change you should hose down the engine with degreaser as well so you can see if it leaks anywhere else. If you have a certified lexus mechanic change all of this for you, you can expect a hefty bill. Do some research and do it yourself if you can.. but it is pretty hard if you havent had some experience working on cars. Go back to that mechanic and tell him he is full of *BLEEP* and point at the rear valve cover and show him the seam around where the valve cover gasket is to show him how stupid he is.. ;)

[Lexusfreak]

Shirley,

Did you ever get your problems resolved on your ES?

[palacie]

Shirley,

Did you ever get your problems resolved on your ES? 

 

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Hi,.... You really are such a caring guy; I hope that your family appreciates you!

Re: my car, I took it in today to a 3rd mechanic because as you know, I had many different (and conflicting) stories from the last two. I had to leave it overnight because it only acts up (insofar as the shifting) when it's cold which, as I've said, it 'never' did before the timing belt job.

Keep your fingers crossed for me that it's not something horrendously wrong.

I'll keep you posted as soon as I know the 'verdict'.

Shirley

[ArmyofOne]

Shirley,

Did you ever get your problems resolved on your ES?  

 

←

Hi,.... You really are such a caring guy; I hope that your family appreciates you!

Re: my car, I took it in today to a 3rd mechanic because as you know, I had many different (and conflicting) stories from the last two. I had to leave it overnight because it only acts up (insofar as the shifting) when it's cold which, as I've said, it 'never' did before the timing belt job.

Keep your fingers crossed for me that it's not something horrendously wrong.

I'll keep you posted as soon as I know the 'verdict'.

Shirley

←

fingers are crossed. :D

[palacie]

Shirley,

fingers are crossed. :D

Hi guys,.... Sorry to be so tardy in replying to you caring ones but since I didn't have my car from last Monday to Friday, I've been going crazy trying to catch up on my Christmas shopping.

Anyway.... After the first mechanic did the timing belt job and the car was not wanting to shift easily when it was cold, I told you that I took it back it to him and he took it in the back for about 10 minutes and then said it had nothing to do with their job and I should go to a transmission shop. I finally ended up going to another mechanic, as I told you, and after driving it cold, he advised me to call the first mechanic and tell him I took it to someone for a 2nd opinion and it was that the timing of the gears in the front of the motor should be rechecked (or words to that effect). Well, wouldn't you know that when something was said by another mechanic, the first dweeb was sweet as pie and said to bring it back in. So, the last mechanic drove it over to him and lo and behold, they HAD done something wrong! No surprise to me! It was all just too coincidental.... It turned out that 'one tooth' was off, or 'it was off a tooth' if that makes any sense to you DIY guys. So, problem solved! My car now shifts just fine, cold or warm, just like it did before. If any of you ever have a problem like this after a timing belt job, just remember to recheck those 'teeth'; apparently they are tricky little things.

Also, at the last mechanic's, after the timing belt thing was resolved, he replaced the valve cover gaskets, front and rear. That cost me $379.00. So, now, no more burning smell. Yay!.....

The latest thing is: When I picked up my car, the owner (with whom I had been dealing) had left early and one of his other mechanics said a CV boot is shot and needed replacing. He said maybe that's why the first mechanic said I should have both axles replaced as a preventive thing due to labor involved. Do you guys agree with that? When a CV boot is gone, is it better to just have that done or go for the axle job and should it be both at once, if only one boot looks bad? What price should I anticipate for the boot job or the axle job? So, this is the thing I could use advice on now..... it's always something, isn't it?

Thanks again for all your advice and concern,

Shirley

[Lexusfreak]

Shirley,

fingers are crossed. :D

Hi guys,.... Sorry to be so tardy in replying to you caring ones but since I didn't have my car from last Monday to Friday, I've been going crazy trying to catch up on my Christmas shopping.

Anyway.... After the first mechanic did the timing belt job and the car was not wanting to shift easily when it was cold, I told you that I took it back it to him and he took it in the back for about 10 minutes and then said it had nothing to do with their job and I should go to a transmission shop. I finally ended up going to another mechanic, as I told you, and after driving it cold, he advised me to call the first mechanic and tell him I took it to someone for a 2nd opinion and it was that the timing of the gears in the front of the motor should be rechecked (or words to that effect). Well, wouldn't you know that when something was said by another mechanic, the first dweeb was sweet as pie and said to bring it back in. So, the last mechanic drove it over to him and lo and behold, they HAD done something wrong! No surprise to me! It was all just too coincidental.... It turned out that 'one tooth' was off, or 'it was off a tooth' if that makes any sense to you DIY guys. So, problem solved! My car now shifts just fine, cold or warm, just like it did before. If any of you ever have a problem like this after a timing belt job, just remember to recheck those 'teeth'; apparently they are tricky little things.

Also, at the last mechanic's, after the timing belt thing was resolved, he replaced the valve cover gaskets, front and rear. That cost me $379.00. So, now, no more burning smell. Yay!.....

The latest thing is: When I picked up my car, the owner (with whom I had been dealing) had left early and one of his other mechanics said a CV boot is shot and needed replacing. He said maybe that's why the first mechanic said I should have both axles replaced as a preventive thing due to labor involved. Do you guys agree with that? When a CV boot is gone, is it better to just have that done or go for the axle job and should it be both at once, if only one boot looks bad? What price should I anticipate for the boot job or the axle job? So, this is the thing I could use advice on now..... it's always something, isn't it?

Thanks again for all your advice and concern,

Shirley

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lol Shirley......I sometimes drive my family & my wife of 8 months crazy with car stuff :D My dad is convinved that if they ever had to open my head up, little car parts would fall out (spark plugs, tires etc) I talk about them so much. ;) & yes your right for the most part, if it's not a new car payment, it's an older car repair & upkeep.....seems sometimes you can't win for loosing!

I'm not 100% sure how your should proceed with the CV problem......I've never had to replace those parts on any of my vehicles, but I know they do give out eventually. Did you get a price for both possible problems? I would phone (just as a starting point) both a Lexus dealer & a Toyota dealer & speak to a knowledgable service person to get a rough price & go from there. Educate yourself as much as possible on the subject just in case someone tries to pull a fast one on you. ;) Keep us posted & Have a great Holiday! Happy we are able to help!

[khhoang]

The latest thing is: When I picked up my car, the owner (with whom I had been dealing) had left early and one of his other mechanics said a CV boot is shot and needed replacing. He said maybe that's why the first mechanic said I should have both axles replaced as a preventive thing due to labor involved. Do you guys agree with that? When a CV boot is gone, is it better to just have that done or go for the axle job and should it be both at once, if only one boot looks bad? What price should I anticipate for the boot job or the axle job? So, this is the thing I could use advice on now..... it's always something, isn't it?

Thanks again for all your advice and concern,

Shirley

←

There are many threads discussing the why or why nots of replacing a single torn CV boot vs replacing both front axles. Both are pretty much the same labor time. Replacing both axles ensures that both CV boots are also replaced and both sides wear and tear evenly under normal driving conditions after the service. I had both of my front axles replaced due to a torn boot for approx. $400p&l at Firestone. Lexus wanted approx. $300 to replace just that torn boot.

Hope that helps.

[steviej]

Shirley,

Let see if I can help.

your car has two half shafts. They exit the transmission from the left and right side and go to the wheels. The shafts have to flex and allow for the motion of the hub and wheel assembly. Each shaft is actually three segments, the three pieces or segments connected to each other with two "U" joint type of knuckles. The knuckle is actually metal against metal so it is packed with grease. To keep the grease in there and not flying all over the inside of you engine bay and underside of your car, the knuckle is encapsulated in a rubber accordian like wrapping or "boot". Each half shaft has two boots (inner and outer). You follow me so far?

Once the rubber boot is pierced, torn, ripped, cut or damaged, the grease will spin out and you are left with metal grinding against metal. The classic clicking sound is then commonly heard at this point. The boots are rubber and exposed to weather, road debris, sand, dirt, rocks, sticks, animals (sorry had to through them in) and other damaging material. Any one on that list can tear open or damage the boot. Also, keep in mind that the longer the damaged boot is NOT replaced, the longer the knuckle has metal grinding against metal and that damage is irreversible.....then you have to replace the entire half shaft.

Here are the options.

1. have the damaged boot replaced. Boot kits cost about $20 each. The price will be the labor. The shaft has to be removed, the old boot removed, the knuckle repacked with grease and the new boot secured. This takes time so parts are cheap, labor is expensive. You also may be rebooting damaged knuckles if the faulty boot had been greaseless for an extended period of time.

2. have ONLY the shaft with the damaged boot replaced. Entire half shafts can be obtained for less than $75 even for a Lexus. They are remanufactured, but come with brand new boots prepacked with brand new grease. Simple procedure. Take the old shaft with the damaged boot off, put in the new half shaft and close it up.

The parts are a little more expensive the you make that up in the savings. You also gain TWO new boots, two undamaged knuckles and a new shaft.

The dilemna comes in when you try to decide preventative maintenance for the future or try to calculate potential future costs. If a boot was damaged simply due to age and natural deterioration of the rubber, then the other three boots ain't got much time before they go and will need replacing to.

-You could go with option #1 each time a boot lets go. Keep in mind this has the potential of happening 4 times because you have a total of four boots.

-You could go with option #2 and just replace the half shaft with the damaged boot. At most this would have to happen twice. It also replaces both boots on one side and leaves you with a new axle shaft. The boots are factory made so there is also some quality assurance behind the rebooting.

If the boot was damaged due to injury or insult from a foreign object then the other three may be in perfect or good condition and don't need to be replaced at this point in time.

From my experience it has always been wisest to change out the entire half shaft that had the damaged boot.

Expect to pay about $250-300 to swap out the shaft on ONE side of your car.

Have the second mechanic you went to give you an estimate on doing the half shafts. Ask for two estimates, one estimate for just the damaged side and one estimate to replace both sides. Tell him you were so delighted that he found your tranny shifting problem that you would like to do business with him from now on. That's good for a couple a bucks off.

If you have any other questions, just ask.

steviej

PS. Shirley.....have a Merry Christmas!!!!!

[ArmyofOne]

Shirley,

Let see if I can help.

your car has two half shafts.  They exit the transmission from the left and right side and go to the wheels.  The shafts have to flex and allow for the motion of the hub and wheel assembly.  Each shaft is actually three segments, the three pieces or segments connected to each other with two "U" joint type of knuckles.  The knuckle is actually metal against metal so it is packed with grease.  To keep the grease in there and not flying all over the inside of you engine bay and underside of your car, the knuckle is encapsulated in a rubber accordian like wrapping or "boot".  Each half shaft has two boots (inner and outer).  You follow me so far?

  

Once the rubber boot is pierced, torn, ripped, cut or damaged, the grease will spin out and you are left with metal grinding against metal.  The classic clicking sound is then commonly heard at this point.  The boots are rubber and exposed to weather, road debris, sand, dirt, rocks, sticks, animals (sorry had to through them in) and other damaging material.  Any one on that list can tear open or damage the boot.  Also, keep in mind that the longer the damaged boot is NOT replaced, the longer the knuckle has metal grinding against metal and that damage is irreversible.....then you have to replace the entire half shaft.

Here are the options.

1. have the damaged boot replaced.   Boot kits cost about $20 each.  The price will be the labor.  The shaft has to be removed, the old boot removed, the knuckle repacked with grease and the new boot secured.  This takes time so parts are cheap, labor is expensive.  You also may be rebooting damaged knuckles if the faulty boot had been greaseless for an extended period of time.

2.  have ONLY the shaft with the damaged boot replaced.  Entire half shafts can be obtained for less than $75 even for a Lexus.  They are remanufactured, but come with brand new boots prepacked with brand new grease.  Simple procedure.  Take the old shaft with the damaged boot off, put in the new half shaft and close it up.

The parts are a little more expensive the you make that up in the savings.  You also gain TWO new boots, two undamaged knuckles and a new shaft.

The dilemna comes in when you try to decide preventative maintenance for the future or try to calculate potential future costs.  If a boot was damaged simply due to age and natural deterioration of the rubber, then the other three boots ain't got much time before they go and will need replacing to. 

-You could go with option #1 each time a boot lets go.  Keep in mind this has the potential of happening 4 times because you have a total of four boots.

-You could go with option #2 and just replace the half shaft with the damaged boot.  At most this would have to happen twice.  It also replaces both boots on one side and leaves you with a new axle shaft.  The boots are factory made so there is also some quality assurance behind the rebooting. 

If the boot was damaged due to injury or insult from a foreign object then the other three may be in perfect or good condition and don't need to be replaced at this point in time.

From my experience it has always been wisest to change out the entire half shaft that had the damaged boot. 

Expect to pay about $250-300 to swap out the shaft on ONE side of your car.

Have the second mechanic you went to give you an estimate on doing the half shafts.  Ask for two estimates, one  estimate for just the damaged side and one estimate to replace both sides.  Tell him you were so delighted that he found your tranny shifting problem that you would like to do business with him from now on.  That's good for a couple a bucks off.

If you have any other questions, just ask.

steviej

PS.   Shirley.....have a Merry Christmas!!!!!

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stevie, unless the later model ES300's are more labor intensive, i dont think it will cost that much for the CV axles. parts and labor for me ran $438 for BOTH sides. that also included a tranny fluid drain and fill and a filter change on the tranny too.

Shirley, ebcause of the labor involved, it is usually better to change out the entire axle. your axle has 4 CV joints, one on each end of each axle. when one fo those joints goes, the others are usually soon to follow.

there is hope! you do not have to use LEXUS parts, if you are not in warranty.

for $129.00 a piece + $60.00 core exchange, O'Riellys auto parts (or autozone, i think their prices are within $2.00 of each other) will sell you 1 CV Driveshaft remanufacturered for your car. the way the core exchange works:

you go, pay the full $129 for each part. you take the parts (totalling $260 or thereabouts) to your mechanic and have them changed BUT TELL HIM YOU WANT TO KEEP THE OLD PARTS...ALL OF THEM!!!!

put the old parts in the boxes the new parts came in and take them to o'rielly's and give them the used parts. they will give you back $60.00 per axle=$120.

and dont worry about remanufacturered parts, thats all the mechainc woudl do anyway is remanufacturer your part and put it back in. he would pull it apart, change the CV unit inside the boot and put it back into the car.

new is not any better in this case, these "remanned" parts come with a lifetime warranty. and you wil pay over $300 per axle for the Lexus replacement, and you wont get any core refund/exchange.

[Lexusfreak]

Shirley,

Let see if I can help.

your car has two half shafts.  They exit the transmission from the left and right side and go to the wheels.  The shafts have to flex and allow for the motion of the hub and wheel assembly.  Each shaft is actually three segments, the three pieces or segments connected to each other with two "U" joint type of knuckles.  The knuckle is actually metal against metal so it is packed with grease.  To keep the grease in there and not flying all over the inside of you engine bay and underside of your car, the knuckle is encapsulated in a rubber accordian like wrapping or "boot".  Each half shaft has two boots (inner and outer).  You follow me so far?

 

Once the rubber boot is pierced, torn, ripped, cut or damaged, the grease will spin out and you are left with metal grinding against metal.  The classic clicking sound is then commonly heard at this point.  The boots are rubber and exposed to weather, road debris, sand, dirt, rocks, sticks, animals (sorry had to through them in) and other damaging material.  Any one on that list can tear open or damage the boot.  Also, keep in mind that the longer the damaged boot is NOT replaced, the longer the knuckle has metal grinding against metal and that damage is irreversible.....then you have to replace the entire half shaft.

Here are the options.

1. have the damaged boot replaced.  Boot kits cost about $20 each.  The price will be the labor.  The shaft has to be removed, the old boot removed, the knuckle repacked with grease and the new boot secured.  This takes time so parts are cheap, labor is expensive.  You also may be rebooting damaged knuckles if the faulty boot had been greaseless for an extended period of time.

2.  have ONLY the shaft with the damaged boot replaced.  Entire half shafts can be obtained for less than $75 even for a Lexus.  They are remanufactured, but come with brand new boots prepacked with brand new grease.  Simple procedure.  Take the old shaft with the damaged boot off, put in the new half shaft and close it up.

The parts are a little more expensive the you make that up in the savings.  You also gain TWO new boots, two undamaged knuckles and a new shaft.

The dilemna comes in when you try to decide preventative maintenance for the future or try to calculate potential future costs.  If a boot was damaged simply due to age and natural deterioration of the rubber, then the other three boots ain't got much time before they go and will need replacing to. 

-You could go with option #1 each time a boot lets go.  Keep in mind this has the potential of happening 4 times because you have a total of four boots.

-You could go with option #2 and just replace the half shaft with the damaged boot.  At most this would have to happen twice.  It also replaces both boots on one side and leaves you with a new axle shaft.  The boots are factory made so there is also some quality assurance behind the rebooting. 

If the boot was damaged due to injury or insult from a foreign object then the other three may be in perfect or good condition and don't need to be replaced at this point in time.

From my experience it has always been wisest to change out the entire half shaft that had the damaged boot. 

Expect to pay about $250-300 to swap out the shaft on ONE side of your car.

Have the second mechanic you went to give you an estimate on doing the half shafts.  Ask for two estimates, one  estimate for just the damaged side and one estimate to replace both sides.  Tell him you were so delighted that he found your tranny shifting problem that you would like to do business with him from now on.  That's good for a couple a bucks off.

If you have any other questions, just ask.

steviej

PS.  Shirley.....have a Merry Christmas!!!!!

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VERY well detailed description steviej!!! :D

[steviej]

VERY well detailed description steviej!!!  :D

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Thanks Bren. It just raises my fur when someone tries to reword exactly what I said and then further adds possible confusion to the the whole shabang.

Replacing half shafts is one of my favorite DIY repairs to undertake. Done it many times on various makes and models. In every case, it was cheaper and easier to to go the way of replacing the entire half shaft.

Army:

Shirley's ES is probably equiped with ABS and traction control where your ES 250 is not (I'm guessing here). I allowed for a little extra time in removing the old half shafts without damaging the hub with traction control sensors and the ABS sensors. I also figured that the last thing Shirley would want to do is lug the dirty greasey HEAVY old half shafts from her mechanic to the autoparts store. I figured a little more because her mechanic will order the parts from the same place she is going to and yes charge her a little more, but she then won't be bothered with any of the details. Hence I figured at best: $250 per side = $500.