Reliability: 92 Es300 Vs 93 Cadillac Sts Seville

[3ztwint]

Hey guys, I'm just wondering if you've heard anything on how the early 90's sevilles stack up against the es300, I've heard great things about both, and I own the es300, but am thinking about getting the caddy b/c of what kind of deal I can get on it, but then I may have to choose between the 2. Any advice would be great!

Thanks

[bdonkersgoed]

Check out Edmunds for lots of information on car specs. Here is what they say:

1993 Cadillac Seville STS Ratings

Midterm Reliability Ratings (1-3 years)

Mechanical Reliability 3 / 5

Body & Interior Reliability 3 / 5

Feature and Accessory Reliability 3 / 5

Long Term Dependability Ratings (4-5 years)

Mechanical Dependability 5 / 5

Body & Interior Dependability 4 / 5

Feature and Accessory Dependability 3 / 5

1993 Cadiallac Seville STS Specifications

Type: Large Sedan

Where Built: United States

Length: 204.4 in.

Width: 76.4 in.

Height: 54 in.

Wheel Base: 111 in.

Curb Weight: 3721 lbs.

Front Head Room: 38 in.

Front Leg Room: 43 in.

Maximum Seating: 5

Base Number of Cylinders: 8

Base Engine Size: 4.6 liters

Base Engine Type: V8

Horsepower: 295 hp

Max Horsepower: 6100 rpm

Torque: 290 ft-lbs.

Max Torque: 4400 rpm

Drive Type: FWD

Fuel Tank Capacity: 20 gal.

EPA Mileage Estimates: (City/Highway)

Automatic: : 16 mpg / 25 mpg

Range in Miles: (City/Highway)

Automatic: 320 mi. / 500 mi.

[bdonkersgoed]

1993 Cadiallac Seville STS Reviews

Rating 9.8/10.0

Review: This has been the most reliable car we have ever had. It is ten years old and we haven't had any problems with it. We get our standard oil change and that's all. It still looks great and drives great!

Favorite Features: The best design. Pure class.

Rating 9.6/10.0

Review: I purchase my STS in Sept. 98. It had 93,000 mile now has 153,000 miles. I did the first tuneup at 120,000 miles. I have always followed the dealer service recommendations ( except the tuneup, the car was running greatbut got a little rough at 120K so did the tuneup) They are not cheap. Replaced the radiator at 140,000 miles. Other than that all other repairs were normal maintenance. Great car. I plan on purchasing another this fall.

Favorite Features: Great driving and handling. excelleration is fantastic. That Northstar engine is a dream! I love the interior. Has a great european fell without the price. Sound system is beautiful. can't say enough about all its features.

Suggested Improvements: Need more room in back seat. Trunk is also limited. Not a car you can travel with another couple on a long trip.

Rating 8.9/10.0

Review: Great riding car I enjoy the powerful motor. But the fuel injection continues to explode. And cadlilac tech could not tell me why but they charged me $1800. to put some type of kit on the fuel injection housing. But it still back fires while starting.

Favorite Features: The strong ride performance and the interior design is great. The car has a a beautiful design inside and out.

Suggested Improvements: Find some one who can tell why the fuel injection sytem continues to back fire and cracks fuel injection case. I had to pay $1800 twice before they came up with some kind of kit. Was I ripped off or was there a recall that i paid for.

[bdonkersgoed]

1992 Lexus ES300 Ratings

Midterm Reliability Ratings (1-3 years)

Mechanical Reliability 4 / 5

Body & Interior Reliability 3 / 5

Feature and Accessory Reliability 5 / 5

Long Term Dependability Ratings (4-5 years)

Mechanical Dependability 4 / 5

Body & Interior Dependability 4 / 5

Feature and Accessory Dependability 4 / 5

1992 Lexus ES300 Specifications

Type: Midsize Sedan

Where Built: Japan

Length: 187.8 in.

Width: 70 in.

Height: 53.9 in.

Wheel Base: 103.1 in.

Curb Weight: 3362 lbs.

Front Head Room: 37.8 in.

Front Shoulder Room: 56.1 in.

Rear Head Room: 36.6 in.

Rear Shoulder Room: 55.1 in.

Front Leg Room: 43.5 in.

Rear Leg Room: 33.1 in.

Luggage Capacity: 14.3 cu. ft.

Maximum Seating: 5

Base Number of Cylinders: 6

Base Engine Size: 3 liters

Base Engine Type: V6

Horsepower: 185 hp

Max Horsepower: 5200 rpm

Torque: 195 ft-lbs.

Max Torque: 4400 rpm

Drive Type: FWD

Turning Circle: 36.7 ft.

Fuel Tank Capacity: 18.5 gal.

EPA Mileage Estimates: (City/Highway)

Manual: 19 mpg / 25 mpg

Automatic: : 18 mpg / 24 mpg

Range in Miles: (City/Highway)

Automatic: 333 mi. / 444 mi.

Manual: 351.5 mi. / 462.5 mi.

[bdonkersgoed]

1992 Lexus ES300 Reviews

Rating 9.9/10.0

Review: owned from 90k to 140k 1997 to april '04, sold today for $4450 but wanted to pay homage. catal converter failed last year. replaced motor mounts to pass inspection for sale. pwr antenna broke at 100k and one window had to be reset in track last yr.. otherwise all maintenance has been routine. best car i ever owned!

Rating 10.0/10.0

Review: I purchased the car for only $6,000 with low miles. What an exceptional car? It drives smoothly, handles the road well, and it hugs you just like it was meant for you!

Favorite Features: The radio console

Suggested Improvements: the power windows roll up kinda slow

Rating 10.0/10.0

Review: excellent vehicle. highly recommended! probably the best used car you could buy.

Favorite Features: 185HP for a 1992 vehicle! its a bullet!

Suggested Improvements: should have standard cd player.

Rating 9.5/10.0

Review: I gambled on Toyota's reliability when I bought this car with 192,000 miles on it. Now my ES 300 has 228,500 miles on it and it still runs well.

Favorite Features: 11 years old, 228,500 miles, and there is not one squeak or rattle to be heard when driving. 6 CD changer sounded great until it died three times. Body style still looks good.

Suggested Improvements: Watch out for repair costs. A new gauge cluster (burned out needles) was ~$600. They want $500 for a new leather steering wheel! (not including the airbag)

Rating 9.6/10.0

Review: This is now the second used car that I have purchased. My first car was a Mazda, and within the first year of driving it, I had spent over $2000 CDN in repairs! The ES300 on the other hand has not given me any major problems at all for the year that I have owned it. All that I have had to fix was a leak in the exhaust ($50) and a dead battery ($60). This vehicle has the same engine as the Camry of the same year, so repairs should not be too expensive and used parts should be easy to come by. Overall, it is an awesome car!

Favorite Features: Extremely reliable, great appearance, very comfortable leather interior, gadgets (such as the power sunroof) that don't actually break down, and the way people always ask, "You own a Lexus?!"

Suggested Improvements: It would be nice if the car was a a little bit better on gas; however, considering the car's size, its not too bad. I consistantly get about 600kms on a 55L tank.

Hope this helps,

Bryan

[bdonkersgoed]

It seems as thought the STS gets pretty good reviews, and the depreciation on the STS in the first couple of years is MASSIVE, so picking up a used one could be a pretty good deal. The nearly 300hp V8 could be fun too :D

Just be aware that this car will use more gas (although they seem to be rated pretty close), and will cost more for insurance than the ES300. Also, style wise, I don't think the Cadiallac is quite up there with the ES300 . . . the Caddy looks like an old man's car (in my personal opinion).

Regards,

Bryan

[amf1932]

I think that making this comparison is like comparing apples to oranges. You're dealing with 11 year old cars which could have enormous historical differences, like mileage, maintenance, condition, etc, etc. It's ridiculous!! :chairshot:

[93LSOwner]

If you had two specific cars of each and have all of the information on them. Then maybe the comparsion could be a little accurate with some personal opinions & perferences.

[bdonkersgoed]

Yeah, in order to make a fair comparison, we would need the actual cars to compare. The STS and the ES300 are very different cars, so personal taste will play a huge role in the decision. Cadillac doesn't offer the prestige that a Lexus offers either, even though it cost almost double the ES300 when new! I belive the price of a new STS is around $80000CAN where as the price of a nwe ES300 is around $42000CAN . . .

What are your priorities? Reliability? Maintennance costs? Aesthetic appeal? Prestige? Economy? And the list goes on and on . . .

Regards,

Bryan

[3ztwint]

Bryan & everybody else who replied; thanks a bunch for your input. Yeah, you guys are definitely right, I'll probably keep my lexus for sure, I guess what I am after is if anyone has heard any horror stories about the early 90's seville STS models, or has any good justifications as to why it isn't a good car, because I might just buy it anyway if the price is right.

Thanks guys

J

[bdonkersgoed]

So it seems as if reliability is more of a priority for you . . . judging from the JD Power ratings, it seems as though it is a pretty well-made car, which is a lot more than can be said of the Catera (one of Cadillac's worst, other than the Allante)! I have no idea what the maintennance costs on an STS is . . .

A while back, the STSs were going for pretty cheap in my area, and I told my friend that he should buy one as a winter car. He almost did until we looked at insurance. Insurance on a 300hp car and a young male driver do not go together very well :P

Good luck,

Bryan

[bdonkersgoed]

The Epinions website is often helpful as well. To find a car, I usually go to Google and type in something like the following:

1993 Cadillac Seville STS Epinions

The Epinions website is usually the first one listed. There is one review for the STS there.

Regards,

Bryan

[3ztwint]

Bryan, you're the man, thanks for all the input, yeah reliability is pretty much a huge #1 for me(which is why I drive a Lex), I think I might just take a gamble if the guy lets it go cheap.

Thx

J

[bdonkersgoed]

No prob :)

I hope it all works out for ya. Let me know how good the STS is if you buy it . . . when insurance gets cheaper, it would make a really nice winter car :)

Regards,

Bryan

[Lexusfreak]

Are we talking about the early 90's Seville with the Northstar V8 or the regular 4.9L V8?? Big difference! I have heard horror stories from many sources (including several Cadillac stores in Toronto) about the cost nightmare & how labour intensive it is to repair the Seville. One must remember were talking about the "General" here & they are not regarded (at least back then, as they are getting much better now) as in the top ten automakers as far as reliability & quality is concerned so I agree were comparing apples to oranges here. The Seville was on my short list when I bought my ES & because of "word or mouth" from mechanics that have worked on both vehicles, it was no contest to stick with the Lexus B)

What part of Ontario are your from bdonk?

[steviej]

Lexusfreak beat me to it. The early Norstars are oil guzzlers. Many problems and headaches when it first came out.

oh yeah, bdonkersgoed, for the record: the worst Cadillac was the Cimeron.

steviej

[Lexusfreak]

Hand's down the worst Cadillac steviej! B) Also if the Northstar engine has a bad oil leak, one has to take apart part of the engine to get at it in order to replace a seal or gasket.......machanics have said (depending on the location of the oil leak) 12 - 24 hours labour! :chairshot:

[bbsal]

its funny you are compairing the sts to the es300 because i did the exact same thing before buying my es300.i had a choice of getting the sts or the es300 and almost bought the sts because i think in my opinoin the sts is much more of a car then the es300 but some how chose the es300 and been happy ever since.i still love the sts and wouldnt mind buying one if someday i get rid of my es300.i say either way you cant go wrong.big huge differnce in power though.the es300 in no way shape or form can keep up with the sts.i think i chose lexus because of the name and horror stories of the old caddys but the newer caddys are much much better then ever before.

and just for the record the cimmoron was with out i doubt the worse car cadyy ever built.i know this because i used to sell cars and never would go near a cimmorin because of the problems they had.but the sts is a whole other animal and way better car.good luck either way.

[Lexusfreak]

The Allante & "hatchback" Seville of the mid 80's Are probobly in the top 5 worst of all time too lol

[bdonkersgoed]

Hey LexusFreak,

I kind of live in two places depending on the time of year.

During the months when I am at school (I am taking Actuarial Science at the University of Waterloo) I live in a small hick town called Listowel about 50 kms north of Waterloo and I commute in to school.

During the months when I am working at my coop job (such as now), I live in Guelph with my brother, drive to Milton every morning, and then take the GoTrain to downtown Toronto where I work at an insurance company. It's a 2-hour commute one way, but it is cheaper than living in Toronto!

Regards,

Bryan

[Lexusfreak]

I hear ya Bryan B) My wife is from a small hick town between London & Chatham called West Lorne. My dad's a realestste broker & we can't get anything decent under 275k! in Toronto.....hopefully the market starts coming down soon as first time buyers can't afford anything in the big city

Brenden

[bdonkersgoed]

275K would get you a pretty nice house in Kitchener/Waterloo or Guelph . . . it sucks that Toronto has to be so expensive! I think that, if I were to get a permanent job in TO, I would live in Milton and take the GoTrain fom there. You can sleep on the train, so it isn't too bad :P

Regards,

Bryan

[Lexusfreak]

Lol bdonk, I hate public transportation.......that's one reason I bought such a nice car in the Lexus! :P lol

[bdonkersgoed]

Lexusfreak beat me to it.  The early Norstars are oil guzzlers.  Many problems and headaches when it first came out.

oh yeah, bdonkersgoed, for the record: the worst Cadillac was the Cimeron.

steviej

I have never heard of the Cimeron before . . . I must be too young (21 years old). I just remember reading articles on the Allante as being a huge marketing flop.

I know that the newer Cadilac Cateras have some serious issues in reliability . . .

Regards,

Bryan

[steviej]

bdonk, during those years you would have been strapped in a car seat. The Cimeron was an X-body GM car mass produced across all car lines in the early 80's: Cutlass (Olds), Pheonix (Pontiac), Cimeron (Cad), Skylark (Buick), Citation (Chevy).

All had oil leakage problems and all had power steering "morning sickness"

It was not a high point for GM at that time.

steviej

Edited June 4, 2004 by steviej