Suggestions To Pull Parents Over On A 90 Ls?

[TMaxxTim]

YEah, I've checked cars.com, autotrader, all of them. I found an SC 400 for $4900, hopefully will check that out today or tomorrow and call the LS 400 person that wanted $3900 for it. It said $3900 yesterday and today says $3900 OBO. I figure I'll look at it at least, but sounds like it might have some problems. I also found a 92 ES for $7k at the local lexus dealership, going to look at that one too although its about $2000 out of my price range, but I want to see what a nice and detailed one will look like.

The thing that draws me in on the Lexus over other cars is that its a nice car, has all the features and saftey features of current cars and on top of that, it has power that it looks like it doesn't have sometimes. Like my accord...it doesn't look like it has power...and it doesn't. A SC400 or LS 400 they don't necessarily look like sports cars (the sc a bit more), but the 0-60 times are close to both my my friends 0-60 on their 3000gt and 300zx. I'm not going to race this car but I really like the idea of having a car that doesn't look fast but can really get up there when you need to. I know some people think 17 year olds don't need these kinds of cars, but I've never had a speeding ticket or wreck (knock on wood) and some of my friends have been in an accident AND have had 2 or more speeding tickets!!

[90LS400Lexus]

YEah, I've checked cars.com, autotrader, all of them.  I found an SC 400 for $4900, hopefully will check that out today or tomorrow and call the LS 400 person that wanted $3900 for it.  It said $3900 yesterday and today says $3900 OBO.  I figure I'll look at it at least, but sounds like it might have some problems.  I also found a 92 ES for $7k at the local lexus dealership, going to look at that one too although its about $2000 out of my price range, but I want to see what a nice and detailed one will look like. 

The thing that draws me in on the Lexus over other cars is that its a nice car, has all the features and saftey features of current cars and on top of that, it has power that it looks like it doesn't have sometimes.  Like my accord...it doesn't look like it has power...and it doesn't.  A SC400 or LS 400 they don't necessarily look like sports cars (the sc a bit more), but the 0-60 times are close to both my my friends 0-60 on their 3000gt and 300zx.  I'm not going to race this car but I really like the idea of having a car that doesn't look fast but can really get up there when you need to.  I know some people think 17 year olds don't need these kinds of cars, but I've never had a speeding ticket or wreck (knock on wood) and some of my friends have been in an accident AND have had 2 or more speeding tickets!!

I think that $7K is a bit steep for a 1992 ES300, unless it has very low miles, and/or is in absolutely like new condition throughout. $7K would probably even buy you a very nice, low mile 90-92 LS400. People keep mentioning the Camry, but I just thought that even for $5K-$6K, you may even be able to find a nice 1997-98 Camry. This is a different style than the 96. This body style ran from 1997-2001, so it is still very modern and the interior is very well built. I was even considering a 97 Camry LE, with 142K for $6900 before I bought my LS400. I thought $6995 was too steep for the miles, so I passed. I did recently see another 98' Camry LE for $6900 and it only had 80K. Unlike the newest Corolla, it has a lot of padded interior panels, including the dash. Unfortunately, even the newest Camry (2002-2004) has also switched to a lot of hard plastic interior, just like the Corolla.

I am not sure if you have ever driven a rear wheel drive car before, but if you get a LS400, be extremely careful in wet or snowy weather. I live in Tennessee as well, in the northeastern part of the state, and although we do not get much snow (about 19 inches per year on average- sometimes much less) we typically get a little more snow that you do in Nashville, so I have driven my LS once before in the snow and it was not fun at all. I know that Nashville really does not get much snow all winter, but when you do and you drive the LS or SC, be careful, as they go very poorly in the snow and even the rain if you over accelerate. You will have to get used to the different way a RWD drives and handles.

As long as you know about the parts cost and you can afford them- you should be OK. Like SW said, I am a little older, but even though I am 28, I still wish I had of waited longer before I bought a LS, because I am now finding that parts are expensive and I am planning on going back to college soon (if I do not procrastinate again :whistles: :D ), because I am really going to want to use the money in my savings for college books, etc, rather than spending it out on my car. I made the mistake of not going back to college directly after high school (10 years ago), I guess mainly because I like my current management position at work, but I am starting to get tired of it and decided it is time to go back and get my degree. Perhaps after that, I will be able to buy a newer LS400 down the road.

I agree with VBdenny about avoiding Mercedes and BMW for now, unless like I mentioned- you get a 300SD. Like he said, parts for these cars are also very expensive when things start going wrong. I am considering a 1987 Mercedes 420SEL right now that is for sale locally for $2900 obo. I know the parts are very high for these cars, but I am hoping that since it only has 150K, it will be OK for a while. If not- I will be regretting I bought another car with high parts cost and perhaps learn a lesson. :) I would really like to wait for the diesel model, because they are more reliable and fairly easy to work on. If I do buy it, I will probably sell my LS for $3500, and then put that back into my savings, so no harm done- I hope. :D

Good luck on your search today.

[TMaxxTim]

Went and looked at the 92 ES, it has 116k miles, 1 owner, traded in for a new car. Bought at the same dealership so they had all the work done there too. Looks really nice except somebody smoked in it and nomatter how you febreeze and clean the car, it doesn't smell like smoke but it has that scent to it, not a normal lexus scent. Other than that I like it. My head kind of brushes the ceiling, but I didn't drive it and find a good seat position because my dad wasn't with me. I'll let you know how the search goes as I looka t more cars!

[blake918]

My head kind of brushes the ceiling

How tall are you? If you are any taller than about 6 feet, definantly skip the ES. I'm 6'3, and driving the ES is not very fun for me. The leg room is what kills me; I can lay the seat back to a good enough angle so that my head doesn't hit the roof. That's why I convinced by parents to buy me the LS. I can't say that there is tons of room in the LS either, but I am sufficiently comfortable driving it, and the tilt/tele wheel that the LS has also helps a lot. For max head and legroom, look at the new Beetle(not so reliable though!) or Lincoln TC I skiped those because I'm a 17y/o guy and I don't think I'd want to be seen in either of those cars(maybe the TC latter on. lol)!

[TMaxxTim]

I test drove the ES Today...with the sunroof visor open I have more headroom, but I definately don't fit THAT well in it. The ES I saw is a very nice one, always maintained at the dealer, 116k for a 92. $6900 is a little much for it thought I still think.

I saw an LS at a local luxury used car dealer. This isn't a crap side of the road, they buy nice cars, clean them up and sell them again. It was a 93 LS 400 with 140k on it. Black leather (very nice looking, no rips or very worn spots), tinted windows all the way around, chrome lexus rims. The want $6900 for it also, but the 93 has passenger airbag and better brakes and bigger tires. I looked at the wholesale on it, its about $4315 (for excellent). And the trade in for my accord is $850-$1315 (depending on whether the dealer deems it poor or fair). I'm hoping I can get the $6900 car to at least around $5500 to $5750, and maybe $1000 for my trade in so hopefully I'll only be spending $4500 on it. I'd much rather do that than and get a car 3 years newer.

The LS does have traction control, no air suspension (good!), but no nakamichi sound system, I'll probably wire the one out of my accord into it though.

They weren't there today when I looked at it but hopeuflly I can go by tomorrow and test drive it and look at any maintainance records on it.

[90LS400Lexus]

I test drove the ES Today...with the sunroof visor open I have more headroom, but I definately don't fit THAT well in it. The ES I saw is a very nice one, always maintained at the dealer, 116k for a 92. $6900 is a little much for it thought I still think.

I saw an LS at a local luxury used car dealer. This isn't a crap side of the road, they buy nice cars, clean them up and sell them again. It was a 93 LS 400 with 140k on it. Black leather (very nice looking, no rips or very worn spots), tinted windows all the way around, chrome lexus rims. The want $6900 for it also, but the 93 has passenger airbag and better brakes and bigger tires. I looked at the wholesale on it, its about $4315 (for excellent). And the trade in for my accord is $850-$1315 (depending on whether the dealer deems it poor or fair). I'm hoping I can get the $6900 car to at least around $5500 to $5750, and maybe $1000 for my trade in so hopefully I'll only be spending $4500 on it. I'd much rather do that than and get a car 3 years newer.

The LS does have traction control, no air suspension (good!), but no nakamichi sound system, I'll probably wire the one out of my accord into it though.

They weren't there today when I looked at it but hopeuflly I can go by tomorrow and test drive it and look at any maintainance records on it.

Black is a good color on these cars. My aunts LS400 is black and it really looks nice- much better than the awful ( I think ) dark walnut metallic on my LS400. $4300 sounds about right on the wholesale, because I think my car wholesales for $3300 - KBB private party is still $3800, although edmunds shows barely $2500, because they like to deduct $2000 for a 14 year old car with 232K.

I think I would have a difficult time getting the $4000 I paid for my car, so I have decided to advertise it for $3500. If I cannot get at least that for it- I will let it rot in the driveway. :D

Remember to check all of the items on the 93 that you know about- climate control LCD, A/C operation, front end noise (clunks, squeaks, groans), vibrations, instrument panel lights, etc.

Good luck!!

[SW03ES]

I know some people think 17 year olds don't need these kinds of cars, but I've never had a speeding ticket or wreck (knock on wood) and some of my friends have been in an accident AND have had 2 or more speeding tickets!!

Thats not what I'm saying at all. When I was 16 I got a brand new $40,000 Explorer Limited. I don't buy into this stuff about kids being "given" things and that it automatically turns them into a terror that doesn't understand the value of money. That may be true for some, but I'm a case in point. At 19 I started my own business, on my own initiative, while in college even though I was handed an expensive car when I turned 16. It all depends on the person and its up to the parents to decide what they want to do and what they can afford. I knew a kid in high school, his mother drove an old Taurus wagon, his father drove an old Escort. He turns 16 and they buy him a brand new 3 series BMW coupe. He did what I knew he would, totalled it in 2 months. Each instance is a case by case deal that we really can't understand or judge.

What *I'M* saying is that you've got to be smart. Nobody needs to drive a Lexus. Its a luxury item just like nobody NEEDS to wear polo clothing or have a coach wallet. They sell clothes at wal mart and wallets too. We all have to make decisions about what is important to us in life, and make smart decisions on what we can and cannot afford at any particular time. Even if we can afford something we have to decide if we WANT to afford it. A lot of people get caught up in "gasp a kid in a Lexus, MY GOD!" I'm realistic, it may be a Lexus but now at however many years old its a $4000 car. What we're trying to make you understand is that even though you're buying a $4000 car, you're buying one that has maintenance requirements and costs of a $60,000 car. All of the parts are priced to be sold to owners that can afford $60,000 cars, not owners that can afford $4000 cars. THATS what you need to realize. Now, I have no doubt that you can afford to buy the parts, but what you must ask yourself is do you WANT to? I've seen many friends of mine, especially when I was your age, miss out on so much fun that we were all having, because they had to work their butts off to buy shocks. No car is worth that. You're only 17 once in your life, you're going to own cars until you die. Plenty of time to own a Lexus, not plenty of time to be 17.

Think of it like buying a Ferrari, only on a much smaller scale. You can buy an older Ferrari for $30-40,000. A lot of people think "Wow, I can buy this Ferrari or Rolls Royce for what I would pay for a new car, its WAY better!". Well, that $40,000 Ferrari is still a Ferrari, and it costs tens of thousands of dollars to maintain a ferrari. Some people I know with them pay as much as $10-15,000 a year even though the original purchase might not have been what some people think.

Don't get caught up in telling yourself that the reason you're buying it is because its safe or has good power in an inconspicuous package. Plenty of cheaper to maintain cars have all of those things. You just need to be sure that you're ready and fully aware of what you're buying into. You've got to be prepared for that car to need several thousand dollars worth of work, and work you can't do like replacing motor mounts and stuff like that. There's a guy on the ES board, I think he's low 20s, just put his 92 ES300 in the shop for an oil change and a general inspection, it needs $6000 worth of work he didn't know it needed (some of it he did). He's now selling it.

[TMaxxTim]

I wasn't saying you were implying that. I'd much rather have a LExus though that when something does break, its few and far between (if I purchase a nice one in the first place), instead of a Ford Taurus with 100k+ on it that I am replacing parts every month on. I think the $75 pre-purchase inspection will be well worth it when I find a car that looks nice.

The $6900 one I found looks to be kept in excellent condition and I'm going to go tomorrow and look at it again, ask about it, service, etc. on it.

[SW03ES]

Don't expect it to be so few and far between. Lexus are very reliable but they are hardly bulletproof like some people seem to think, especially older ones. Also don't expect that something else is going to have parts breaking all the time. Tauruses are okay, but there are plenty of other cars in your price range. Accords, Camries, Maximas, all of these vehicles are going to be more reliable than a Taurus and be much cheaper to maintain than a Lexus. Not to mention they'll wind up being 5-6 years newer.

[90LS400Lexus]

Don't expect it to be so few and far between. Lexus are very reliable but they are hardly bulletproof like some people seem to think, especially older ones. Also don't expect that something else is going to have parts breaking all the time. Tauruses are okay, but there are plenty of other cars in your price range. Accords, Camries, Maximas, all of these vehicles are going to be more reliable than a Taurus and be much cheaper to maintain than a Lexus. Not to mention they'll wind up being 5-6 years newer.

I agree with SW03ES- these cars have their fair share of problems. Any car, with age is going to start having problems, no matter the mileage. These days, even low mileage, newer cars have plenty of problems. These cars are however, one of the most reliable cars on the road. Also agreed, that the Camry, Accord, Avalon (baby Lexus, so to speak?), as well as the Altima and Maxima, from the mid 1980s thru the mid 90s would all be in your price range, all excellent cars and much cheaper to work on- not to mention that they are all nice looking cars. The Avalon is a very good car, but it may have styling that you may not like. Many think that the styling on these cars (especially the first 95-97 models) have rather plain styling, but you still get a nice, reliable car with a powerful V6 engine. Actually, this car (Avalon) would be a excellent alternative to the Lexus ES300, because parts would be much cheaper, simply because it has a "Toyota" badge, rather than a "Lexus" badge. You can get a very nice 1995-1997 Avalon somewhere between $4000-$6000 range.

I now have second thoughts about buying my 90 LS400. I only paid $4000 for it last year- it had 223K when it bought it. Now it has 232K and has some items needing attention, that I am not keen about paying the high prices to repair. A/C = $800 repair, front struts/bushings = $500?. $1300 does not sound like much, but when I pay $1300, I would have already invested $5300+ the $200 last year for rear struts ($5500) in a 14 year old Lexus with nearly 232,000 miles. Can I sell it for that? No. I have it advertised for $3500 and have had no callers at all. I guess partly because of the high mileage. Like someone else here said, many people are terrified of high mileage.

One of my grandpas are one of them. He will not keep a car past 100K, but you cannot always go by mileage. I remember back in 1990, he bought a brand new top of the line Mazda B2600 extended cab truck- loaded to the maximum. He changed the oil every 2000 miles, constantly kept it in the garage and kept it in immaculate condition. He decided to trade it in 1993, when it had only 22K miles, for a JUNKY 1988 Chrysler New Yorker Landau Mark Cross edition, with 56K miles and he paid the extra money, because the car was higher priced than the trade-in they gave him for the truck. He did not consult with any of us, or we would have told him it was a mistake because- CHRYSLER-DODGE-PLYMOUTH- newer than 1976 are typically junk. Car started falling apart at 77K. He had engine rebuilt, transmission rebuilt, power steering pump, water pump, radiator, headgaskets (twice), electrical problems galore. About the only good thing about it, is that it was powerful and had a ride like you was on a cloud. It had the air suspension too and it was actually the only good thing on the car. He spent about $10,000 on the car in repairs and it was still unreliable. Finally traded it in on a Buick LeSabre and it has been a much better car, but it has about 90K now and he is considering to trade it now. So basically, some good cars have high mileage and some bad cars have low mileage, but remember when you want to sell, the higher mileage car may be harder to resell.

In conclusion, if you really want a Lexus, you will probably not be happy with any other car until you get one. Just make sure you get a good one.

Good luck.

[SW03ES]

Yeah I'm not afraid of high mileage but what most people don't understand is a car is never going to be free to run. If you buy a new car then you don't have repair costs and nowadays with a lot of car companies you don't have maintenance costs as its all included, but you have payments. But then the car is paid for and you dont have payments, but the maintenance is no longer free and the repairs start to begin, you need tires and brakes, higher mileage maintenances. I leased this Lexus and I may or may not buy it out of the lease at the end. As it is now though I'll probably keep leasing them as I'd prefer to always make a payment then to have to worry about the car needing unexpected expensive repairs. That and I just like driving a new car LOL.

I'll definately get another Lexus unless they don't offer free scheduled maintenance. If they don't I'll probably have to get something else, maybe that new Cadillac STS. I have a feeling they will though.

[90LS400Lexus]

Yeah I'm not afraid of high mileage but what most people don't understand is a car is never going to be free to run. If you buy a new car then you don't have repair costs and nowadays with a lot of car companies you don't have maintenance costs as its all included, but you have payments. But then the car is paid for and you dont have payments, but the maintenance is no longer free and the repairs start to begin, you need tires and brakes, higher mileage maintenances. I leased this Lexus and I may or may not buy it out of the lease at the end. As it is now though I'll probably keep leasing them as I'd prefer to always make a payment then to have to worry about the car needing unexpected expensive repairs. That and I just like driving a new car LOL.

I'll definately get another Lexus unless they don't offer free scheduled maintenance. If they don't I'll probably have to get something else, maybe that new Cadillac STS. I have a feeling they will though.

Those new Cadillacs are very nice cars. I like the new DeVille, but some still may consider it a "old persons" car, depsite that they are much sportier than the DeVilles of the previous generations. My favorite new Cadillac is the Escalade ESV (extended model). I saw a new Escalade ESV Platinum Edition on *-Bay, starting at $70,000. Sticker price was nearing the $72K mark. $71,995 if I recall. Really nothing more than a ultra luxurious Suburban, but they are still very nice SUVs, but I have a liking for SUVs. Some people still hate them, because of their size. $72000 is a little too rich for me to pay for an automobile. <_< Perhaps 10-12 years from now? ;) I imagine that you can get a new 04' Escalade base model (standard length) for around $50K. Not sure about the price on the extended length base model. $60K perhaps?

I also bet that Lexus will still offer the free maintainence.

[TMaxxTim]

Drove that LS 400 today, they have the price at $6500 cash now. Drove it with my dad...very very very nice car. Leather in tip top shape, engine in tip top shape, very smooth, no stumble or rumble in the engine at all, nothing bad about the car at all. New tires. They say they are going to fix these before they sell it but it has the check engine light on and the TRAC OFF light always stays on, maybe the two are related.

My dad goes "alright, find out how much my car is worth, I want one of these" (He has a 2002 Escape).

I also started the 94 525i they had, the engine was louder inside...and the interior felt cheaper. When the A/C Turned on I felt a big jerk in the engine.

The 325i I looked at and test drove...I liked that car too, GREAT handling, but it is not nearly as comfortable to drive as the LS. I'm so glad I test drove it again.

BTW, the LS I test drove had a hidden radar detector in it...not sure what kind or anthing but had 2 red lights next to the steering collum and beeped at the same spot leaving the dealer and coming back in. It has new tires on it too.

[1UZ-FE]

sounds like a winner!! just make sure to follow through with the pre-purchase inspection. I did that on my car and they found things i never even thought to look at and couldn't (knowlegde limited). sure does sound like one hell of a deal though. good luck!

[TMaxxTim]

Yeah, it'd be at least a week or so before I can really start negotiating for it with my dad. He says a LS 400 is too much car for me, but I have a week to pull him over. I'm going to look at a 90 LS for $4900 and a 92 LS for $5900 and see how those compare (they probably won't, but what the heck!).

The only thing I love about the LS I drove was the black leather inside of it....seems very more luxurious and sporty at the same time over a tan or grey interior.

[90LS400Lexus]

Drove that LS 400 today, they have the price at $6500 cash now.  Drove it with my dad...very very very nice car.  Leather in tip top shape, engine in tip top shape, very smooth, no stumble or rumble in the engine at all, nothing bad about the car at all.  New tires.  They say they are going to fix these before they sell it but it has the check engine light on and the TRAC OFF light always stays on, maybe the two are related.

My dad goes "alright, find out how much my car is worth, I want one of these" (He has a 2002 Escape).

I also started the 94 525i they had, the engine was louder inside...and the interior felt cheaper.  When the A/C Turned on I felt a big jerk in the engine.

The 325i I looked at and test drove...I liked that car too, GREAT handling, but it is not nearly as comfortable to drive as the LS.  I'm so glad I test drove it again.

BTW, the LS I test drove had a hidden radar detector in it...not sure what kind or anthing but had 2 red lights next to the steering collum and beeped at the same spot leaving the dealer and coming back in.  It has new tires on it too.

Sounds like a good car. I would skip on the BMW 5-series. 3-series- MAYBE. If you do buy a BMW- stick with the 3-series, or 7-series, but parts will be extremely expensive. My cousin has a 1991 BMW 735i and it is a very reliable car, but parts (when needed) are outrageous. Her son has a late 80s BMW 5-series and it has not been quite as bulletproof, but still a good car. Another cousin in Richmond has a 1985 BMW 633i coupe. Its a good car too, but very high parts cost. Even higher than Lexus.

Just be sure that those items are properly repaired on the LS400 before puchase, unless they offer a very generous discount. :)

This was a similar story on my LS. When I first test drove- it had a miss at idle. Took it back and told salesman. He said he was unaware. He said he would have it looked at though. I called a couple of days later he said it was repaired. The plug wires were shot. Run like new on 2nd test drive and then I bought it.

Good luck.

[vyhanh]

The hidden radar detector is a K40. The control for it may be mounted inside the center console/armrest. The left indicator on the panel is for the front and the right indicator is for the rear detector. The control has 2 settings: city and out of city. It also has a loudness setting

[TMaxxTim]

Sweet, I already have a passport 8500, but I guess I could get rid of it if the one in the car works. I'll have to tell my dad its a part of the security system...

Now to eBay my Canon GL2 to get some $$$

[SW03ES]

The Cadillac I'm talking about is the new STS:

Nothing else Cadillac has made interests me in the slightest. The Escalade is overstyled, the CTS is ugly, the XLR is rediculously priced, the Deville is bubbly, old mannish, and poorly constructed. This car though looks great, I can't wait to drive one and see if its actually BUILT great like a Lexus. It already beat the BMW 5 series and Benz E class in comparison tests. Its a real second coming for Cadillac.

Glad you liked the LS ;)

[90LS400Lexus]

They are nice automobiles. One of the nicest Cadillacs. I also like the CTS. If I recall, it looks very similar, but I think it is a little smaller than the STS you show there. At first, I did not like the DeVille of current, but it kind of grew on me.

I just like the Escalade, because I like the large SUV's. For the money- I would be happier with the Suburban and the styling is much more conservative.

[TMaxxTim]

Looked at 2 more

$3900 for a 90 with a little paint peeling off the bumper, 212k miles. Everythign looked nice, but I think the battery was dead, woulnd't start and nothing lit up at all, only the steering wheel moved slowly into place. The inside wheel well for the front left was missing (plastic covering peice). Probably means quarterpanel was replaced. Looks like its been sitting for awhile as the rotors were rusted.

Saw another white one down the road, $6250 with 144k on it. White smoke poured out the back on start, my car does that and its bad o-rings. He didn't seem to want to budge much on that car because he said everybody at the dealer drives it and loves it, if they don't get that price they'll jsut keep it. The seat springs are definately broken because I sat in it and it just popped to the bottom.

Now I REALLY like that $6500 white with black leather one I test drove. I think the reason the TRAC OFF and check engine light are on is an 02 sensor (looked at some past posts). Maybe I can use that as a good bargaining point, just tell em it doesn't need to be fixed.

Now I just need to sell my Canon GL2 for about $1850!!!

[93LSOwner]

The Cadillac Escalade are the best looking SUVs ever built, I would buy one over any Lexus SUV made today except for the LX (maybe.....maybe not). There sharp looks are what impresses me the most. I dont' think anybody would want a big piece of metal with a huge engine in it, I mean who buys SUVs for there ruggedness!!!only looks and styles count.

[SW03ES]

Eh, to me they're just overdone. Personally I don't want to own something "rappers" buy and put 24's on so they can "pimp they hoes" LOL. I'd rather have a Navigator. I saw one today at the Cadillac dealer (picked up a brochure on the new STS), just overdone.

[blake918]

Personally I don't want to own something "rappers" buy and put 24's on so they can "pimp they hoes" LOL. I'd rather have a Navigator.

LOL, me too! Pimp they hoes....LMAO!!!! The Caddy badges the size 45's fore and aft are rediculous on the Escalade. And, like almost every other Caddy, there are just too many lines--hard ones. I love the look and all of the gadgets in the Navi. The only Caddy I like is the Current DeVille. I love the exterior-it's smooth and flowing, and the led tail lights are very nice, but then, GM ruins it with their plasticy, "rubbermaid interior."(I forget what car mag came up with that quote, but it's great!) I don't like any others-especially the CTS and the SRX( whose rear end is laughable)! There's not a chance that I'd pay $80k for a Caddy XLR when I could get a Merc SL500(for another $10k) or SC430(with an extra $15k in my pocket!).

Steve, I'm stunned to hear that you want to trade your ES for a Caddy! Are you dissatisfied with it, or are you ready for something different?

[SW03ES]

Have you seen the pics of the new STS I posted above? Much better looking than the current CTS and SRX "Art and Science" designs. First Cadillac I've found appealing in a really long time. I just thumbed through the brochure and all I kept saying was "This is a Cadillac?!?" lol.

As for trading mine on one, notime soon. I MIGHT consider something else when I trade my car in 2007 or 2008 if Lexus still doesn't have free scheduled maintenance (Caddy does starting this year, as do BMW and Benz, Lincoln, Jaguar, Audi) but I'm still 110% satisfied with my Lexus. I have a feeling in the next couple of years Lexus will have to jump on the bandwagon with free maintenance.

The caddy saleswoman has one coming in in a couple days and she's going to call me so I can drive it. Can't wait to see if its all hype or if it actually is built as well as a Lexus. I'm guessing its going to be much better, but not up to Lexus quality yet. Even the saleswoman admitted that at a briefing yesterday when she drove the new STS next to the LS430 she still thought the LS430's interior was nicer. She did add though that it was still almost $10,000 more. I was a little bit dissapointed that you can't get things like the magnetic ride control or xenon headlamps on the V6 STS like you can get those higher line options on lower model Lexus' like the ES and the GS3.