2004 Ls403 Recall + Transmission Lag

[Arnold Green]

As of this posting, my 04 LS 430 (with 12,000 miles) is in for the transmission and fuel pump recalls. From day 1, I have been complaining about the hesitation when I try to accellerate from 10 MPH. I've been to 2 dealers (in MA and FL) who tell me there's nothing wrong. The last explanation: This is a built-in hesitation to prevent accidental acceleration at low speeds. Can you believe that? My previous 3 cars were LS 400's and there had never been a problem like this. The service writer indicated that the new transmission would not cure this problem. The $200 compensation for the inconvenience was never mentioned. Could this be something the local dealer implemented?

There is another problem that bugs me. (Also never had this with the LS 400's.) The bolsters on the seat bottom are hard and unyielding and make driving painful. (Again, Lexus says there's nothing wrong.) I am not considered to be "broad of beam" but the seat exerts unusual pressure on my thighs and after a half hour of driving, I'm in pain. I have fashioned a seat cusion which raises me up about 1 inch and this helps. But I don't think this is appropriate for such an expensive car. I drove a Kia Optima rental car for 2 weeks and didn't have this problem. My wife's Passat has a comfortable seat, too.

Is there anyone else out there with these problems? Have they been fixex? Any suggestions?

Arnold

[SW03ES]

The transmission hesitation is found on all Lexus cars with electronic throttles. My dad had a 98 LS400 before his 04 LS430, it had the hesitation and so does his new one, so does my ES300.

As for the seat, have you tried adjusting the legnth of the seat bottom?

[itmdtr]

It's called drive by wire, some people "feel" the lag and still others feel nothing.

Just wait until brake by wire is introduced, (is Benz using this already?)

Lets just hope they'll stay away from steering...

[SW03ES]

BMW is, the 7 series has brake by wire. No hydraulic brakes.

[MikeP]

It's called drive by wire, some people "feel" the lag and still others feel nothing.

Just wait until brake by wire is introduced, (is Benz using this already?)

Lets just hope they'll stay away from steering...

←

I think Mercedes Benz first used electrinic braking on the current E-Class and the SL. BMW still uses hydrolic brakes, I'm almost positive. Mercedes' electronic braking system uses a hydrolic backup in case of a malfunction. There is a rumor that Mercedes will stop using the electronic braking system because of some problems and many customers do not like the somewhat artificial feel.

Mike

[MikeP]

electrinic = electronic

hydrolic = hydraulic

Sorry for the dumb spelling errors.

Mike

[TallTimber]

I bought my '04 LS430 in May.

I only have 4,000 miles on it, but I haven't had ANY of the problems you guys are talking about. I also haven't received any notice of a Recall.

Is it ALL '04s or just certain Serial Numbers?

[MikeP]

I bought my '04 LS430 in May.

I only have 4,000 miles on it, but I haven't had ANY of the problems you guys are talking about.  I also haven't received any notice of a Recall.

Is it ALL '04s or just certain Serial Numbers?

←

I believe the recall affected cars built prior to 1/1/04. You can verify if your car is included in the recall by calling Lexus Customer Relations.

Mike

[Illinois]

As of this posting, my 04 LS 430 (with 12,000 miles) is in for the transmission and fuel pump recalls.  From day 1, I have been complaining about the hesitation when I try to accellerate from 10 MPH.  I've been to 2 dealers (in MA and FL) who tell me there's nothing wrong.  The last explanation:  This is a built-in hesitation to prevent accidental acceleration at low speeds.  Can you believe that?  My previous 3 cars were LS 400's and there had never been a problem like this.  The service writer indicated that the new transmission would not cure this problem.  The $200 compensation for the inconvenience was never mentioned.  Could this be something the local dealer implemented?

There is another problem that bugs me.  (Also never had this with the LS 400's.)  The bolsters on the seat bottom are hard and unyielding and make driving painful.  (Again, Lexus says there's nothing wrong.) I am not considered to be "broad of beam" but the seat exerts unusual pressure on my thighs and after a half hour of driving, I'm in pain.  I have fashioned a seat cusion which raises me up about 1 inch and this helps.  But I don't think this is appropriate for such an expensive car.  I drove a Kia Optima rental car for 2 weeks and didn't have this problem.  My wife's Passat has a comfortable seat, too.

Is there anyone else out there with these problems?  Have they been fixex?  Any suggestions?

Arnold

←

[SW03ES]

I bought my '04 LS430 in May.

I only have 4,000 miles on it, but I haven't had ANY of the problems you guys are talking about.  I also haven't received any notice of a Recall.

Is it ALL '04s or just certain Serial Numbers?

←

You may never notice the hesitation, most people don't. It depends on your driving style.

[Illinois]

Does anyone have definitive information on the $200 voucher some owners have received following the transmission "fix"...........is it a dealer option, or is this a Lexus Corporate action which will eventually find its way to all 430 owners who return the vehicles for the recall work? I was in for repair a couple of weeks ago.........no noticeable difference in performance......including the ever present "lag"!!!

[SW03ES]

Lexus corporate should mail it to you, my dad got it a couple months after he got his done.

[90LS400Lexus]

Thanks SW. Strange that the cars without it do not have the "lag". Why did they change it anyway? I guess her 04' S600 does not have it like you said.

But like you said- it depends on how you drive......

I don't believe Mercedes has one yet...

Like I said though, not everyone experiences it. it really depends on how you drive.

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Does the 2004 Mercedes S600 (V-12) have the electronic throttle?

I do not recall my aunt complaining about it, but perhaps she has not noticed?

[SW03ES]

I don't think any Mercedes vehicles have electronic throttles because of the drivability issues some owners have. Not sure about that though.

[texagun]

'Its not actually a transmission lag, its a throttle response lag. Every Lexus behaves that way, as does every other car with an electronic throttle. Its an inherant "characteristic" of electronic throttles."

NOT TRUE! My Mercedes E-430 has an electronic throttle and it exibits no throttle lag whatsoever. This issue is inherent with the Lexus and is the only reason I will not buy one. I admire the quality of the brand, but this problem keeps me from buying one. The MB is a joy to drive...but I suspect the quality of the Lexus is superior, except for this throttle lag/transmission lag problem. Every Lexus forum on the net is aware of this issue. For me, it is a SAFETY ISSUE.

[SW03ES]

I wasn't aware that MBs had electronic throttles but I've heard people complain about them in BMWs and Audis. Like I've said, not everyone notices the hesitation and I'd assume not all systems are the same.

[texagun]

Its not only Japanese engineering though, I've felt the lag on Jaguars, BMWs, Audis...

←

For what it's worth, I have a Mercedes 2001 E-430 and a BMW 2003 530i, both with electronic throttles, and neither one has this hesitation problem at all. This deficiency in the Lexus is the only reason I don't own one. I consider it a safety issue and it will probably take a huge class-action lawsuit to make Lexus fix it....very unfortunate for an other-wise excellent car. :(

[hatchback]

FYI, there's a TSB for the 2004 LS430 relating to transmission tip-in (or something like that) which improves the responsiveness of the car to throttle application.

[SW03ES]

Its not only Japanese engineering though, I've felt the lag on Jaguars, BMWs, Audis...

←

For what it's worth, I have a Mercedes 2001 E-430 and a BMW 2003 530i, both with electronic throttles, and neither one has this hesitation problem at all. This deficiency in the Lexus is the only reason I don't own one. I consider it a safety issue and it will probably take a huge class-action lawsuit to make Lexus fix it....very unfortunate for an other-wise excellent car. :(

←

Well, thats your perogative but I had a client with a 2004 530i that had a very pronounced transmission hesitation.

[FastXTC]

After this TSB was performed on my 2004 LS 430, the throttle tip-in response became more responsive and uniform at city speeds. I could tell no difference in throttle response at highway speeds.

Make : LEXUS Model : LS 430 Year : 2004

Manufacturer : TOYOTA MOTOR NORTH AMERICA, INC.

Service Bulletin Num : 00604 Date of Bulletin: DEC 06, 2004

NHTSA Item Number: 10011870

Component: POWER TRAIN

Summary: ECM CALIBRATION. SHIFTING ENHANCEMENTS. *TT

[texagun]

Well, thats your perogative but I had a client with a 2004 530i that had a very pronounced transmission hesitation.

←

I would sure like to see some documentation on that. I'm on my 2nd BMW with electronic throttles and have never experienced it. I also follow several BMW forums and have never seen the issue discussed or complained about on any of them. Someone always "has a friend" that has the problem...I'm more interested in first-hand experiences that are verifiable.

[SW03ES]

LOL I dont have any documentation, I've driven it and it hesitates. It irritates the hell out of her. What do you want, a signed statement or a lie detector test? If you dont want to believe me, then don't. I have neither the ability nor the desire to prove that I've experienced this hesitation in this and other BMWs to you.

Look around this board, there are MANY Lexus owners that also feel their cars don't have this hesitation.

The fact of the matter is whether or not you feel the hesitation is very dependent on how you drive. As I've said before I've adapted my driving and the hesitation no longer bothers me.

My point is going to a different brand wont neccisarily calm your hesitation concerns. I've heard complaints from BMW owners, Audi owners, Ford owners, Nissan owners, Acura owners, Toyota owners etc etc etc.

I PERSONALLY have driven and experienced the same hesitation in BMWs, Audis, Acuras, and Nissans.

Like I said before, if you dont want to believe me thats fine but I have no interest in trying to prove that these cars have this hesitation to you. You dont own a Lexus, so how is me saying these cars have the hesitation any different than you saying the Lexus does? Maybe you should prove to me that the Lexus has the hesitation and the BMW doesn't. How are you going to do that? You can't thats why I wouldn't ask you to provide "documentation" of your experiences because its not possible.

As for forums I have heard the hesitation discussed on BMW forums, Acura forums, Ford forums, Nissan forums. For whatever reason its not discussed as much as here, but its barely discussed on CL either. It all depends on what type of owner a particular site gets, we tend to get more real world owners where CL and the other sites out there tend to get more enthusiasts maybe thats the difference.

Am I going to go search every forum I've ever read looking for those posts? Again no, I dont have the time. You're welcome to do that if you'd like.

Documentation, sheesh.

[larryp]

Steve - Right on!

Tex - Why are you here?

[nc211]

The reason why you don't see them complaining about this on the bmw sites is because they're too busy complaining about all the other stuff, like electrical, exhuast and so forth....BMW stands for Better Maintain Weekly. Have had 3 in my family circle of trust, 89 325ci, 97 525, 2004 745. All three have displayed the electrical integrity of what I would image a Russian built Dodge Shadow would have. Well, you get the point. Throttle tip in does exist in the Toyota brand. It has for several years. It's really about the only complaint you can honestly have about the cars. Others are just personal. If you want to experience the tip in on your BMW, set that I-control thingy to turn on your interior lights, lower your back right window about 2/3 the way down and engage your cigerette lighter. That should confuse the computer enough to think it's ready. BUT by all means, don't adjust your driver's seat at the same time, you might engage the air bags and ejector seat.

Just playin'!

Cheer:

[texagun]

Steve - Right on!

Tex - Why are you here?

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Because, as I've said in nearly every previous post, I think the Lexus is probably the best quality car out there......EXCEPT for the throttle/transmission lag problem that has been readily apparent on every Lexus I have test-driven. I would love to buy one....as soon as they resolve a problem that appears to be universal and ignored by the Lexus Corporation. If they have attempted various fixes, from what I have read, none of them have worked. I have chosen to drive 2 cars that don't have that problem...I still admire the Lexus products......that's why I'm here. Is that OK with you? :P