sv7887

Hi all, You've just illustrated my point. You shouldn't have to do any of those things to insure you have a good service experience. That is no way to run a company of any sort. I, too am an informed customer and have to take similar steps to ensure the job is done properly. My point is that this shouldn't happen to begin with..This isn't some backstreet repair shop, it's a Lexus dealer charging you top dollar. If someone wants to charge me top dollar, then I expect my experience to reflect what I paid for. They routinely give me a 10% discount on parts and labor. This past time the Asst Service Manager reduced the Fan Clutch and Thermostat repair from $600 to $375 in light of the thousands I've spent in Service over the past year. That is called Service, and he's the only reason I continue to go to that dealership and let them off easy for what they messed up last time. While I don't advocate being unreasonable, I do think they need to reminded who they are working for from time to time. While I'm not hostile with them, they know I have high expectations given what I pay. That isn't backed up by any "goodwill" but the threat of action if things are not done properly. It's become an adversarial relationship solely due to their own actions in the past. I shouldn't have to deal with Service Writer pushing for $4,000 in unneeded suspension work, charging me $2,250 and NOT fixing the problem, giving me a car with Trim pieces shoved underneath the hood? Repairs done of such poor quality I had to return to the dealer 7 times to get it done right? Body work done by their contractor that peels within a year? Or should I have to deal with Service Managers who claim they will continue to change parts at will and charge me $$$ for it. (This is after collecting $3,000!!) Fool me once Shame on You, Fool me Twice, Shame on Me! Sam

Hi Everyone, I share dcfish's sentiments. I have found that Lexus dealers have earned their reputation as "Stealers" on this board. I have had numerous run-ins with the dealership over the poor quality of repairs and outright attempts to rip me off. In my experience with Boston-area Lexus dealerships, I see no difference between them and any other make. They are simply more "polished" than others. (i.e. Cheat you with a smile or diplomatically dismiss your concerns when you question their judgement..) The Service Manager at the local dealership doesn't even trust his other mechanics with my car. He only allows the Shop Foreman to work on it. I can go in depth on how their "other" mechanics have botched repairs for hours. He's apologized to me on several occasions for the acts of his overzealous Service Writers. Nice guy, too bad the ownership won't give him the power he needs to clean house. The only reason they take me seriously is because of my ownership history and the fact I have a track record of successfully prosecuting both area Lexus dealers when they tried to cheat me in the past. When I pay $100/hr I expect a) A quality repair B) Not to be fleeced c) People who tell me the truth d) No bush league used car repair tactics. I'm not very sympathetic with the dealers at all. I was just at one of their recommended Body Shops and saw them painting a brand new ES330 (Price Sticker and Plastic wrappings and all)..Think they are going to tell the owner? No...This wasn't a one time event either. I've seen them painting brand new cars on a regular basis. I'm a Management Consultant and my clients demand an A+ job every time. That's what they pay for. I would never treat my client as the Lexus dealers around here do. There is no excuse for this sort of behavior! Sam

Hi All, I think Bob was stating fact in his post. He was merely stating fact with regard to his Professional Experience with the repair of both American and Lexus cars. I can point to 15 years of JD Power Statistics that will back up everything he said. After all Lexus banks its' reputation on reliability. It is a common FACT that the LS series is the most reliable car on the road. As per the original post..It is hard to appreciate the LS400/430 while you own it. Try renting a car 6 months after owning your LS400. You'll definitely notice it then. I drive a Toyota Corolla to work Monday to Friday. Driving the Lexus on Sunday is a real treat. You fall in love with the car all over again. It's like the saying goes, "You'll never realize what you had until you lost it.." Happy New Year to Everyone!! Sam

Hi All, Well said. I agree with you. The only thing that really bothers me is the breakdown of the Steering Rack and this latest Fan Clutch. If I'm not mistaken these are common components to all cars. It's weird to be experiences these sort of repairs. What other things should I be looking out for? Money isn't an issue, I'll pay what it takes to make this car Show Car quality. I've already spent $3,500 on cosmetics and mechanicals. The only things I haven't addressed yet: 1) Exhaust System..I'm guessing at 13 yrs old it needs to be done sooner or later 2) Alternator.. 3) Transmission Mount (Engine Mounts were already done) 4) Fuel Pump, I've heard about this going about 200K Anything else I'm missing? I might tell the dealer to hold on to it, and get the Shop Foreman to inspect it to look for any additional issues. The only reason I got upset is that this is the second trip I've made to the dealer in 6 weeks, after spending all that money!! Sam

Hi All, The point is that a Lexus costing in excess of $55K should outlast a "basic" Toyota considering they are built to a so called Higher Standard. The notion Quality and Luxury Cars are mutually exclusive is pure bunk. The Mercedes cars until 1992 are proof positive of this. This car should not be having the amount of problems given its mileage and repair history. SV

Hi Everyone, I took my car (1992 LS400) to the dealer to sort out this problem. Here is what they told me: 1) Air pocket in the cooling system 2) Thermostat 3) Clutch Fan wasn't engaging properly** (What is this? Are they talking about the actual Climate System Fan) The Shop Foreman is working on the car. We've had this car for 10 yrs, currently at 97K miles. We've spent several thousand dollars in Service over this period. It's garaged and detailed regularly. I'm not too impressed with the long term reliability of this car. I've seen ordinary Toyotas with 200K on the clock not needing the amount of attention that this car has. I've replaced the following so far - Timing Belt and Water Pump - Leaking LCD** @ 64K - Burnt Out Dash Cluster** @ 86K - Rear Shocks @ 64K - Power Steering Pump** @ 84K - Power Steering Rack** @ 96K - High Pressure Steering Hose @ 96K - Rear Carrier Bushings @ 96K - Stabilizer Bar Bushings (2x) @ 96K - Upper Control Arms (Later deemed not necessary by dealer and Refunded $$$) - Window Switch** @ 82K - Ball Joints - Rear View Mirror Not Working** (Replaced with a part from Wrecked LS) @ 96K - Wood Trim around Gearshift Cracked** @ 60K I can't say I'm overly impressed with the vaunted Lexus quality. I've owned 4 LS cars, this 92, a CPO 98 (was a compete disaster), a new '02 (Required replacement of the Steering Column, Rain Sensor 3 Times), and my new '05 (No problems yet) The items I marked with asterisks are those that I feel are not part of normal maintenance. I certainly have not had these issues on the other cars I've owned. I think the someone posted on another thread that his 85 S Class Mercedes had a better record. I'd concur with that. These repairs seem hardly normal for a car that has been garaged and pampered for the majority of its' life. I don't think my next car will be a Lexus considering my experiences thus far. For short term reliability most of the Competition will do nicely. For longer term reliability, I feel any Toyota would be better. I've known enough people with Camrys that run upwards of 200K without any of these "extra" issues. The list of repairs I've posted doesn't differ much from those posted by my colleagues in the Jaguar forums (XJ8). If you do some research the XJ's reliability has improved marketedly in the past ten years. Frankly I'm quite disappointed. Sam

Hi All, Glad to hear your fiancee is okay. Still, I'm sorry to hear she was hurt at all! I guess this underscores how important a criteria safety should be when buying a car. I got into a minor accident 2 years ago with my LS. (Some lady blew a Red and slammed into my Left Front Fender @ 20-25 MPH) The car barely moved and I walked away. I was too busy yelling at the other driver to realize I might have been injured had I been in a lesser car. I wonder how she might have been in a Side Airbag equipped LS400/430..I think the 98's have them. Sam yes its totaled. I was not driving the car my fiance was driving and the guy that hit her didnt have his lights on so she never saw him coming. She has two broken ribs a bruised sternham (hope i spelled that right ) and a punchured lung but she is recovering and everything is coming along well ←

Hi All, I checked my Coolant level and it was indeed low. Should I use a Specific Toyota fluid to fill it back up? Also, does the low fluid indicate a leak somewhere? I probably should have had all the hoses replaced by now. Sam

Hi All, No that really isn't typical. My 1992 has never had a problem with trim quality. These cars are built like tanks. Maybe someone damaged the corner lenses when trying to replace the lights. It's real easy to do if you aren't completely sure how to take them out. Keep in mind while these cars are well made, they are only as good as their owners. An abused LS will give you problems like any other car. Even an abused Rolls Royce will give you nothing but problems. That's more of a reason to be very cautious when buying a Pre Owned car. Ask for all the maintenance records. If it doesn't have a long service history, don't buy it. I have records for everything dating back to 1995 when we bought the car. Sam

Hi Everyone, I have a similar problem. I took out my LS today for the first time in ten days and the heat seemed to blow colder than usual. It wasn't blowing completely cold, but not very hot either. They replaced the Coolant Cap 5 years ago, and the entire coolant container three years ago. It's weird, last winter it was perfect. I'm wondering whether my incompetent dealer messed something up when they were working on the Steering Rack...Who knows? Sam

Hi Everyone, Got a few questions about my 92 LS. I don't drive it much these days, but when I start it it gives a loud squeak as soon as I turn the key. I had the Lexus dealer change the drive belts only a few months ago at 97K. The timing belt, water pump, and P/S pump were done at 84K. I hope it isn't anything too expensive. I use a Corolla as a daily driver now. I just had to spend an ungodly amount of $$$ replacing the Power Steering Rack, Rear Carrier Bushings, Upper Control Arm, Alignment, Leather redye of all seats, High Pressure P/S Hose, Front Stabilizer Bar Bushings, and Front Brakes. The last three were done by the dealer at No charge because I caught them lying about the Upper Control Arm. (Nothing was really wrong with it) I threatened to sue so they fixed those things to keep me quiet. In addition I replaced the cupholder and got the needles on the instrument cluster fixed. Also the dealer "refused" to replace the Fuel Filter claiming that the Fuel lines were Rusted. I've read enough posts here about people replacing their filters are much higher mileage than mine....Any thoughts? Thanks, Sam

nc211, I must respectfully disagree with you. I've been driving Rear Wheel Drive cars for over 35 years in places like Scotland, Buffalo, and now Boston. A RWD car fitted with snow tires will do the job, and rather well. I am bemused with sudden onslaught of AWD marketing. They make it sound as if you'll be stuck in your home if winter strikes..Much like a Pilot makes the Airplane, a Driver makes the car. If the driver is poor (As many are in my home city) all the technology and AWD are not going to help you. Keep in mind the majority of Taxis and Police cars are still Ford Crown Victorias. These are all RWD and probably lack the sophisticated tech that our Lexus cars have. I have all the confidence in the world in the winter performance of my 92 LS400 and my new LS430 Provided they are fitted with the proper snow tires! Sam

Hi All, I've been driving my Lexus cars for over 10 years in Boston winters. Buy yourself a set of Bridgestone Blizzak WS-50 tires. I used them on my 92 LS and now my 05 LS430. They are dynamite in the snow, I've never had a problem with them.. I do find that it is necessary to turn the Traction Control off when you are going up hills, as the Trac just cuts the power so you just sit there. Hope this helps, Sam

Max, Welcome to the forum! I've LS400/430 since they came out, and I can say you couldn't find a better car than this Lexus..I had a 1998 Certified Pre Owned and it suffered from various electrical problems with the dash. Lexus acknowledged that the early build 98's had a problem with the Information Center. It was common for the display to read, "Miles to Refuel: Empty" as well as flicker. They ended up giving me a new LS430 at cost as a settlement. I don't think the later builds had this problem. Keep in mind this is still a very expensive car to maintain. A 90k service can easily go $1500. Be aware of the Power Steering pump as well. The fluid does need to be changed from time to time. Suspension bushings are another issue, though not a very expensive one. On the plus size, the car is VERY fast. It has a similar verison of the engine that is in my LS430. (They both made 290 HP) I think this car isn't governed either to 131 MPH like the 430. (Isn't it a shame they limited it?) My 1998 had the Nakaminchi Stereo without the HID..I personally think the HID's look nice on this model, especially on a darker colored car. Hope this helps, Sam I've seen some 98 LS400s for $15k-18k.. I'd like to keep it under $17k if possible. I'd like to keep my payment as low as possible (who wouldn't?) ←

Hi Everyone, I had my Tach needle partially burnt out on my 1992 LS and got it replaced by Dash Electronics and Speedometer in Michigan. The guy I worked with was named Steve and he has a website www.dashusa.com..Great guy. He replaced the backlighting and refinished all four needles. I just got it back yesterday and it looks great in my LS. He charged me $350 plus $12 shipping by UPS. Sam

Npcomplete, Mobil 1 is a synthetic oil, and a pretty good one at that. The Toyota one is your basic standard oil. The Synthetic is supposed to offer better cold weather protection. Most of the engine wear occurs at startup, I think it would only make a difference if you operating the car in Alaska..Also, the Synthetic should last alot longer. People on the Jag boards have sent their synthetics for analysis and found it could have gone 10-15K miles easily. The bottleneck is really the oil filter here. It's a judgement call really. The Synthetic costs 3 times as much. One could argue frequent standard oil changes would be more useful. Mercedes uses Mobil 1 as standard on their S Classes, as do other automakers. I don't use it because I don't do much mileage on my cars and tend to change oil on the basis of time (Every 6 months). Hope this helps, Sam

Hi All, I had a similar dilemma a few months ago..Jaguars have this allure about them. They are undeniably beautiful looking cars..But all those good looks come at a serious price. I ended up getting another LS430, because of all the reliability issues of the foreign marques. LS cars will require fewer maintenance and are one of the few cars in the High end class not to get hit with the gas guzzler tax. Also it will hold its value better than any other car. If you treat an LS right, it will treat you right pure and simple. I've had my 1992 from new and it has been the best car I've ever owned, even better than my 3 other LS cars I've owned since then. If that's not enough to convince her, then take her to dealer and show her the level of customer service that a Lexus owner gets. Hope this helps, Sam

TNLX, I have a '92 Ls that had a similar problem. Initially I replaced the P/S Pump, but the problem was a leaking Power Steering Rack..I have to warn you as reliable as these cars are, they are subject to the same aging issues that affect any machine. Repairs can get very expensive on this car, so I highly encourage you to spend some money having the car inspected by a Lexus dealer before you buy it. If you go to www.lexls.com, you'll find a guide to dealing with the airbag light. It is a fantastic website authored by a '91 LS owner. Below is a link on how to remove the CD changer and send it out for repair. You'll often find that the dealer will simply want to replace any part rather than repair. I guess we live in a throw-away society, but I always try to find someone to repair things. http://www.carstereohelp.com/stereoremoval...anger%20Removal Hope this helps, Sam

Hi Courtney, You are right, this isn't normal at all. I had a similar issue with my '92 LS400. It ended up being the front brake shims. The Lexus dealer was clueless until I demanded the shop Foreman work on it. He quickly diagnosed the problem as the brake pads moving around when you hit the brakes. The mechanic ended up putting on a "fit kit" on the front brakes. Does it make a "clunk" noise when you are slowing down? If that is the noise, then have them look at the solution I outlined above. You will be surprised how Lexus mechanics vary in quality. I nearly sued my Lexus dealer for replacing $3000 in parts when the problem was simply the brake shims. It has been a very disappointing experience for me. Lexus dealer or not, this is still the "Car" business and you have to look out for them trying to take advantage of you! Seeing as your car is a CPO I would call the Service Manager and tell them your concerns are not being met. You are a Lexus owner and should be getting service that is second to none. I know it sounds a little arrogant on my part, but that is what you pay for!!! You shouldn't have to convince anyone to take you seriously!!! Also, your CPO warranty will be honored at any Lexus dealer so you can take it to another dealer if you think they are being difficult. I hope this helps, Sam

Courtney, That is not normal at all. I've had 4 LS cars and none of them ever made a single noise when going over bumps. You are correct in your assumption that this car should be whisperquiet. Since the car is a CPO you should insist the Service Consultant ride along with you to hear the noise. Having spent the considerable amount of $$$ you shouldn't have to "get used" to any fault on your car! Lexus takes pride in their flagship being one of the quietest cars on the road. (If not the quietest!) I'm sure they'll do whatever it takes to fix it! Hope this helps, Sam

Hi All, 96K on my 1992 LS. A wonderful car. I have the Temp LCD replaced, P/S Pump, Rack and Pinion, Rear Shocks and Stablilizer Bar Bushings. The Upper control arms were done by the insurance company. I bought a Corolla to supplant this car as a daily driver thinking that it was up there in mileage and could break down on me..Well looks like I was wrong! Then again can't argue with the 35 MPG the Corolla gives. Also, it will probably just make the LS last longer. Anyone want to guess how long a LS would go? Great Board I'm glad I joined!! SV 96K on 92 LS400 4K on 05 LS430

Thanks for your post. My creaking occurs not over bumps but when turning. I told them to replace both the strut rod bushings (which I was told was cracked) and the shocks in tandem...They claimed that this was not the case. I don't see how shocks would not be worn out at 96K miles.. Basically when you manuever at low speeds it will creak from the front, like pulling into a parking spot. Once you apply the brakes to bring the car to a full stop it bounces a little and creaks. Thanks again for the post, SV

Hi Everyone, I'm a long time LS owner having owned two LS400's and another two LS430's. My problem concerns my 1992 LS400. The car was hit by a wayward driver about two years ago. Ever since then, the car makes this creaking/thunking noise when you maneuver around the parking lot around 10-15 MPH. It usually occurs when making a right turn. The whole Left Front Suspension Assembly was replaced. I think the only thing not done was the shocks. Both lower ball joints were done. The Upper Control Arms were done on the right side last week. The Sway bar bushings were done 18 months ago. The Power Steering Rack was done last week along with the "Rear Carrier Bushings."I've given the dealer 18 months to get to the bottom of this. I was furious after last week, having spent $2100 and still am having the same problem. Each time I take the car in, I get another story..I'm giving them one last chance on Friday to get it right, or they will face litigation. I was told Strut Rod Bushings may be the culprit, what do you think? I'm tired of the Lexus approach of just replacing parts without regard to the actual problem!! Many thanks, Sam