Mildew Smell From Air Vents

[Unhappylexusowner]

This is my 4th Lexus. I have owned, a 2003 ES, 2006 GS, 2009 ES. I waited with enthusiasm to purchase the all new 2013 ES 350. I purchased one in August 2012, one of the earliest produced. In June of 2013, I began getting a mildew smell from my air vents when ever i turned on the A/C or just fresh air. I took it to my dealer and replaced the cabin filter with a new charcoal cabin filter. The problem did not go away. Again I took it to my dealer and was told that Lexus engineers say that you have to put the system into fresh air mode before you turn off the A/C system. I told them I have never had a car or known of any car that you have to do this. I asked where does it say to do this in the owner's manual? Again the smell did not go away. Was also told NOT to disinfect the system. They told me that this is considered regular maintenance. This is baloney. I wrote to the Eastern Regional Office asking them to swap my car for a new one and was turned down. My dealer tells me that their are many more cars with this problem. Lexus KNOWS that there is a problem but does not know how to correct it. How many others have the same issue with this vehicle? I am told that it is a problem on all 2013 models and Lexus will not take care and do the right thing. My dealer also told me that this problem has been corrected on the 2014 models showing me that Lexus is aware of the problem but will not do the right thing.

[pj8708]

Hi Larry and welcome to the club.

This is the first time I have heard of this problem. Like you, I too have had other Lexus cars, and have had my 2013 ES since December of last year. During that time period I have not run into this issue.

It sounds like, at least finaly, the dealer has become straight with you and has admitted the problem is something he can't fix until Lexus gets their butts in gear. Any situation like this where you have to deal long distance with an unknown Lexus entity can drive you nuts. My experience over the years with my dealer has been excellent.

It almost sounds like there is condensate from the A/C laying in the duct work instead of draining out like it should. All of us see that puddle of water underneath the engine when the A/C has been running and we stop and park the car.

Please let us know your progress as this situation unfolds so we can all learn.

Paul

[clender]

Larry,

You are 100% correct. I am getting ill from the A/C in my car. It's a 2014! I am going in to change the filter but I bet the entire A/C unit is covered in mold. I am very sensitive to this and I will know for sure in a few days. I will give you an update.

Carl

[clender]

I took the car in yesterday and they changed the filter to a Charcoal Filter and probably sprayed something in the system. Bottom line the odor went away and more importantly I feel much better. This issue made me very ill for a two week period and I think Lexus needs to address this with other owners. Not everyone would be able to figure out what was going on and Lexus does know this is an issue. This is a very serious issue. I'm going to have to put my car on a schedule of every 6 months to get the filter changed. (I live in FL and drive lots of miles in the heat)

[Bluestary]

I know it's much more humid in Fl. than Az., but I've got the same problem here in the desert. This is one of the few things that suck about a Lexus.

[JonQ32]

I too have the mildew problem in our 2013 ES 300h. We received our car in January of 2013 and the problem began around June/July of 2013. We only had approx 5000 miles on the car. A car this new should not be having this type of problem!

The dealer also sprayed disinfectant in to the system and said this should solve the problem. This band-aid lasted about 2 hours.

Last fall, I did some research on the internet and found that several brands/models of cars have same type of problem. The engineered design of the condenser coil is flawed and does not dry out between uses. Moisture accumulates and saturates the coil when we use the AC. When we park the car the coil does not dry out and mold and mildew begin and continues to grow. The sour putrid smell permeates the systems.

I found that there is a foaming cleaning product specifically for cleaning condenser coils. This is supposedly a simple process. Raise the car up, insert tube in the condenser drain tube, spray foaming cleaning product into condenser, let it do its job then let it drain out. Reports are that this does fix the problem for a time... but this treatment will need to be repeated periodically.

I have not yet tried this but feel that Lexus should be responsible for this issue and be cleaning these coils on at least an annual basis. They should comp this service to us. I wonder how many Lexus owners have this same problem.

Here is pic of the drain tube:

[Pomo]

I am having the same problem with our 2013 Lexus, have taken it in several times, they put in a new charcoal filter (have had the car for only 6 months), and took it in again yesterday, they keep telling us they do not smell it, and to put it in auto mode and outside circulation before turning off the car. Very disappointed in this Lexus, I have asthma, allergies and this is not acceptable.

[lenore]

I wonder if the drain tube is not located at the lowest point in the condenser. ???? Seems like a fix would be quite simple, find lowest point and have tube re-routed to the outside.

[Vanbt]

I have owned a RX300 and now own a 2013 ES350. I took delivery of the ES in November 2013 and in May 2014 I began experiencing this problem. I had no problems with my RX. I live in FL and it is HOT 9 months out of the year being in the 90s for 3 of those months. I have taken it to the dealer. Both times they changed the filter to the charcoal filter and have "flushed" the system. The bandaid fix lasted about a week. I was told that because of the heat that all cars have this problem. This is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. I have NEVER had this issues with any car I have driven. I was also told that I should turn off the recirculated air before I get out and let the unit run for a few minutes before turning it off. This is supposed to enable the water to drain. This whole situation is unacceptable. Consumers do not pay the premium price for a "premium" vehicle only to have to deal with a smelly AC for the first 5-10 min of their drive. I have been told that they have ordered a new "cleaning system" for this issues and that my car will be the first to have it done once it comes in. I am not willing to settle and deal with this issue. I will be taking my car back to the dealer and documenting that it will be the 3rd visit for the same issue with no resolution. Then I will research my Lemon Law rights. Not a happy Lexus owner this time!

[clender]

I totally feel your pain. I lease my car from Lexus of Pembroke Pines. They have treated my car 3 times and refuse to do it a 4th without a work order from Lexus America. The smell comes on when you start the car. If not treated it gets to a point where it actually makes me sick. Lexus is totally lying about this situation. I know they know there is a problem but they just won't admit it. I have 3 cars now, ALL Lexus and this issue and their handling of it is going to have me leaving Lexus real soon. It's really a shame, my last Lexus had 200,000 miles on it and not one issue but general maintenance. This one is a different story. I got it in November and by January it had Mold and it just won't go away. If you live in Florida you really need to think twice about purchasing a Lexus ES 350 right now until they start to deal with the issue. I wouldn't be saying this if they were taking care of the issue but they are not and it's not right. On one of my visits I got a RX Loaner and I smelled the same thing. Shame on you Lexus!!!

[boomerx2]

We had a 06 Solara that had the same issue. Not all the time, but occasionally we would get the smell. We live in the desert southwest. We just purchased a 2014 ES350 and are in the habit of putting the car in re-circ a few minutes from our destination. So far no smells, so maybe that is indeed keeping the coils dry before shutting off. We had a Lexus loaner 2013 Es350 with 12,000 miles on the odo and ....yep...it had the smell. And it never really dissapated totally, even after driving a while. Our car now has 480 miles on the ODO and as long as we can keep up the practice of useing re-circ, I hope we will be OK. Kind of a pain though, to have to do this.

WAKE UP LEXUS AND FIX THIS ISSUE!!!!

[clender]

It's a known issue, they are lying to you. It's not in any way fixed.

[gnewman]

I live in NY and have a 2014 RX350. Lexus has not fixed the issue. I've had the charcoal filter installed and sprayed with no luck. This is COMPLETELY unacceptable from a luxury brand. Seems like a simple program fix to keep the car from defaulting to recirculated A/C. I'm concerned about the health risks to my children. Somebody should start a social media compaign or class action lawsuit to get some attention.

[ALA]

We live in N.J. and have had a 2008, 2010 & 2011 RX350 with no problems regarding the moldy/musty smell from the A/C vents. However, the 2014 RX350 with 9,200 miles on it, has the same musty/moldy smell problem as described above by others. The dealer acknowledged that it is a known problem and apparently Lexus does not know what to do to correct it. They too advised switching the unit to the fresh air mode and perhaps install a charcoal filter that they wanted to charge $30 for! (with no guarantee that it would "fix" the problem).

It goes in for service again this Friday so I will see what they say this time and will show them all the customer complaints posted, which I am sure they are aware of.

Coincidentally my wife was hospitalized for 5 days with a serious grade A strep infection the end of July. Doctors did not know what the problem was at first but finally diagnosed it and treated it with heavy duty antibiotic I/V's and 2 weeks of antibiotics at home. Could this have been caused by the mold emanating from the air vents? Who knows -- the doctors surely did not know.

[gnewman]

I am dealing with Lexus corporate whose actually helping me initiate an arbitration claim after having me jump through the initial hoops of spraying and installing a charcoal filter. There is both an internal Lexus claims procedure, and an external claims procedure via NCDS (http://www.ncdsusa.org/). I'm waiting on the paperwork to evaluate the pros/cons of each or decide if I should pursue both simultaneously. Even though the Lexus corporate rep is being somewhat helpful, they are still being cagey and protecting themselves in my opinion.

Separately, each state may have a "Lemon Law" that outlines a procedure for demanding a buy-back of a defective car. (NY Gen Business Law section 198-A).

There is also a public facebook page to draw attention to the issue and hopefully force Lexus to create a programming fix for the AC system or recall the defective vehicles.

SHARE THE LINK -- https://www.facebook.com/pages/Lexus-AC-Mold-Mildew-Fix-It/1498230947101071?ref=bookmarks

[ALA]

Thanks for the info Gregory. I was at the dealership today and spoke to the General Manager and the Service Manager and got the same answers (or excuses) that you probably did, which were all ridiculous and unacceptable. They did acknowledge that Lexus is aware and working on a fix and in the meantime performed a "DWD2 evaporator cleaning" and installed a charcoal filter.

Coincidentally, after reading the blogs here, on Tuesday I replaced the cabin filter with a Purolator and the moldy/musty odor basically disappeared. However, the concern was, for how long? That is why Lexus did the evaporator cleaning & replaced the Purolator filter with a charcoal filter. So for now, I will monitor it and see how long this "fix" lasts.

I asked about the internal claims procedure but they said they were only aware of a production complaint form. Do you have any more info on the Lexus internal claims procedure? I too will contact Lexus Corporate and if you can share any info on that process, it would be greatly appreciated.

I too am very disappointed with the way this is being handled by Lexus Corporate and certainly does not live up to their "Pursuit of Excellence" slogan!

P.S. BTW, when I removed the original cabin filter I noticed it was not the white pleated filter I am accustomed to seeing - instead it was a grey/black filter (however, not the charcoal one that Lexus is now using). Do you know what your filter looks or looked like? I am wondering if this media change has anything to do with the problem. Especially since Lexus claims that BMW & Mercedes has the same problem - could it be an OEM supply problem?

[gnewman]

Al -

I'm waiting paperwork from corporate and haven't started either process. However, this is a description of each I received from the corporate rep.

1) Dispute Resolution; filed internally with our company per your verbal request for a replacement vehicle.
All of the information of that process will be sent to you in hardcopy. The decision of the company is final for Lexus.
There is no appeal process within our corporation.
2) NCDS (National Center for Dispute Settlement) a consumer agency that the customer has to contact. Their number is 866-272-4872. Their decision is binding for Lexus, but not for the consumer.

[dwince54]

I am currently leasing a 2013 RX 350. Problems with the hvac began the following summer. Mold, mildew smell. Took it is several times. They sprayed in the vents with Glade or something similar. Then a couple weeks later they replaced the cabin filter, which I initially paid for, but then complained to corporate and was reimbursed. Kept complaint and taking it in and the service manager said there was nothing more he could do. I told him that I would blast this problem all over social media and he responded by saying that I was threatening him. Well, fast forward to Spring 2014. I get a call from the dealership saying that someone is looking for a 2013 RX fire agate(color). They want me to lease another 4 years and keep the same payment amount. I say no way. I so not want 4 more years. The smell is ungodly. I said I would pick up a lease where I would leave off and was turned down. So guess what? Got a call today saying they will give me a new RX 2015, same payments, and a 2 year lease(which is what is left on mine. Interesting???

[dwince54]

Audi has the same problem as well.

[clender]

I returned the car, just couldn't handle the mildew smell anymore. It was making me totally sick. I went back and forth with Lexus for the better part of a year. They lied to me so many times regarding this issue. The A/C was treated 4 times in this year and each time it only fixed it for about two weeks. They had someone from Lexus look at the car last week but I am not going to pick it up. I purchased another car over the weekend. I have been in a new car for a full week and I feel much better. I should have done it a long time ago. Lexus has a real issue with this mildew in the A/C and until they face it they will continue to lose customers. Very poor customer service on this issue.

[Mold Supervisor]

McBride v. Toyota Motor Sales USA Inc., 2013-0445/JAX (Fla. NMVAB March 10, 2014) The Consumers complained of a mold or mildew odor from the air conditioning vents in their 2013 Toyota Sienna XLE. The Consumers first noticed the odor around the time of their 5,000 mile service, but attributed it to the fact that there had been a lot of rain in their area; they assumed the odor would go away after the rain subsided. The odor remained, however, and worsened. The odor was described as pungent, and became worse as the outside temperature and humidity increased. The odor occurred when the vehicle was first started in the morning, lasting for 40 to 60 seconds. The odor would recur if the vehicle sat without the engine running for approximately one and one-half hours, although it was not as pungent later in the day as it was first thing in the morning. Mr. McBride acknowledged that he declined to have a cleaning and filter change performed that was recommended in a Toyota Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) related to HVAC odors, because he felt that he should not have to pay $300.00 for the service, particularly since the service was intended only to improve, and not to eliminate, the odor problem. Mr. McBride pointed out that the 2011 Toyota Sienna he and his wife traded in for the 2013 Sienna did not exhibit a similar problem. Mr. McBride testified that the odor was a health problem for him, because of his allergies, and he was concerned about the health of his three-year-old and one-week-old children. The Manufacturer, represented by Southeast Toyota Distributors, asserted the alleged nonconformity did not substantially impair the use, value or safety of the vehicle. In addition, Southeast Toyota Distributors stated, “[f]urthermore, the customer declined the dealer and manufacturer the opportunity(ies) [sic] to perform the Technical Service Bulletin that would minimize what the customer is experiencing.” A Senior Field Technical Specialist with Southeast Toyota Distributors, testified that Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc., had determined that HVAC odors were not covered under its warranty, and were therefore the responsibility of the Consumer to correct. He indicated that he has frequently smelled the odor in question in other Toyota vehicles, and believes it was not mold, but simply “stale air.” He acknowledged he had no personal knowledge as to whether any tests were performed by the Manufacturer to confirm that the odor was not caused by mold. The Board concluded that the mold or mildew odor from the air conditioning vents substantially impaired the use, value and safety of the vehicle, thereby constituting one or more nonconformities as defined by the statute and the applicable rule. Accordingly, the Consumers were awarded a refund.

[Mold Supervisor]

REASONABLE NUMBER OF ATTEMPTS §681.104, F.S.: What Constitutes a Reasonable Number of Attempts §681.104, F.S.; §681.1095(8), F.S. Browning v. Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc., 2012-0347/FTL (Fla. NMVAB February 15, 2013) (See “Nonconformity” above) The Manufacturer stipulated that the vehicle was presented to an authorized service agent for repair of the air conditioner odor nonconformity on September 12, 2012 (no repair order given to Consumer) and September 13, 2012, when water was found around the evaporator core, and an air conditioner mist service was performed. The Manufacturer stipulated that it was afforded a final opportunity to repair the vehicle after receipt of written notification from the Consumer. On October 10, 2012, the vehicle was presented to the Manufacturer's designated repair facility for the final repair attempt. At that time, the evaporator was cleaned and the Consumer was instructed to set the air conditioner to outside air prior to turning off the vehicle. The Consumer again brought the vehicle in for repair of the foul odor on October 27, 2012, and November 17, 2012. The evidence established that the nonconformity was subjected to repair by the Manufacturer’s service agent a total of five times. Under the circumstances, the Manufacturer had a reasonable number of attempts to conform the subject vehicle to the warranty as contemplated by the Lemon Law. Accordingly, the Consumer was awarded a refund.

[Mold Supervisor]

Karp v. Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc.-Lexus Division, 2012-0270/FTL (Fla. NMVAB January 30, 2013) In a third air conditioner odor case, the Consumer complained of a foul odor from the air conditioner in her 2012 Lexus IS 250. According to the Consumer, the smell was “vinegar-y” and offensive, and was worse when the vehicle was first started in the morning, so much so that she would leave the door open when she started the car, and started her drive with the windows down in order to air out the vehicle. She testified that on some days the smell tapers off after approximately 30 minutes, but on other days – particularly very hot days – the smell would last all day. The Manufacturer asserted the alleged nonconformity did not substantially impair the use, value or safety of the motor vehicle, because the “concern had been repaired and the customer’s vehicle was currently up to the manufacturer’s specifications.” The Manufacturer’s witness testified that the odor complained of by the Consumer had to have been caused by micro-organisms on the air conditioner evaporator, but because neither he nor the authorized service agent had ever been able to recreate the odor, the problem had to have been corrected by the repairs that were performed. The Board found that the foul odor coming from the air conditioner substantially impaired the use, value and safety of the vehicle, thereby constituting one or more nonconformities as defined by the statute and the applicable rule. Accordingly, the Consumer was awarded a refund.

[Mold Supervisor]

Browning v. Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc., 2012-0347/FTL (Fla. NMVAB February 15, 2013)

This Consumer complained of a foul odor emanating from the air conditioner in her 2012 Toyota Venza when the a/c was first turned on, and often times while the vehicle was being driven. The Consumer’s husband testified that an “unpleasant, obnoxious smell” started coming from the air conditioner vents about one month after they took delivery of the vehicle. The odor did not go away but started to get worse, and the hotter the ambient temperature, the longer the odor would last. When he entered the vehicle, he turned the air conditioner on, put the windows down, and held his breath while he blasted the air conditioner to blow some of the odor out of the vehicle. Nevertheless, sometimes the foul odor lasted 20 to 30 minutes into the drive. The Consumer testified she was the intended driver of the vehicle, but after the odor problem arose she started having allergy issues and she began driving her husband’s vehicle instead. She testified her allergy issues stopped with the change of vehicles. A service writer at one of the Manufacturer’s authorized service agents, told the Consumer nothing could be done and they would not even attempt a repair. The Manufacturer asserted the alleged nonconformity did not substantially impair the use, value or safety of the motor vehicle; and the alleged nonconformity was the direct result of “environmental conditions.” The Manufacturer’s representative testified he conducted the Manufacturer’s final repair attempt. He acknowledged that, when he turned on the air conditioner, he experienced an odor that was “not desirable.” When he drove the vehicle the odor began to dissipate. He explained that the evaporator in the air conditioning unit was warm, and when the air conditioner was turned on it blew cold air on the evaporator, causing condensation to build up in the unit. Therefore, when the vehicle was shut off, the air conditioner should be switched to outside air for the air to circulate in the unit and help dry out any water that has accumulated; otherwise, the accumulated water can start to smell. Following that practice will not eliminate any air conditioner odor, but it will lessen it, and, according to him, this problem was more prevalent in South Florida because of its wet environment and high humidity. The Board found that the foul odor emanating from the air conditioner substantially impaired the use and value of the vehicle, thereby constituting one or more nonconformities as defined by the statute and the applicable rule. Accordingly, the Consumer was awarded a refund.

[Mold Supervisor]

Browning v. Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc., 2012-0347/FTL (Fla. NMVAB February 15, 2013)

This Consumer complained of a foul odor emanating from the air conditioner in her 2012 Toyota Venza when the a/c was first turned on, and often times while the vehicle was being driven. The Consumer’s husband testified that an “unpleasant, obnoxious smell” started coming from the air conditioner vents about one month after they took delivery of the vehicle. The odor did not go away but started to get worse, and the hotter the ambient temperature, the longer the odor would last. When he entered the vehicle, he turned the air conditioner on, put the windows down, and held his breath while he blasted the air conditioner to blow some of the odor out of the vehicle. Nevertheless, sometimes the foul odor lasted 20 to 30 minutes into the drive. The Consumer testified she was the intended driver of the vehicle, but after the odor problem arose she started having allergy issues and she began driving her husband’s vehicle instead. She testified her allergy issues stopped with the change of vehicles. A service writer at one of the Manufacturer’s authorized service agents, told the Consumer nothing could be done and they would not even attempt a repair. The Manufacturer asserted the alleged nonconformity did not substantially impair the use, value or safety of the motor vehicle; and the alleged nonconformity was the direct result of “environmental conditions.” The Manufacturer’s representative testified he conducted the Manufacturer’s final repair attempt. He acknowledged that, when he turned on the air conditioner, he experienced an odor that was “not desirable.” When he drove the vehicle the odor began to dissipate. He explained that the evaporator in the air conditioning unit was warm, and when the air conditioner was turned on it blew cold air on the evaporator, causing condensation to build up in the unit. Therefore, when the vehicle was shut off, the air conditioner should be switched to outside air for the air to circulate in the unit and help dry out any water that has accumulated; otherwise, the accumulated water can start to smell. Following that practice will not eliminate any air conditioner odor, but it will lessen it, and, according to him, this problem was more prevalent in South Florida because of its wet environment and high humidity. The Board found that the foul odor emanating from the air conditioner substantially impaired the use and value of the vehicle, thereby constituting one or more nonconformities as defined by the statute and the applicable rule. Accordingly, the Consumer was awarded a refund.