Lexus Es300 Vs. Mercedes-benz E300?

[Andrew T.]

Hey there. I currently have a 1991 Mercedes-Benz E300, and im thinking about getting rid of it and getting a Lexus ES300 (early-mid 90's) .. Any ideas on what may be better about the Lexus? , or are they pretty comparable, just different names?

Thanks

[Nabeel]

Nice Benz! She looks clean. I test-drove a few 300Es before, I like them a lot. In terms of your Mercedes vs. an ES300, here are a few observations:

- Rear wheel drive (MB) versus front wheel drive (Lexus). This could benefit you if the climate in your area includes lots of snow and ice. FWD = better traction. However, RWD will provide better handling balance in normal situations.

- In terms of power, both should be similar. The Mercedes makes 177hp, I believe, versus the 185-188 of the first-generation ES300. The ES300 might be slightly faster, but the difference will be negligible.

- The Benz has better handling. The ES300 suspension tends to exhibit a bit more body roll and float, plus the understeer that goes along with FWD.

- The Lexus has a more plush ride. If you live in an area where the pavement is not too good, the Lexus has the clear edge in this regard.

- The Lexus will be less expensive to maintain. Although I have no personal experiece with Mercedes, I do have experience with old BMWs and Porsches. I assume Mercedes repair/maintanance costs will be in the same ballpark.

- Both will be reliable. I realize that the Lexus is rated higher by JD Power and Consumer Reports in terms of reliability, but the Benz is definately a reliable, dependable car, as evidenced by the tons of old Benzes still running on the roads today. I feel that in the late 90's Mercedes took their eye off quality and durability and focused on more superficial attributes like styling and comfort. The 300E is one of the old school Mercedes cars and I have much respect for it.

- The Mercedes feels more solid and substantial on the road. It has heavier steering and a very nice made-out-of-solid-steel feeling to it. The Lexus feels lighter and more nimble in comparison. My dad, who is a German car devotee, thought the Lexus felt 'toylike' after driving BMWs for a long time. You might want to keep that in mind....

- The Lexus is more up-to-date in terms of convenience features. It has remote locking for the doors, unlike the 300E, and the climate control system works much better. The audio system is also a lot better than the Mercedes system.

Well, that was my best shot at an objective analysis between the two cars. Hope this helps, Good Luck and welcome to this board. :)

[zeta]

welcome to the board, andrew.

there will be very few noticeble differences in the ride and feel between the two.

the most noticeable among the earlier generations would be the excess body roll. if you wish to take care of that, a set of nice lowering springs and a strut bar can take care of that and give the car a nice look as well.

all mercedes have the same feel... the feeling like it is a very well built, stable vehicle. there isn't as much of that feel in the ES, since the luxury aspect is the ES's main priority. the ES feel very smooth on normal pavement.

but when needed, the ES can do the job in a lot of situations. the acceleration could be a bit quicker, but it's hard to ask much from my 10-year-old ES with 100k on the odometer.

an ES would be a great choice to take if you're looking for a used one.

i would suggest a 97-2001 version if possible, but the first gen's aren't as bad... :)

92-96 ES's aren't priced very high. my '93 with 100k was on kbb for around $6000...

higher mileage ES's aren't as bad, but you'd have to check its maintenance records.

ES's can hit very high miles, so no need to worry about it lasting. :)

good luck on the ES hunt. :D

[Andrew T.]

Hmm, thank you both for the informative replies. Is one considered more 'posh' or 'chic' than the other? Or are they both about the same, haha. Thats not really my decision on which I want, as I've always wanted a Lexus... (I'm 16, I can remember when I was about 10 being a little brat saying "One day, im gonna be a rich doctor and drive a Lexus!)...somehow, I ended up with a Mercedes. hehe.. Hmmmm. Another thing is, my car was about 60,000 + when new, whereas the Lexus was more around the 30K range. A few of the factors i'm looking at is the fact that my car, even though it looks extremely clean and well cared for, has over 180,000 miles on it. Now, thats not a tremendous lot for a Mercedes, but its alot, seeing as though for the same price of what I paid for my MB (5,500), I could probably find a few year newer ES with less miles. Another thing is the repair bills. Good lord, Mercedes are horribly expensive to maintain. This winter, I had to replace the radiator, thermostat, and alternator. The radiator was around 400 JUST for the part. (Did a DIY on installing it) .. The thermostat was 100 installed by the MB dealer (inflated service prices) , and the alternator was a little over 300 at the dealership. For a 16 year old kid, thats alot to be paying for. Also, it eats premium fuel like candy, and with this war BS and terrible gas prices (1.97 / gal for premium here I beleive), its not economical at all. Another factor is the status symbol crap. At school, even though my Mercedes is 12 years old, I get so much crap for it. People think i'm an arrrogant, snooty , stuckup snob, more than likely simply because of my car. I would hope that the Lexus would have less of this effect. Are repair costs on a Lexus decent? , How is the gas mileage?

Thanks

[SW03ES]

Well...I'm not sure how well you're going to like the change.

It all depends on what you like the most about your car, and whether or not the ES shares those attributes. The ES (especially older ones) don't have that vaultlike feel that your MB has. My favorite Lexus is the LS, which has that faultlike heaviness that the MBs have. When I set out to choose my Lexus several months ago, I drove all of the cars in my price range, the ES, the Acura TL, the Lexus GS, the benz E320, C320, the BMW 3, Audi A4 etc. My goal was to find something that had as close to that vaultlike tomblike ride, the closest by far was my ES. However, when I drove some older ES (2001ish) that vaultlike feel wasn't there, the car felt much lighter. My feeling was they were advertising the ES as the "Baby LS" now and they engineered the car to feel more like the LS. My father has a 98 LS, and they drive, sound, and feel very similar. The closest in feel beside the ES was the E320, and it was significantly more expensive and very outdated.

The moral of the story is, you may be more happy with a early era LS400 than the ES, but you'd be hard pressed to find one at your price range.

Go drive a few, see if the difference in dynamics really matters more to you. The Lexus will definately be cheaper to operate and repair, not to mention insure for a 16 y.o.

As for the snoot effect, you get plenty of that in the Lexus too, ESPECIALLY being young. In fact, I get just as much in the ES as I did when I drove my dad's LS, people see the badge and they don't care about the cost or the age. Honestly though, thats their problem. I work hard, I'm an entrepeneur, and I drive a Lexus. If they don't like that, they can give me all the hell they want. It just comes out of jealousy.

[zeta]

it's all right, andrew, i'm in the same place you're in.

i have a '93 ES. though it was one from the second year it was built i still get lots of crap from friends at school that're all like "you're so rich..." blah blah blah. i just ignore them. they don't care how old it is, they don't care how much it's worth. the people who think you're all rich and everything won't change, but the two cars are quite different and i can't say the ES is any more gas efficient than the E300

i get roughly 17 mpg on my ES. so far i've gone about 300 per tank. sometimes less, depending on my driving. more highway would raise the mileage up to maybe 20 or so. the mileage really isn't that good on the car. the first gen ES is not one you want to floor often. my bro had one race with an integra and he was out about 1/8 a tank just racing from a red light to about 110... all because of the hard pedal pushing.

it'll be a change, but if you test drive one, and like it, i'd say go for a 2nd gen one.

[Andrew T.]

Hm, id say thats about the same mileage mine gets. Not the greatest, but there is far worse. What is the diff between 1st gen / 2nd gen es300's? What was the first year of the 2nd gen, and how much more would that be? Ive only got about 6K to work with.

[SW03ES]

6k is definately going to put you in a first gen. The second gen came out in 1997.

[zeta]

hey andrew, the 1st gen went from '92 - '96. the 2nd gen went from '97 - '01.

the major differences might be the different engine and power output, higher mileage, body looks sleeker than the 1st gen, but basically the same body style. the trunk lid has half the tail lights unlike the 1st gen where the trunk is only a lid, and is really annoying to put large things into, since it's so high. there's nothing wrong with a 1st gen, but if you've got the money, might as well go for a 2nd gen. more power, higher mileage, and a sleeker look.

but since you want something in the low price range ($6k), a 1st gen can be bought for that easily. a 5-speed manual ES might be harder to find since they're freakishly rare, but an auto ES with reasonable miles can be bought for $6k. good luck on the ES hunt. :)