Mileage

[Sharr]

I just purchased a CPO 2008 400h and I'm not impressed with the gas mileage. I'm averaging just under 23mpg. My take offs are very slow and I coast as often as I can. I am not a fast driver in fact people in the car with me have said they can see a nickle on the side of the road. I travel around 7 miles to work and 3 of those miles and on the interstate traveling less than 60mph. I run the AC only on the trip home. I am still on my first tank of gas and have put 230 miles on the vehicle and average mpg says 22.8. Any suggestions you all might have would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.

[RX400h]

I think I wouldn't be impressed, either if I drove only 7 miles to work. To get the oil hot enough, most vehicles need to be driven at least 10 miles, but as much as 20 miles on cooler days. As the oil gets hotter its viscosity decreases and fuel mileage increases.

We average 24-26 MPG with more highway than city driving. I'm certain that if we spent more time in the city or during high traffic times, our fuel mileage would go up. We do not drive super conservatively and I've been known to blast by X5s every now and then.

By the way, here's a post that includes a graph of RX400h owners' average fuel mileage.

http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21500

[RXREY]

You have an amazing car that will last a long, long time and will feel new as well...I get about 24 and a half but I do better the times in the year that I drive farther, about 26. I hope that you will be happy with your purchase. When I got mine in January of 2006,first year for the 400h, the numbers were totally inflated to 31! I got used to the lie and I have been impressed by so much about this car. The mileage is OK but the transmission and everything else is amazing. I think that the transmission is something that I appreciate more now than when I first got this great car. Good luck and if anything maybe you can get something else. It shouldn't be too hard to sell your car and get what you paid for it. Rey in sunny LA

[BobBass]

Sharr,

IMO, the previous posters are right on the money.

I have an '08 400h AWD, live in southeastern PA, run regular gas (10% ethanol), don't do a lot of long trips, and average ~22 in winter and am lucky with judicious driving in summer to get close to 26. People are always (negatively) surprised when I give them these "low" gas mileage figures - I just reply that moving ANYTHING weighing close to 4,440 lbs. around is going to burn a lot of gas. And, if I had the regular version, I'd be lucky to get 18-19 under the same conditions.

I'm coming up on the end of my lease and enjoy the 400h so much I very well may purchase it...the first time I've ever done that with a lease. The 2010 re-design does nothing for me and does not ride as well.

One last thing - you may want to check the tire pressure. You can inflate them to 38 with no problems and improve the mpg.

[maseace]

I averaged over 33 mpg yesterday driving down the Oregon coast (speed limit 55 mph). Today traveling in California on I-5 and mountain passes I averaged slightly over 27 mpg (avg speed limit 70 mph). My tires (stock Michelin S8's with LRR Green X) are inflated to 38 psi. On my regular work commute (10 miles each way) I get between 25 and 26 mpg. The mileage so far for me has exceeded my expectations. The oil viscosity may also affect mpg. It's filled with 5W30 now but I will switch to 0W30 Mobil 1 on my next oil change.

[lemon]

Try using Shell V Power (or whatever the highest octane at Shell is in the USA). Here in Canada, Shell V Power is 91 octane, but more importantly, has 0% ethanol in it (the mid grade has up to 5% and the regular has up to 10%). You may see a bump in mileage without the ethanol in the gas.

If you had a 2006, I'd say you probably also need to do the ISC reset, but 'supposedly' it only applies to the 2006 model (you need to reset the Idle Speed Control if the 12 volt battery has been run down to below 7 volts, or disconnected entirely).

[RX400h]

Please keep in mind that if you inflate your tires past approx. 34 psi (cold), they will wear out in the center, rather quickly. I had my tires at 35 psi for a while until I noticed that they were wearing out in the center. Currently, I have them set to 32-33 psi and their wear has evened out.

[pauljcl]

Please keep in mind that if you inflate your tires past approx. 34 psi (cold), they will wear out in the center, rather quickly. I had my tires at 35 psi for a while until I noticed that they were wearing out in the center. Currently, I have them set to 32-33 psi and their wear has evened out.

Yes, I fully agree. I run mine at 33psi and all is fine.

[SOMEONE ELSE'S GOT MY NAME]

Please keep in mind that if you inflate your tires past approx. 34 psi (cold), they will wear out in the center, rather quickly. I had my tires at 35 psi for a while until I noticed that they were wearing out in the center. Currently, I have them set to 32-33 psi and their wear has evened out.

I have all the respect for our members here, who regularly post. That said, I was told a few years ago that "over-inflating" tires from the paltry 30's WILL NOT ... repeat, NOT cause tires to wear in the center (much less, prematurely) - as we've all heard time & time again, over many decades. Our crummy/original GoodYears (BOTH on the Prius AND the 400h) wore out in LESS than 12,000 miles, though they were kept at the "recommended" pressure in the 30's.

So I gave it a try. Long story short, we run 48 psi in the Prius. Our Prius's Michelin Hydroedge tires now have over EIGHTY THOUSAND miles on them, and they're just NOW starting to show a faint sign that they're starting to wear. And that's REGULAR wear ... not in the center. Similarly our 400h tires run higher pressures, at 44psi. They've lasted over 40,000 miles and show NO signs of center wear. The folks who turned me on to this explained that radials (unlike old fashion bias tires) simply don't turn into misshaped balloons. What can I say. You can read contradictory "center wear" storiess until you're blue in the face, but deliberately using higher psi's made a believer out of me. Additionally, you get better MPG's which most folks will concede ... as well as a harder ride. But for higher mpg's ? It's worth it to me ... and we got tires that actually have lasted MUCH longer - AND higher mpg's. Go figure! What do you think?

We use 0W-20 synthetic, too ... even in summer. The lower friction helps mpg's. We installed the factory block heater, and if we're regularly driving the 400h - we turn it on about 2 hours before leaving in the morning ... summer & winter. That way the ICE is already warmed up. Oh ... and we block the grill, too, even partly in the summer, until the temps are over 80 degrees. But beyond all the little tricks, a LOT of it is anticipatory driving. If you drive like someone who get 24mpg then that's what you'll get. Drive like someone who gets 34mpg - and that's what you'll get.

But here's ironic observation. I've read many Lexus post about mpg's and more often than not, you read, "I don't care what kind of mileage I get - because I can afford it". Yes, it seems many Lexus drives put ride / comfort / looks / power / handling etc FIRST, and mpg's a WAY distant last place. That's the way it is with my significant other ... she drives the 400h like someone who gets 26mpg - and so she does. Yep ... it's a teeny/lonely world for the few us Lexus hyper mile'ers.

:)

[RXREY]

Please keep in mind that if you inflate your tires past approx. 34 psi (cold), they will wear out in the center, rather quickly. I had my tires at 35 psi for a while until I noticed that they were wearing out in the center. Currently, I have them set to 32-33 psi and their wear has evened out.

I have all the respect for our members here, who regularly post. That said, I was told a few years ago that "over-inflating" tires from the paltry 30's WILL NOT ... repeat, NOT cause tires to wear in the center (much less, prematurely) - as we've all heard time & time again, over many decades. Our crummy/original GoodYears (BOTH on the Prius AND the 400h) wore out in LESS than 12,000 miles, though they were kept at the "recommended" pressure in the 30's.

So I gave it a try. Long story short, we run 48 psi in the Prius. Our Prius's Michelin Hydroedge tires now have over EIGHTY THOUSAND miles on them, and they're just NOW starting to show a faint sign that they're starting to wear. And that's REGULAR wear ... not in the center. Similarly our 400h tires run higher pressures, at 44psi. They've lasted over 40,000 miles and show NO signs of center wear. The folks who turned me on to this explained that radials (unlike old fashion bias tires) simply don't turn into misshaped balloons. What can I say. You can read contradictory "center wear" storiess until you're blue in the face, but deliberately using higher psi's made a believer out of me. Additionally, you get better MPG's which most folks will concede ... as well as a harder ride. But for higher mpg's ? It's worth it to me ... and we got tires that actually have lasted MUCH longer - AND higher mpg's. Go figure! What do you think?

We use 0W-20 synthetic, too ... even in summer. The lower friction helps mpg's. We installed the factory block heater, and if we're regularly driving the 400h - we turn it on about 2 hours before leaving in the morning ... summer & winter. That way the ICE is already warmed up. Oh ... and we block the grill, too, even partly in the summer, until the temps are over 80 degrees. But beyond all the little tricks, a LOT of it is anticipatory driving. If you drive like someone who get 24mpg then that's what you'll get. Drive like someone who gets 34mpg - and that's what you'll get.

But here's ironic observation. I've read many Lexus post about mpg's and more often than not, you read, "I don't care what kind of mileage I get - because I can afford it". Yes, it seems many Lexus drives put ride / comfort / looks / power / handling etc FIRST, and mpg's a WAY distant last place. That's the way it is with my significant other ... she drives the 400h like someone who gets 26mpg - and so she does. Yep ... it's a teeny/lonely world for the few us Lexus hyper mile'ers.

:)

I have to agree, I like my Toyos at 38 and I have not seen any center wear. They have almost 35K on them, they still look GREAT. The original Good Years lasted a sad 11K...I couldn't believe it...anywho...35- 38psi is what I like and the ride is fine, the wear is even. But I am no expert on this...just my own observations. My next set of tires are going to be General Grabber HTS...I have a post on this. I still haven't found a better rated tire...and I'll put 35-38psi in them. The ride is so nice with this car.......OK, that's all that I wanted to add....

[RX400h]

Okay, I had a good chuckle when I read the part about overinflation. First of all, I should mention that I have over 30 years experience with measuring equipment of all types and about that many years running radial tires on my cars. In fact, I worked for Uniroyal world headquarters for a time. I have measured many tires' tread depths with digital and dial calipers and I can tell you honestly that radial tires do wear in the center if overinflated. This is especially true of heavier vehicles' tires, at least from what I've seen. My Corvette's tires will wear out in the center if I keep them inflated over an optimum pressure by just a few psi.

Really, all you have to do is ask the tire pros at tirerack.com. Here's what they have to say:

Disadvantages of Overinflation

An overinflated tire is stiff and unyielding and the size of its footprint in contact with the road is reduced. If a vehicle's tires are overinflated by 6 psi, they could be damaged more easily when encountering potholes or debris in the road, as well as experience irregular tread wear. Higher inflated tires cannot isolate road irregularities as well causing the vehicle to ride harsher and transmit more noise into its interior. However, higher inflation pressures reduce rolling resistance slightly and typically provide a slight improvement in steering response and cornering stability. This is why participants who use street tires in autocrosses, track events and road races run higher than normal inflation pressures.

Or how about this article snippet from USA Today:

Overinflation can also endanger motorists' safety.

Of the 200 tires checked in the survey, 49 were overinflated. In 10 of 50 cars, all tires were overinflated.

The most severe case was found in Connecticut on a Honda Accord parked near a gas station air pump. The car had a right front tire with 60 psi — nearly double the recommended pressure. "I probably pumped it up too much," said Dale Schermerhorn, the owner, whose rear tires were each 4 pounds underinflated.

Three other tires checked in the survey were overinflated by 11 psi or more, and 12 tires were overinflated by 5 psi to 10 psi.

Overinflated tires are more rigid and can be damaged, possibly leading to a blowout, Herzlich says.

Fewer than half of the motorists in the survey follow recommendations to check their tires' pressure at least monthly. Four people said they never checked.

Almost half of the 50 motorists surveyed said they knew their vehicle's recommended tire pressures. But only 10 were able to cite the pressures correctly.

Note: Harold Herzlich is a consultant for the Rubber Manufacturers Association.

Please, keep the proper tire patch area on the road by inflating your tires to no more than a few psi over the recommended pressure listed on the door sticker. You and your vehicle will be better off (and safer).

[maseace]

Many drivers have underinflated tires because they don't even check them. Why do you think TPMS became mandatory in the US in 2008?

[SOMEONE ELSE'S GOT MY NAME]

Note: Harold Herzlich is a consultant for the Rubber Manufacturers Association.

Please, keep the proper tire patch area on the road by inflating your tires to no more than a few psi over the recommended pressure listed on the door sticker. You and your vehicle will be better off (and safer).

I have NO doubt that at some point, over inflation becomes unsafe. But on the flip side, tire insiders have mentioned to me how high the safety threshold is, for blow out. Heck, that just makes common sense. After all - every kitchen chair manufacturer has to account for numskulls using chairs as ladders. Thus, foreseeable accidents are avoided by building chairs safe enough to stand on. Avoiding product liability is what it's all about. The tire industry too, has to account for the numskull factor, so the max rated pressure does not mean if you are one pound over, that you're on the verge of a blow out.

By the same token regarding wear, lower tire inflation may causes tires to wear out quick. And we have the industry saying we should not over inflate, but rather run lower pressures (to a point). Harold Herzlich, as well as all tire industry folks know what side of the bread has the butter on it. I don't mind the tire industry marketing softer pressures over higher pressures for a smoother ride, but lets face it ... if tires last longer, the industry sells less product, and makes less money. So in my humble opinion, there's an industry bias (hey! tire joke!) towards lower pressure.

There is a growing 'cult' of higher psi folks out there who are experiencing good mpg results. I'm no tire expert. As a caveat, I'd advise NO one to act on ANY one's ideas unless it comes from an expert. If you ARE the type to experiment, remember, you do so at your own peril.

It's just like blocking your grill for high mpg's - to keep warm air inside the ICE compartment ... especially in winter time. There WILL be a numskull that forgets to unblock the grill ... then drive to Vegas during the 120 degree summer. Boom ... their inverter temps go sky high, and they smoke their HSD. Care and common sense first. Good luck to all who seek to beat the EPA mpg!

Here's a fun tire psi read from the cop's view point:

http://www.officer.com/web/online/Editorial-and-Features/Driving-Under-Pressure/19$27281

Myths about pressure

Lets put to rest some common misconceptions. The tires will not balloon out creating a peak in the center portion of the tread when tire pressure is above 35 psi. There is a steel belt that prevents this from happening. Also, you are not overstressing the tire with higher pressure, and the tire will not be forced off the rim with higher pressure. The picture above is Bobby Ore of Bobby Ore Motorsports driving a Ford Ranger on two wheels. The tires on the left side have 100 psi in them, and they happen to be tires and rims from a 1999 Crown Victoria! This is a dramatic example of how pressure holds the tire in shape, and how much stress a tire can handle.

[RX400h]

For those who doubt that higher pressures reduce tire contact area, try this simple test. Inflate a tire to 42 psi and then drive over some moist dirt or clay. Look at the area of tire that is covered with the dirt. Now deflate the tire to 32 psi and repeat the test aftet cleaning the tire. I believe you will notice more dirt on the properly-inflated tire. This means that the tire will contact pavement with more rubber, making handling more secure.

Think about this as well - If there was nothing wrong with inflating tires to the max pressures listed on the sidewall, why doesn't Toyota do that with their hybrid vehicles. Wouldn't it be better press for them to have customers achieve higher gas mileage?

Another thought.....If each of us removed our intake air filter, we'd get better fuel mileage as well but that doesn't mean we should, does it? Now what if we could somehow reprogram our hybrids so that we could run down the batteries to 20%. We'd certainly get better fuel mileage but what are the consequences?

[pauljcl]

For those who doubt that higher pressures reduce tire contact area, try this simple test. Inflate a tire to 42 psi and then drive over some moist dirt or clay. Look at the area of tire that is covered with the dirt. Now deflate the tire to 32 psi and repeat the test aftet cleaning the tire. I believe you will notice more dirt on the properly-inflated tire. This means that the tire will contact pavement with more rubber, making handling more secure.

Think about this as well - If there was nothing wrong with inflating tires to the max pressures listed on the sidewall, why doesn't Toyota do that with their hybrid vehicles. Wouldn't it be better press for them to have customers achieve higher gas mileage?

Another thought.....If each of us removed our intake air filter, we'd get better fuel mileage as well but that doesn't mean we should, does it? Now what if we could somehow reprogram our hybrids so that we could run down the batteries to 20%. We'd certainly get better fuel mileage but what are the consequences?

People have beliefs that are often the stronger for being the less tested. My 'real world' experience has been that the RXs I have had 'roll along' better at 33 psi than 30 psi, but begin being what I consider unduly harsh at 35 psi. The tires have not worn irregularly or more in the center (and this may depend on the tire: the Michelins - like BF Goodrich, their subs. - state they have a special 'equalizing' belt that maintains the contact patch more 'constant' ( my words). The temps of the tire seem nice and even across the surface after a couple of hours of driving. So that is what I use on the RX. [it may also be that Lexus errs on the side of comfort and thus slightly under-inflates the tires).

On the BMW, I preferred the feel of slightly over-inflated rear tires and regularly-inflated fronts (these are low-aspect tires, manuf. states - depending on load and speed: 36-39 psi front and up to 46 rear). I have been running 39 front and 48 rear. The rear centers have worn more than the edges in the back, but equally in the front. Tires are Conti. ExtremeContact. I don't know if another brand would wear differently, but the BMW feels good as I run it and that is what I do. When I put a new tires model or brand on the car, I will drive / test with various psi until I find what I like. To each his/her own. However, on a general 'conceptual' level, I have some concern that running tires every day (i.e. not on track) at more than 10% of the manuf. recommendations will probably reduce comfort substantially and also cause unwanted frequency response with the OEM settings of the suspension.

[mitridate]

I just purchased a CPO 2008 400h and I'm not impressed with the gas mileage. I'm averaging just under 23mpg. My take offs are very slow and I coast as often as I can. I am not a fast driver in fact people in the car with me have said they can see a nickle on the side of the road. I travel around 7 miles to work and 3 of those miles and on the interstate traveling less than 60mph. I run the AC only on the trip home. I am still on my first tank of gas and have put 230 miles on the vehicle and average mpg says 22.8. Any suggestions you all might have would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.

I am averaging between 28 and 32 mpg, the shorter the distance travelled the lower will be your mpg. For a SUV of this size, weight and power no other SUV is even coming close to this low fuel consumption,i.e. my previous Explorers were averaging around 18 to 20 mpg. Nobody can beat physics, not even Lexus :)

[SOMEONE ELSE'S GOT MY NAME]

I just purchased a CPO 2008 400h and I'm not impressed with the gas mileage. I'm averaging just under 23mpg. My take offs are very slow and I coast as often as I can. I am not a fast driver in fact people in the car with me have said they can see a nickle on the side of the road. I travel around 7 miles to work and 3 of those miles and on the interstate traveling less than 60mph. I run the AC only on the trip home. I am still on my first tank of gas and have put 230 miles on the vehicle and average mpg says 22.8. Any suggestions you all might have would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.

I am averaging between 28 and 32 mpg, the shorter the distance travelled the lower will be your mpg. For a SUV of this size, weight and power no other SUV is even coming close to this low fuel consumption,i.e. my previous Explorers were averaging around 18 to 20 mpg. Nobody can beat physics, not even Lexus :)

Very True! We traded in our 2002 Range Rover for the 400h. The Range Rover was LUCKY on a good day to maybe get 14mpg. The $6,000 tranny/transfer case had to be replace just 90 days before the warranty expired. Whew! that was TOO close. NO such reliability issues with the 400h. We are very happy with reliability, ride, mileage, power, looks, etc. Well - the visibility was better out of the RR since its sort of a fish bowl, but that's the only + we'd give it.

[Sharr]

I think I wouldn't be impressed, either if I drove only 7 miles to work. To get the oil hot enough, most vehicles need to be driven at least 10 miles, but as much as 20 miles on cooler days. As the oil gets hotter its viscosity decreases and fuel mileage increases.

We average 24-26 MPG with more highway than city driving. I'm certain that if we spent more time in the city or during high traffic times, our fuel mileage would go up. We do not drive super conservatively and I've been known to blast by X5s every now and then.

By the way, here's a post that includes a graph of RX400h owners' average fuel mileage.

http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21500

Thanks for the information. Average fuel mileage was very interesting! Hope I can get there.

[Sharr]

You have an amazing car that will last a long, long time and will feel new as well...I get about 24 and a half but I do better the times in the year that I drive farther, about 26. I hope that you will be happy with your purchase. When I got mine in January of 2006,first year for the 400h, the numbers were totally inflated to 31! I got used to the lie and I have been impressed by so much about this car. The mileage is OK but the transmission and everything else is amazing. I think that the transmission is something that I appreciate more now than when I first got this great car. Good luck and if anything maybe you can get something else. It shouldn't be too hard to sell your car and get what you paid for it. Rey in sunny LA

I have noticed the further I travel the better my mileage. It really makes perfect sense. It is truly an amazing vehicle and I wouldn't trade it for anything. Just a little disappointing at first. Thanks for the encouragement:)

[Sharr]

Sharr,

IMO, the previous posters are right on the money.

I have an '08 400h AWD, live in southeastern PA, run regular gas (10% ethanol), don't do a lot of long trips, and average ~22 in winter and am lucky with judicious driving in summer to get close to 26. People are always (negatively) surprised when I give them these "low" gas mileage figures - I just reply that moving ANYTHING weighing close to 4,440 lbs. around is going to burn a lot of gas. And, if I had the regular version, I'd be lucky to get 18-19 under the same conditions.

I'm coming up on the end of my lease and enjoy the 400h so much I very well may purchase it...the first time I've ever done that with a lease. The 2010 re-design does nothing for me and does not ride as well.

One last thing - you may want to check the tire pressure. You can inflate them to 38 with no problems and improve the mpg.

I may try to increase my tire pressure and see if it makes a difference. I think I can try it for a couple of weeks before doing any damage to the tires. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Sharr]

Please keep in mind that if you inflate your tires past approx. 34 psi (cold), they will wear out in the center, rather quickly. I had my tires at 35 psi for a while until I noticed that they were wearing out in the center. Currently, I have them set to 32-33 psi and their wear has evened out.

Good to know. I will keep and eye on them for uneven wear. Thanks:)