Brief, Occasional Misfires: P1310, P1315, P1320, P1325

[CodeReader]

1999 RX300, AWD, 125,000 miles

Brief, occasional misfires resulting a one-time vehicle jerk and a blinking CEL that stays on after about a minute. Codes vary, but are in the P1310-1325 range. These are single misfires, not continuous, in 2 or 4 cylinders. The events have happened 7 times since 2/21/09 thru today, 7/10/09. Although sporadic, on the average, these events happen every 416 miles, twenty days apart. Yes, this is a strange, but, true story.

Neither the Toyota nor the Lexus repair shops have recall of similar problems.

Has this happened to you?

What is the cause?

What is the repair?

This is serious problem with which I need help.

Thank you

[PK_3]

I'd put my money on something primitive like the ignition, maybe even plug wires.

PK

[CodeReader]

I'd put my money on somthing peimitive like the ignition, maybe even plug wires.

PK

[CodeReader]

I'd put my money on somthing peimitive like the ignition, maybe even plug wires.

PK

[CodeReader]

I'd put my money on somthing peimitive like the ignition, maybe even plug wires.

PK

You are correct PK. However, I'm looking for an experienced-based (it happened to them), more specific response.

Thank you!

[lenore]

They may be missfiring do to camshaft or crankshaft position sensor being bad. The camshaft one could be signs of oil sludge in the engine. Google those codes and it is not a pretty scene. The ignitors (coil packs) fire through a computer with inputs from the Crankshaft and camshafts positions senors. I would pull the front valve cover and see if you have sludge....

[CodeReader]

They may be missfiring do to camshaft or crankshaft position sensor being bad. The camshaft one could be signs of oil sludge in the engine. Google those codes and it is not a pretty scene. The ignitors (coil packs) fire through a computer with inputs from the Crankshaft and camshafts positions senors. I would pull the front valve cover and see if you have sludge....

Thank you. Yours is a possibility I will pursue. A couple of years ago, when I heard of the sludge on this forum, I went to 3,000 mile oil changes. There is no sludge at the filler cap. However, I can't assume that it has not collected, elsewhere.

I wonder if there is a sludge cleaning procedure for the system? I will check.

Thank you very much!

[lenore]

Until that cover is removed you wont know. Here is a picture of a sludged engine after scooping out a coffee can worth of gunk....

[CodeReader]

Until that cover is removed you wont know. Here is a picture of a sludged engine after scooping out a coffee can worth of gunk....

Lenore,

Thank you, again. A local mechanic did the spark plugs and coils by removing the cover. On Monday, I will ask him if he saw sludge.

Thank you for the picture. Is it of your motor? If so, how did you get rid of all of the sludge?

[lenore]

neigbors 2003 highlander engine (same as our engine) Som,e have had luck witgh Auto RX (google it)

[CodeReader]

neigbors 2003 highlander engine (same as our engine) Som,e have had luck witgh Auto RX (google it)

Thank you for responding to my questions.

I googled Auto RX and others. I think I'll wait on that procedure.

It appears that the crankshaft position sensors are external units that can be tested and replaced without dismantling the engine. Is that correct?

Thanks, again.

[code58]

Until that cover is removed you wont know. Here is a picture of a sludged engine after scooping out a coffee can worth of gunk....

Lenore,

Thank you, again. A local mechanic did the spark plugs and coils by removing the cover. On Monday, I will ask him if he saw sludge.

Thank you for the picture. Is it of your motor? If so, how did you get rid of all of the sludge?

CR- I think you and Lenore are talking about 2 different covers. The cover the mechanic removed to do the plugs and coils would likely be the Visual (or cosmetic) cover over the top of the engine. The cover Lenore is talking about is the front valve cover, which you would have to remove to check for sludge. It is the frontmost cover that you see when you remove the visual cover, the one that the spark plugs go through.

[code58]

neigbors 2003 highlander engine (same as our engine) Som,e have had luck witgh Auto RX (google it)

Thank you for responding to my questions.

I googled Auto RX and others. I think I'll wait on that procedure.

It appears that the crankshaft position sensors are external units that can be tested and replaced without dismantling the engine. Is that correct?

Thanks, again.

CR- from most reports of actual users of Auto RX, it seems to be one of the most successful methods to actually clean the inside of the engine, it is a product that actually does what it's supposed to, which is a challenge when it comes to sludge. I believe it was Lenore who has reported that GC (German Castrol) actually cleaned the inside of his engine. I also believe it's a full synthetic. Don't waste your time or money on flushes that only flush the $ out of your wallet, and do nothing for your engine.

[CodeReader]

neigbors 2003 highlander engine (same as our engine) Som,e have had luck witgh Auto RX (google it)

Thank you for responding to my questions.

I googled Auto RX and others. I think I'll wait on that procedure.

It appears that the crankshaft position sensors are external units that can be tested and replaced without dismantling the engine. Is that correct?

Thanks, again.

CR- from most reports of actual users of Auto RX, it seems to be one of the most successful methods to actually clean the inside of the engine, it is a product that actually does what it's supposed to, which is a challenge when it comes to sludge. I believe it was Lenore who has reported that GC (German Castrol) actually cleaned the inside of his engine. I also believe it's a full synthetic. Don't waste your time or money on flushes that only flush the $ out of your wallet, and do nothing for your engine.

(1) Thank you for the sludge cleaning information. I will follow up.

(2) To get to the back bank of plugs and coils the mechanic removed the front upper intake manifold and would have seen the sludge.

(3) Informatiom suggest that my problem may be caused by the crankshaft position sensors. Are the crankshaft position sensors accessable without dismantling the engine?

Thank you for helping

[lenore]

I have removed the intake manifold and you dont really see the sludge area....sorry. Just did this for a water leak. It only exposes the valves. not the dreaded sludge throughout the oil pan and valve covers....The valve covers are not removed when you remove the intake manifold....

[CodeReader]

I have removed the intake manifold and you dont really see the sludge area....sorry. Just did this for a water leak. It only exposes the valves. not the dreaded sludge throughout the oil pan and valve covers....The valve covers are not removed when you remove the intake manifold....

Lenore, your information has been very helpful. You seem to fully understand my problem regarding "Brief, Occasional Misfires ...." Could you please list in 1,2,3,4,... order the general steps that need to be taken to eliminate the problem? If so, please know that I will apprecate it.

Thank you.

[lenore]

this is the top of engine with intake off. Valve covers are still on. My concern, and I am shooting from the hip, is that your variable valve timing is off, I would think it would throw a code. but sludge in the cam timing gear assembly could throw the cam timing off and maybe cause a missfire. I would remove the front valve cover which is easy to get to and rule out sludge. the next thought is unhook the battery for a couple of minutes to reset all codes in the main computer. It is possible the crank or cam timing sensors may be going bad, but I just dont know. Now your mechanic removed the manifold, I would be concerned that maybe one of the plugs to the fuel injectors on top might be loose or have some corrosion.... The second picture I have circled the injectors for the front bank. Both are accessable with the cosmetic cover removed....

[CodeReader]

this is the top of engine with intake off. Valve covers are still on. My concern, and I am shooting from the hip, is that your variable valve timing is off, I would think it would throw a code. but sludge in the cam timing gear assembly could throw the cam timing off and maybe cause a missfire. I would remove the front valve cover which is easy to get to and rule out sludge. the next thought is unhook the battery for a couple of minutes to reset all codes in the main computer. It is possible the crank or cam timing sensors may be going bad, but I just dont know. Now your mechanic removed the manifold, I would be concerned that maybe one of the plugs to the fuel injectors on top might be loose or have some corrosion.... The second picture I have circled the injectors for the front bank. Both are accessable with the cosmetic cover removed....

Lenore, sorry I didn't get back to you sooner - other, non-RX300, stuff happening. You have really tried to help me. I appreciate that. Thank you very much.

I did take time to go to the library to look at Alldata. I tried to attach the document for you but it was too large. The following is from a table included with further details.

DTC NO.: P1300, 05,10, 15, 20, 25. I get P1310 to P1325 on same CEL, each time.

DCT DETECTING CONDITION: No IGF signal to ECM while engine is running.

TROUBLE AREA:

• 
  

Open or short in IGF1 or IGF2 and IGT1 - 6 circuit from ignition coil with ignitor.

• 
  

No. 1 ~ No. 6 ignition coil with ignitor.

• 
  

ECM

The table is followed by 5 pages of instructions.

I just dropped off the 6 pages to a non-Lexus mechanic who has been helpful with this. He uses some other pro-level software that hasn't been much help, yet.

Again, thank you for all the information. I'll be looking forward to any future info you send.

/s/ Vince

[lenore]

You know, the wiring could be getting an open or short. They do get hot under the hood, and quite brittle. I would check the connections carefully.....