Rear Brakes Need Changing Already?

[kosi]

Hi Folks,

I just took my 2007 ES350 in for the regular 5000 mile service. The service manager calls me and tells me 2 things:

The mechanic noticed scuff marks on my rims and wants to work on the alignment for $170. I have never known the correlation between the scuff marks and alignment(very weird). I informed him that I moved from Chicago to Southern California, and those scuff marks (curb rash) is from parking close to curbs. I am getting kinda nervous about this dealership.

Secondly the said my rear brakes are at 25%(2.5mm) and need replacing. My car has 27000 miles and I don't drive that aggressively enough for the rear brakes to be almost completely gone at 27000 miles. Of course, the warranty for brakes is 25000 so I am SOL. The cost is $330 to replace them. I really don't feel like paying that in addition to the $135 I am paying for the 25000 service( the car has 27000 miles). Everything is fine otherwise.

I have heard about some TSIB issues in this forum, and want to know if I can call corporate for some restitution for these sub-quality brakes. On the other hand, I am checking with Big 'O Tires tomorrow, to see if it'll be way cheaper. Does anybody have any experience with them, and do they replace with good, and durable brakes?

I checked online and I can find rear Akenodo brake set for $63.95. If I choose that option, I'd just find a good shop to replace them for me. Is that a good brand?

Any suggestions would be much appreciated. I've heard that it's not too uncommon to have the rear brakes wear out first. Is that true?

Thanks!!

[lowrideraz]

Hi Folks,

I just took my 2007 ES350 in for the regular 5000 mile service. The service manager calls me and tells me 2 things:

The mechanic noticed scuff marks on my rims and wants to work on the alignment for $170. I have never known the correlation between the scuff marks and alignment(very weird). I informed him that I moved from Chicago to Southern California, and those scuff marks (curb rash) is from parking close to curbs. I am getting kinda nervous about this dealership.

Secondly the said my rear brakes are at 25%(2.5mm) and need replacing. My car has 27000 miles and I don't drive that aggressively enough for the rear brakes to be almost completely gone at 27000 miles. Of course, the warranty for brakes is 25000 so I am SOL. The cost is $330 to replace them. I really don't feel like paying that in addition to the $135 I am paying for the 25000 service( the car has 27000 miles). Everything is fine otherwise.

I have heard about some TSIB issues in this forum, and want to know if I can call corporate for some restitution for these sub-quality brakes. On the other hand, I am checking with Big 'O Tires tomorrow, to see if it'll be way cheaper. Does anybody have any experience with them, and do they replace with good, and durable brakes?

I checked online and I can find rear Akenodo brake set for $63.95. If I choose that option, I'd just find a good shop to replace them for me. Is that a good brand?

Any suggestions would be much appreciated. I've heard that it's not too uncommon to have the rear brakes wear out first. Is that true?

Thanks!!

Banging the curb hard enough to cause curb rash, could very well knock the wheels out of alignment. I wouldn't fault the dealer here.

Akebono is one of the largest manufacturer's of brakes in the world. Look here:

http://www.akebonobrakes.com/

I would not be worried about using their products.

The rear brake wear issue seems to be a well documented one. I have read about it in other ES forums. However, at 27K miles, I would not expect Lexus to foot the bill on this, but it wouldn't hurt to pursue the matter further.

Lou

[1990LS400]

I don't see in the TSIB (see attached) where warranty coverage for the rear brake pad problem ends at 25,000 miles.

The TSIB includes the following:

"Applicable Warranty*:

This repair is covered under the Lexus Comprehensive Warranty. This warranty is in effect for 48 months or 50,000 miles, whichever occurs first, from the vehicle’s in-service date.

* Warranty application is limited to correction of a problem based upon a customer’s specific complaint."

I have to wonder if the Lexus dealer is trying to "double bill" for the work -- i.e. bill both you and Lexus for replacing your rear brake pads.

ES350_Rear__Brake_Pad_Wear_TSIB.pdf

[earossi]

I'm afraid that I have to agree with Randy on both items. First, front brakes do most of the braking, and consequently have, on every car I have owned, worn out first. As stated, I usually go through two sets of front pads for a set of rear pads. If there is documented evidence that there is a problem with these cars, then you should have a warranty claim. Secondly, on my other two Lexus' (both RX300's), I've gotten about 65,000 miles on front pads, and could have gone a lot longer on the rears, but decided to replace both sets since I had it up in the air. I do all the work on these cars myself, and changing out brake pads is very straight forward.

On the curb rash, I think you should pass on the request to do an alignment. Today's cars are so stroutly built that it is very difficult to take one out of alignment. Normally, alignment becomes an issue simply because of mileage and the wear of the various bushings that are in the steering system. If you suspect damage to the suspension, you will note it in the handling of the car (i.e. tends to pull to the right or left consistently) or in tire wear, which will be uneven or premature.

Based on the two items included in your note, I would suggest trying another dealer in the future. Giving your current dealer the benefit of the doubt, he sounds way to conservative on his advice, which adds up to increased costs for the owner. On the other hand, he could be more interested in repairs than in the customer. I live in Chicago and have been impressed with the Lexus dealer I occasionally take my cars to, if I choose not to do the work myself. I think that my dealer if more typical for the Lexus mark, where they are trying to provide good and honest service to the customer.

[kosi]

Guys, much thanks for the pointers. They are much appreciated. You guys saved me quite a bit of time and money. Apparently, the TSIB expired on December 8th, but has been updated to cover only squeaks, and not premature wear. They fixed it anyway under a "goodwill" gesture, since my wife got her RX from them a few weeks ago.

All in all they are a good dealership, but when I inquired why letters were not sent out, the reply was "it's a dealer issue, and not a recall." I found that funny, since I serviced the car in August, and was not informed of any such development.

I guess the "stealership" reference is not completely unfounded.... LOL

Thanks again, and keep doing what you do...

[1990LS400]

Guys, much thanks for the pointers. They are much appreciated. You guys saved me quite a bit of time and money. Apparently, the TSIB expired on December 8th, but has been updated to cover only squeaks, and not premature wear. They fixed it anyway under a "goodwill" gesture, since my wife got her RX from them a few weeks ago.

All in all they are a good dealership, but when I inquired why letters were not sent out, the reply was "it's a dealer issue, and not a recall." I found that funny, since I serviced the car in August, and was not informed of any such development.

I guess the "stealership" reference is not completely unfounded.... LOL

Thanks again, and keep doing what you do...

Did they show you documentation of the TSIB expiring on December 8th and that it has been updated to cover only squeaks? Their story sounds like total "BS" and that they want to make you think they were doing you a favor.

[kosi]

Guys, much thanks for the pointers. They are much appreciated. You guys saved me quite a bit of time and money. Apparently, the TSIB expired on December 8th, but has been updated to cover only squeaks, and not premature wear. They fixed it anyway under a "goodwill" gesture, since my wife got her RX from them a few weeks ago.

All in all they are a good dealership, but when I inquired why letters were not sent out, the reply was "it's a dealer issue, and not a recall." I found that funny, since I serviced the car in August, and was not informed of any such development.

I guess the "stealership" reference is not completely unfounded.... LOL

Thanks again, and keep doing what you do...

Did they show you documentation of the TSIB expiring on December 8th and that it has been updated to cover only squeaks? Their story sounds like total "BS" and that they want to make you think they were doing you a favor.

I got that same vibe, and just didn't want to push the issue. Even if it expired, they were still complacent because I was there in August and they "elected" not to tell me. He did show me that it was obsolete as of Dec 8th, and showed me the new TSIB number that the update was on.

[Ira d]

Hi Folks,

I just took my 2007 ES350 in for the regular 5000 mile service. The service manager calls me and tells me 2 things:

The mechanic noticed scuff marks on my rims and wants to work on the alignment for $170. I have never known the correlation between the scuff marks and alignment(very weird). I informed him that I moved from Chicago to Southern California, and those scuff marks (curb rash) is from parking close to curbs. I am getting kinda nervous about this dealership.

Secondly the said my rear brakes are at 25%(2.5mm) and need replacing. My car has 27000 miles and I don't drive that aggressively enough for the rear brakes to be almost completely gone at 27000 miles. Of course, the warranty for brakes is 25000 so I am SOL. The cost is $330 to replace them. I really don't feel like paying that in addition to the $135 I am paying for the 25000 service( the car has 27000 miles). Everything is fine otherwise.

I have heard about some TSIB issues in this forum, and want to know if I can call corporate for some restitution for these sub-quality brakes. On the other hand, I am checking with Big 'O Tires tomorrow, to see if it'll be way cheaper. Does anybody have any experience with them, and do they replace with good, and durable brakes?

I checked online and I can find rear Akenodo brake set for $63.95. If I choose that option, I'd just find a good shop to replace them for me. Is that a good brand?

Any suggestions would be much appreciated. I've heard that it's not too uncommon to have the rear brakes wear out first. Is that true?

Thanks!!

My 07 ES had the rear brakes wear out at 19K and is the only car I have seen the rear brakes

wear out so soon I did get them replaced under Warranty but its obvious the brakes use sub par

materials I plan to get after market brakes at the next change which wont be to long I supect

right now I have 36K on the car.

[Billglea]

Hi Folks,

I just took my 2007 ES350 in for the regular 5000 mile service. The service manager calls me and tells me 2 things:

The mechanic noticed scuff marks on my rims and wants to work on the alignment for $170. I have never known the correlation between the scuff marks and alignment(very weird). I informed him that I moved from Chicago to Southern California, and those scuff marks (curb rash) is from parking close to curbs. I am getting kinda nervous about this dealership.

Secondly the said my rear brakes are at 25%(2.5mm) and need replacing. My car has 27000 miles and I don't drive that aggressively enough for the rear brakes to be almost completely gone at 27000 miles. Of course, the warranty for brakes is 25000 so I am SOL. The cost is $330 to replace them. I really don't feel like paying that in addition to the $135 I am paying for the 25000 service( the car has 27000 miles). Everything is fine otherwise.

I have heard about some TSIB issues in this forum, and want to know if I can call corporate for some restitution for these sub-quality brakes. On the other hand, I am checking with Big 'O Tires tomorrow, to see if it'll be way cheaper. Does anybody have any experience with them, and do they replace with good, and durable brakes?

I checked online and I can find rear Akenodo brake set for $63.95. If I choose that option, I'd just find a good shop to replace them for me. Is that a good brand?

Any suggestions would be much appreciated. I've heard that it's not too uncommon to have the rear brakes wear out first. Is that true?

Thanks!!

My 07 ES had the rear brakes wear out at 19K and is the only car I have seen the rear brakes

wear out so soon I did get them replaced under Warranty but its obvious the brakes use sub par

materials I plan to get after market brakes at the next change which wont be to long I supect

right now I have 36K on the car.

I don't understand how a TSB can be recinded or expired. Does someone have a copy of a document that says the rear brakes are no longer under warranty. I just started to notice a noise from my brakes when I back into a parking space. I have about 26,000 miles on my 2007 ES350.

[1990LS400]

I don't understand how a TSB can be recinded or expired. Does someone have a copy of a document that says the rear brakes are no longer under warranty. I just started to notice a noise from my brakes when I back into a parking space. I have about 26,000 miles on my 2007 ES350.

Brake pads are always excluded from coverage under the Lexus basic warranty -- brake pads are defined as maintenance items in the warranty book. And it is not unusual for a TSIB to be rescinded or superceded.

It seems odd, however, that the TSIB was rescinded or superceded since premature rear pad wear seems to be so common. I guess it wouldn't hurt to call Lexus corporate but I doubt if doing that would accomplish anything. Based on the short pad life on several recent Lexus models, it is looking like Lexus wants to redefine what is normal.

[LVL61]

About an alignment. This week I hit a curb after sliding through a turn on a snow-covered side street. Brought the car in to have the front/right wheel/suspension examined and get a 4-wheel alighment done. Turns out 3 corners were out of alignment! I've only had my 08 ES for 8 months, it has less than 9000km, and that curb is the only thing I ever hit (I never rub curbs when parking), which tells me that the car was out of alignment at delivery. In the end, you should get an alignment done at least once a year. jmho.

[RetTop]

Of course, the warranty for brakes is 25000 so I am SOL.

replaced under Warranty but its obvious the brakes use sub par

materials I plan to get after market brakes

I just had the 15000 mile service done (AT 18k) and my rear brakes were worn out and rotors shot. I questioned the dealer and they researched and told me it was from pulling a trailer. Apparently the RX 400h has a valve that apportions braking more to the rear when there is weight on the trailer hitch. my fronts were at 75% but the rears were almost gone. There was extreme pitting on the rotor (not gouges from worn out pads, just pitting from the heat). The dealer says that brakes are not covered at all. Does anyone have a PDF of the warranty? I seem to have misplaced my warranty info.