Floor_It! Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Just picked up a fantastic, low milage 2001 ES300. Everything is fantastic on the car, with one major concern. The brakes on the car are very spongy and it takes more depression of the pedal than I would have expected to stop the car at a normal distance and pace. I don't think my observation is subjective either, other people I've had try the brakes agree that they are very spongy and require considerable depression to result in slowing down of the car. Is this just the way this generation or year of ES300's were built, or does it sound like something is wrong here? I have a 60 day 100% parts and labor garruntee so if you think somethings wrong I wanna move on this right away and get it taken care of. Much thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George_Jetson Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 spongy brakes are normally caused by air in the brake system. If there is air inside the ABS unit, it can be difficult to remove without as bi-directional scanner (the valves inside the abs must open to bleed it properly). Take it back and have them correct the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floor_It! Posted December 20, 2009 Author Share Posted December 20, 2009 spongy brakes are normally caused by air in the brake system. If there is air inside the ABS unit, it can be difficult to remove without as bi-directional scanner (the valves inside the abs must open to bleed it properly). Take it back and have them correct the problem. Thanks for the reply. So what should I be expecting them to do, bleed the brakes to remove the air and dirty fluid from the system and replace it with clean fluid and as a result significantly reduce the spongy pedal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eatingupblacktop Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 For your peace of mind, I would ask them to flush and bleed the system. I would also ask them to check the brake lines for any bulging which if present could fail at any time. Have them tell you how much is left on the pads and when the last brake service was done. Did you get any documented history with this car? Something to consider since you have the warranty, take the car in to a reputable shop for an overall inspection. These types of inspections are preferably done before purchasing the car. Nevertheless, get a written report and if there's anything not up to spec or that looks like a problem soon to ocurr, approach your dealer for the necessary repairs before the warranty expires. Of course you'll only be able to address whatever the warranty covers. Congrats on your new ride! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk1951 Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Oh the buyers remorse! So exciting to get a new car...well to you anyway. I totally understand. Then the reality of care and new scratches sets in! You did not give us the mileage so it is harder to extrapolate. But if you have 60 days...I would use it to the fullest advantage and get everything you can fixed or repaired. Other wise you will be back here...like the rest of us...looking for more info on how to fix stuff! Air in the line was my thought also. This is not a real common occurrence. For air to get in the fluid level has to drop significantly...or it is sucking in from some place else which will normally leak also or an improper installation of a part has happened. Look for oil on the inside of the tires or spots where you park and notice where the spot was located to the car. Could be a blown caliper leaking or something else leaking. Also if brake pads are worn differently this can show a problem sign. If the brake fluid is black or dirty this lends to a car that was not cared for or has really high miles. Lexus brakes can go 100k or better with proper care. I would be all over that car checking all fluids for color/general condition and proper level. Check condition of belts and hoses...and that your hood stays up by itself! Actually...healthy struts will lift the hood on their own on a Lexus. So on to an off topic subject that I am sure you will be back searching. Transmissions are very costly so I believe in maintaining at least every 50k. I would do a flush at 125/150k. Some feel that color is not important but I like all my fluids a nice clean color. Synthetics are really preferred but I believe with proper care and normal use regular oils work fine. Some claim not to switch to a synthetics from petroleum especially on high mileage cars. As stated get as much previous records as possible. Lexus can do a check for what they have on file with the vin number. We had a big discussion on trany fluid and this is what I found. I cut out the parts not for your car. Hope it helps. 1. The manual says to "inspect" at 125k but says nothing else about oil transfusion or what to use. I think that is too many miles to wait especially if you drive hard miles. 3. The forum seems avid against using Dexron. So I called the Dealer...Bell Road Lexus in Phoenix @ (602) 866-1474 and they told me...: Pre 1999- Dexron III ATF. 1999 to 2004- Toyota ATF. 2004+ World Standard ATF what ever that is...you new guys can fight it out. I asked about the synthetic and he said with older cars it would not really matter but suggested "no". I asked about using the Valvoline vv337 Dex/Merc Extended Life and he said it was a good product and a good replacement for the Dexron or Toyota. 5. So...I want all the oil changed out so I am doing the flush method irregardless of the damage threat (I'm such a rebel) and pulling/cleaning the pan/changing the internal screen filter. And I am using the Extended Life Valvoline. If interested in the Valvoline I have posted more info on it...read on: http://www.valvoline.com/products/consumer...ission-fluid/37 Overview from the site above: MaxLife DEX/MERC ATF contains a blend of superior base oils and a unique additive package to help extend the life of transmissions with over 75,000 miles. It is formulated to maximize transmission performance, reduce transmission wear, and improve and maintain smooth shifting longer than conventional fluids. MaxLife DEX/MERC ATF is compatible with new and rebuilt transmissions and will not void new car warranties. Recommended for use where DEXRON, DEXRON II, III and VI, Toyota T-IV and WS, MERCON®, MERCON® SP and LV, Allison TES 295 and 389, Nissan Matic-D, Matic-J and Matic-K, Honda Z-1 (except CVT), Mercedes NAG-1, Mitsubishi Diamond SP-II and SP-III and many others are required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floor_It! Posted December 20, 2009 Author Share Posted December 20, 2009 Thanks for the replies guys. I think I should mention that I did thoroughly inspect the car and it is MINT. 1 owner, 65k miles, rear seats look like they have never been sat in. Tires and brakes are brand new as well. Everything functions flawlessly and it looks like it was very well taken care of. Before this I had a 93 Cadillac Seville. There were many issue's with it, most of which I fixed by visiting either VIP or the salvage yard, so I am familar with issue's that arise with age and condition. I knew what to look at on this car when I bought it, far from going in blind, and I came to the sound conclusion this ES was a sure win. I spoke with sales manager and it happens to be that his son graduated from the same college as that I attend, and that there won't be an issue when I bring in the car to have the brakes bled and the spongy pedal checked on. I won't be able to have the car brought in for about a week, but I will post back with the results. Thanks for the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyap Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Thanks for the replies guys. I think I should mention that I did thoroughly inspect the car and it is MINT. 1 owner, 65k miles, rear seats look like they have never been sat in. Tires and brakes are brand new as well. Everything functions flawlessly and it looks like it was very well taken care of.Before this I had a 93 Cadillac Seville. There were many issue's with it, most of which I fixed by visiting either VIP or the salvage yard, so I am familar with issue's that arise with age and condition. I knew what to look at on this car when I bought it, far from going in blind, and I came to the sound conclusion this ES was a sure win. I spoke with sales manager and it happens to be that his son graduated from the same college as that I attend, and that there won't be an issue when I bring in the car to have the brakes bled and the spongy pedal checked on. I won't be able to have the car brought in for about a week, but I will post back with the results. Thanks for the help. Out of curiosity, if you depress the brake pedal, let up on the pedal and then depress the pedal again do the brakes respond differently the second time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk1951 Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Thanks for the replies guys. I think I should mention that I did thoroughly inspect the car and it is MINT. 1 owner, 65k miles, rear seats look like they have never been sat in. Tires and brakes are brand new as well. Everything functions flawlessly and it looks like it was very well taken care of.Before this I had a 93 Cadillac Seville. There were many issue's with it, most of which I fixed by visiting either VIP or the salvage yard, so I am familar with issue's that arise with age and condition. I knew what to look at on this car when I bought it, far from going in blind, and I came to the sound conclusion this ES was a sure win. I spoke with sales manager and it happens to be that his son graduated from the same college as that I attend, and that there won't be an issue when I bring in the car to have the brakes bled and the spongy pedal checked on. I won't be able to have the car brought in for about a week, but I will post back with the results. Thanks for the help. Out of curiosity, if you depress the brake pedal, let up on the pedal and then depress the pedal again do the brakes respond differently the second time? Showing your age dude! Just kidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floor_It! Posted December 20, 2009 Author Share Posted December 20, 2009 Thanks for the replies guys. I think I should mention that I did thoroughly inspect the car and it is MINT. 1 owner, 65k miles, rear seats look like they have never been sat in. Tires and brakes are brand new as well. Everything functions flawlessly and it looks like it was very well taken care of.Before this I had a 93 Cadillac Seville. There were many issue's with it, most of which I fixed by visiting either VIP or the salvage yard, so I am familar with issue's that arise with age and condition. I knew what to look at on this car when I bought it, far from going in blind, and I came to the sound conclusion this ES was a sure win. I spoke with sales manager and it happens to be that his son graduated from the same college as that I attend, and that there won't be an issue when I bring in the car to have the brakes bled and the spongy pedal checked on. I won't be able to have the car brought in for about a week, but I will post back with the results. Thanks for the help. Out of curiosity, if you depress the brake pedal, let up on the pedal and then depress the pedal again do the brakes respond differently the second time? Yeah, I tried pumping the brakes a few times and it alleviated the spongy brakes somewhat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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