Some Are Taking Action Against Toyota. Are They Justified?!

[CanadaCraig]

Hi Guys!! :)

I hope you're OK.

Some groups in the U.S. are 'taking action' against Toyota for fighting against laws to increase the average overall fuel consumption of manufacturers vehicles to 35 MPG by 2020.

What's your take on THIS?!

Craig!! :)

[SW03ES]

This legislation is not all as rosy as the eco-nuts would lead us to believe.

The reason Toyota and other manufacturers oppose it is that it is legislation that will ultimately hurt the buying public because it will drive the cost of new cars up. Being green is all well and good, but people in this country still need to be able to afford to buy cars.

This legislation, if passed, could increase the cost of a new car as much as $7-10k.

[JIBBBY]

This legislation sounds a bit communistic to me.... Last time I checked this was a free country...Go figure????? :chairshot:

[smooth1]

Yeah, I agree. It's like the seatbelt law. I agree that seatbelts are good , and save lives and all that, but you become a criminal if you don't wear one? That's just dumb.

And besides, making the mpg higher on a car won't save any gas, we'll just drive more, so what's the point? Gas has tripled in price in last 5 years. Nobody I know drives any less because of that.

And let me tell you something about the NRDC. 20 years ago I was part of the DNR for Wisconsin. Warehouser in partnership with the DNR, and the state of Wisconsin, to developed a plan to "cycle" tree cutting. We clear cut over 650,000 acres of trees over a 15 year period. a Pine tree takes 15-20 years to fully mature. Based on consumer needs, they determined how much would be needed to account for supply and demand, and so, now, they start at one end and cut the trees down and replant seedlings as they go. so by the time they get to the end, the trees they planted in the beginning are now fully developed, so they can start all over again. they now have not cut a single tree down that they haven't replaced. As opposed to the rain forest where they clear cut and leave nothing. Yet, every year, the NRDC, and a few other groups would go to the future pine plantations and drive metal spikes into the trees so when the lumber crews came along they would hit it with thier chain saws and I saw alot of very bad accidents!!! People were hurt badly. And all they were trying to do was help the forest by putting into action this reforestation project that now saves literally tons of trees every year, because they are now so well into the cycles.

These groups can sometimes just not understand, and get behind a good idea in the wrong light.

[JIBBBY]

The Helmet law too is a bit Soviet Union.....

If your old enough to buy an alcoholic beverage you should be old enough to make the choice to wear a seat belt and or a helmet for your "OWN" safety...

Back in the 1950's when we the (USA) actually had the Gonads to bomb Heroshima and not think twice about it, these new laws would never even had be considered.... Oh, how times have changed.... A man or women should have the right to not wear or wear a helmet and or seatbelt...This does not endanger other people just themselves...

Next you it will be illegal to skydive, compete in MMA, Nascar, ride a motorcycle, own a fire arm for home protection, etc... Because it is unsafe...HOGWASH I SAY!!!!!

I understand Helmets and seatbelts save lives, but it should still be a personal choice and not a law... I could go along with these laws being enforced for minors and children but for adults...Come on????????

[smooth1]

Yeah, fortunately there is no helmet law in Florida if your over 18. So, go figure, you can jump on bike with no helmet or seatbelt, but if you get in a car, you have to have insurance, and wear a seatbelt.

As we elect a Republican President, vote in a Democratic Senate, and have a split house, then wonder why nothing can get done.

[JIBBBY]

Insurance can be argued, because that involves others in accidents...Living here in Southern California, half the population is Mexican practically and the majority of those Mexicans are illegal immigrants and don't believe in insurance or can't afford it... So if you are cruising and get slammed by an illegal you want that law to be in effect here in Cali....

[smooth1]

Insurance can be argued, because that involves others in accidents...Living here in Southern California, half the population is Mexican practically and the majority of those Mexicans are illegal immigrants and don't believe in insurance or can't afford it... So if you are cruising and get slammed by an illegal you want that law to be in effect here in Cali....

I agree you would want the insurance. But I still don't think it should be a law. That was my only point there. The illegels in your area are braking the law and nobody has until recently really tried to enforce that.And, hey, let a cop see you driving without your seatbelt on and your a criminal!!!! Just doesn't make much sense to me. And according to how things are going, if I'm not mistaken, in California right now, there is a bill that would grant the illegal aliens a drivers licsence!!!!! No, all they should get is walking papers back to their country!!!

[JIBBBY]

Amen to that!!! Yeah, it's now MexiCali here in my neck of the woods....Infact English is becoming a second language here...

No hable English....Comprende????

Give it some time they (illegal immigrants) will be heading out to a town near you soon... Learn your Spanish quick...

You know I really have nothing against Mexicans, Mexican Americans, but this illegal alien crap is starting to get to me... They come across the boarder, breed like rabits, their babies become instant American Citizens and get all the welfare and Med benefits that you the tax payers pay for... Then the family is green carded because of the babies, it's that crazy I kid you not..... Then those ten kids have ten kids, the freeways are now jambed packed, schools are jambed and over loaded big time with Mexicans, courts and traffic courts are so packed with illegal mexicans it takes a full day just for a guy like me to stand in line to pay a traffic citation.. It's that crazy... It goes on and on.. I will continue to say local parks and beaches in my once predomately white areas are now over run by Mexicans playing soccer, leaving trash behind, it's really starting to get to get ugly... San Diego is joke... LA is now Mexico... etc.. etc..

I am looking to move out of this State the last couple of months no lie... If you can't beat the problem you run from the problem... That's my moto...

I understand the Mexican's that come over from Mexico just want a better life but it really takes away from the quality of life of the Citizens of the United States... This problem will spread across the country and in maybe 10 years you will see what I see. It's a problem that is constantly overlooked... The politicians now want the Mexican vote, so all leaders are gun shy to put a big holt on the illegal immigrant problem our nation faces...

Man this thread is getting political, and I really hate politics..... Hmmmm????

The funny thing is the Mexican Americans feel the same way I do about the illegals, atleast most...

[smooth1]

Yeah, in Florida we have the Cuban waves that crash on our beaches, and the Peurto Ricans, and Mexicans.

I have nothing against any of them. In fact, any person that goes thru the proper channels and comes here legally, I welcome like a neighbor!!!! But when your breakin the law, your a criminal. end of the story! And what drives me insane about this subject, is that there are people that are upset with our government for not doing more to help them. WHAT?@!?@?!? Why aren't they upset with the governments of their countries where these people come from for not providing enouph jobs and assistance and education for thier own people????? Why don't these people move to Mexico and start programs there to help?????

I'm not saying that we should turn our backs on people. But with budget short falls everywhere, you have to make cuts someplace. Why do our children is schools allways have to suffer, and police needs allways have to be bare minimums, and our firefighters on double duties, and our hospitals charge full rates for those who can pay to make up for all the ones that don't, and so on and so on.

I am a business owner. The practice of highering illegals only corrupts owners. they can charge less, and make more off the illegals who are mostly just grateful for having a job. They are the ones fighting to keep them in this country. Small business owners have a big voice in politics. Iv'e heard so many times on the news "People want their products cheap so that's why the hiring of illegal aliens is needed." The whole thing is sooooo wrong. And it has to stop!! I pay my people well. They can actually have a life off of what I pay them. But my company suffers because I don't have the capital reserve that most of my compitition has because of their hirering practices. I have been under bid many times on the mere fact that they have an illegal crew that doesn't get health care benifits, workmans comp, and substancially lower pay. It gets frustrating, and there have been times I have wanted to cave in, but I just can't see doing that to people I care about. I will not trade my values for profit!!

[JIBBBY]

Smoothe you and I see eye to eye....I too am a small business owner...Own Real Estate here in Cali... I too am tempted to hire illegals to gain more profit but I don't as well... It's such a joke...

Maybe you and I should run for office and straighten this mess out... Our leaders are sell outs, but I do think when it gets bad enough, that is when the American people will open their eyes and do something about it...Until then all we can do is do our part...

What a frigg'n shame....

[smooth1]

Smoothe you and I see eye to eye....I too am a small business owner...Own Real Estate here in Cali... I too am tempted to hire illegals to gain more profit but I don't as well... It's such a joke...

Maybe you and I should run for office and straighten this mess out... Our leaders are sell outs, but I do think when it gets bad enough, that is when the American people will open their eyes and do something about it...Until then all we can do is do our part...

What a frigg'n shame....

We wouldn't be able to win any office. You have to be able to show the reciept for your soul first. :(

[JIBBBY]

Very true smoothe very true indeed...

I think we highjacked this thread.... It's been fun, good discussions......