Just Drove The Ls460 At Tol

[jainla]

Just got back from 5 hours in the California sun at Taste of Lexus LA. For anybody in the LA area they are doing another event next weekend due to demand, so go to www.tasteoflexus.com and register if you missed this weekend and still want to go. Come early though as the lines were longer than I remember last year.

I came to this event to “see, touch and drive the unprecedented new LS460” and compare it to its 2 top German competitors, the BMW 750i and Mercedes S550. I actually drove the cars in reverse order. Some thoughts:

The Mercedes initially felt very awkward; it’s a huge car. I haven’t driven an S Class in a long time; but this car feels the same as many mid size Benzes I’ve driven; some body roll, but very good handling with lots of grip and a progressive feel. Amazingly enough, as I got onto the course and really pushed the car it started to feel smaller and more responsive. The ride is smooth but not floaty; and the air springs allow a bit of roll, but all in all a fine performance. Sporting, but not sporty.

The 750i was definitely sportier. Flat cornering, quick response, it begged to go faster (like all BMWs which probably explains why so many people who own them are crap drivers). Power did not seem quite as strong as the Mercedes, but certainly adequate for daily driving. I bet on the real (crappy) roads of LA it probably rides like a yak, but impressive on our little track.

I drove the SWB LS and then later the LWB Air spring model. Whatever concerns I had about power and the 8 speed automatic shifting constantly are gone; this car feels like a rocket. It might not be the fastest car in the group but it certainly feels the fastest and most responsive on the throttle.

While I think my LS430 has decent handling the LS460 is very much improved; the awkwardness I sometimes feel in tight turns is gone, and the steering is very quick and responsive. The car is more fun to drive fast now; and it feels more up to the challenge; although it does not tempt you to do so the way the BMW does.

The LS didn’t quite feel as connected to the road as the Benz and the Bimmer; there is not much feedback from the steering; and it didn’t feel like it has quite as much grip as the Germans but that could have been the tire choice; I chirped the tires several times in the LS but not at all on the other cars.

The LWB model with the air suspension on sport felt better; less roll and more catchability. The active steering made the car feel more responsive and somewhat more agile than the SWB model; I can’t determine if the feedback was any better. The brakes were terrific; better than the GS with a more natural feel than the E500 they had last year. Take that Sensotronic!

The steering at low speeds on both cars feels a little overboosted, but it drains away quickly at speed. This may contribute to the car feeling much less ponderous at low speeds than the Mercedes.

The LS handling is very good; I’d say overall better than the Benz but still not as athletic as the BMW. If they could figure out a way to give it the grip of the Benz and some more of the BMWs steering feel with the classic LS ride they would really have the holy grail of ride/handling. However since I sit in LA traffic for much of my life these improvements would be largely academic…but nice to have nonetheless.

However waiting for the green flag was where the tables really turned. I can add my universal disdain for the German’s odious fascination with the control knob. You get maybe 2 or 3 minutes to set up the car before you go onto the track. I tried to shut off the AC in the MB so I could hear the engine…nien! I wanted to change the radio station in the BMW so I could hear the vaulted logic 7 sound system while we were waiting to go out onto the track….verbotten! Granted if I had time to sit there and scan the rows and rows of identical looking metallic buttons (MB) or twist and click my way through the menus (BMW) I might have succeeded. In both LS’s I had adjusted the seat and was listening to my favorite radio station with the AC set perfectly by the time I put the car in drive. Easy peasy lemon squeezy….why can’t they all be that simple? I know I drive one so I had some clue of where to look; but I've driven several Benzes over the years and that S-Class was like being at NORAD.

The LS 460’s interior really is breathtaking; even compared with the UL LS430. The choice of textures, shapes and materials creates a very rich feeling in the cockpit. The steering wheel leather feels like silk; those 3 hours of polishing must really make a difference. The wood is exactly the same high quality as the holographic trim in the LS430. I still miss the articulated cup holders though. :cries: The MB interior looks nice but still feels cheap to the touch; the BMW has nice materials but the design and layout is still awkward.

The pavilion had a pre-production LS460L with the exec seating package; I can report that the ottoman works well however its use reduced the LS to a 3 passenger car. This is good because forget about carrying luggage for more than 3 people in the tiny trunk.

Oddly enough the day before I had the chance to ride around (but not drive) in a friends’ brand new LS 460L. The satnav with traffic is really cool, and on the road it seems as quiet and smooth as the LS430, perhaps even a touch quieter. The rear seat room is really cavernous now; however the vibrating massage in the rear seats is gone if you don’t order the Exec Seating package (and it seems to only be for that right rear passenger). Pity; I hope it returns soon.

All in all very impressive; while I love my LS430 and hope to drive it for a while, the LS 460 is more of that same goodness; with a dash of sport thrown in. Taking in the aesthetic and ergonomic factors as well as on the road dynamics I think it beats both the Germans overall. I know which car I’m getting next!! I’m going to go stand in line now at Quickie Mart for Lotto tickets….

[Rx330driver]

great review. Ive always wondered how lexus ever got the S class and the 7 series at these events. does lexus actually go out and buy the cars or does MB and BMW give it up for them.

I would imagine that the handling on all three are comparable because lexus wouldnt bring out the best next to the small japanese car. anways. i cant wait to test drive one.

[Robert Young]

I just drove the LS 460 at the second LA ToL, in general I agree with the prior comments. Since I was on the phone with ToL when the new date was announced, I picked 9AM and showed up early. To the credit of Lexus, there were lots of cars and the lines were never extremely long for the 5+ hours I spent there.

I actually ran the short little course 4 times with the LS 460 (while my wife was happily getting a massage, skin analysis whatever, etc.), twice hard on power / brakes and twice soft. I will have to say that the power is very impressive, but when "hammered" at around 25-30 it seems to need a bit of time to figure out what it was going to do and only then did it become impressive. I also found the electric steering and whatever they did to the brakes a bit different, somewhat less linear than I'd really like (maybe even a bit more so when driving soft). All that said, I think one could easily get used to the characteristics. After all I happily drive my Citroen influenced Maserati Khamsin with steering and brakes that are WAY different than almost anything else, it's a bit like a 4000 lb go-kart.

Regarding styling & competition, I had not been in the current S550 and did not like either the interior or exterior at all (neither did my wife). I also found the S550 very ponderous over the short little course, a bit like an old Cadillac in fact. The 750i did not feel that way at all and I'm sure the S550 would be better in real world driving. When standing in line looking at the 750i and the LS 460s running around, obvious pick up on Bangle styling for the LS 460. However, I'm really not a fan of Bangle styling and I prefer our 2006 LS 430, that purchase decision timing was influenced when I saw the early LS 460 design studies.

One thing I'd really like to have from the LS 460 is the XM sat real-time traffic nav. I think Lexus could retrofit the nav update to the older cars as the XM receiver (XM tuner kit 861000W091) appears to fit in the trunk next to the nav electonics and I think its on one of the data buses. Possibly Lexus will if they push it into more platforms that use the LS 430 type system in current model years. I'd pay serious $$ to get that put into the LS 430 and I've talked with my friends at XM (I've helped build their satellites) to see if they can push that from their end to sell more XM installations.

[jainla]

Oddly enough I ended up going back on saturday with a friend of mine. They had to take one of the 7 series bimmers out of circulation because the passenger side door refused to close completely. Doh!

After another couple hours of watching the 460's run around the track I must admit the new styling is growing on me. It's not as formal and a little more flashy than the 430 but it's a good looking car.

The second time around the LS460 still felt precise and settled around the track. i wish the 460 had the steering feel of the BMW but otherwise it still feels well controlled, especially next to the Mercedes. It also was the most comfortable car to sit in.

I would be intrigued as to the possibility of the XM nav being made available in the 430 series. I suppose it's possible to replace the NAV ecu on the AVC-LAN bus but I'm wondering if the resolution difference in the screens would matter. I think its an intriguing opportunity for a 3rd party vendor....Vaistech are you listening?

I just drove the LS 460 at the second LA ToL, in general I agree with the prior comments. Since I was on the phone with ToL when the new date was announced, I picked 9AM and showed up early. To the credit of Lexus, there were lots of cars and the lines were never extremely long for the 5+ hours I spent there.

I actually ran the short little course 4 times with the LS 460 (while my wife was happily getting a massage, skin analysis whatever, etc.), twice hard on power / brakes and twice soft. I will have to say that the power is very impressive, but when "hammered" at around 25-30 it seems to need a bit of time to figure out what it was going to do and only then did it become impressive. I also found the electric steering and whatever they did to the brakes a bit different, somewhat less linear than I'd really like (maybe even a bit more so when driving soft). All that said, I think one could easily get used to the characteristics. After all I happily drive my Citroen influenced Maserati Khamsin with steering and brakes that are WAY different than almost anything else, it's a bit like a 4000 lb go-kart.

Regarding styling & competition, I had not been in the current S550 and did not like either the interior or exterior at all (neither did my wife). I also found the S550 very ponderous over the short little course, a bit like an old Cadillac in fact. The 750i did not feel that way at all and I'm sure the S550 would be better in real world driving. When standing in line looking at the 750i and the LS 460s running around, obvious pick up on Bangle styling for the LS 460. However, I'm really not a fan of Bangle styling and I prefer our 2006 LS 430, that purchase decision timing was influenced when I saw the early LS 460 design studies.

One thing I'd really like to have from the LS 460 is the XM sat real-time traffic nav. I think Lexus could retrofit the nav update to the older cars as the XM receiver (XM tuner kit 861000W091) appears to fit in the trunk next to the nav electonics and I think its on one of the data buses. Possibly Lexus will if they push it into more platforms that use the LS 430 type system in current model years. I'd pay serious $$ to get that put into the LS 430 and I've talked with my friends at XM (I've helped build their satellites) to see if they can push that from their end to sell more XM installations.

[greggebhardt]

great review. Ive always wondered how lexus ever got the S class and the 7 series at these events. does lexus actually go out and buy the cars or does MB and BMW give it up for them.

I would imagine that the handling on all three are comparable because lexus wouldnt bring out the best next to the small japanese car. anways. i cant wait to test drive one.

I share this reviewer's comments on the interior of the LS. I love the silky stearing wheel that heats up at the touch of a button!