Better Brakes?

[NicLX470]

I know the LX470 is a beast and very hard on the pads and rotors. I got new OEM Toyota rotors less than 5k miles ago on all 4 wheels and they are already starting to show signs of warping. Is it possible to upgrade to bigger calipers and rotors for this truck for a brake system that does not have to work so hard. Or would getting the kind that are drilled/slotted work better? Anyone done any of these things and have gotten any better results? Because I know if I just go get these resurfaced they will be warped again in just a few thousand miles.

[Jim_Chow]

I know the LX470 is a beast and very hard on the pads and rotors. I got new OEM Toyota rotors less than 5k miles ago on all 4 wheels and they are already starting to show signs of warping. Is it possible to upgrade to bigger calipers and rotors for this truck for a brake system that does not have to work so hard. Or would getting the kind that are drilled/slotted work better? Anyone done any of these things and have gotten any better results? Because I know if I just go get these resurfaced they will be warped again in just a few thousand miles.

Don't bother resurfacing rotors. BTW, it's usually not the rotor that warps. Rather, it's an uneven depositing of brake pad material on the rotor from an improper break-in process. To properly break-in new pads/rotors, you are supposed to pre-warm the rotor (very easy braking a few times), then accelerate to 60-70mph fast, brake hard (not so hard that the ABS kicks in, but almost as hard) down to 5mph, immediately accelerate back to 60, brake hard again down to 5. Do this 3-4x. Now drive easy for 10 min or so w/o using brakes at all. Then repeat the sequence once more, drive home (trying not to use the brakes), park in the garage (don't use the e-brake!), let sit overnight. The break-in process burns off the deposits on new pads and deposits pad material evenly on the rotor. Stoptech has a good description of what really happens...

http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml

Now that said, the OEM toyota rotors/pads are so-so (OEM honda rotors/pads are better, IMHO). I installed A.R.T. cryogenically frozen slotted rotors w/ Porterfield R4s carbon/kevlar pads (and stoptech braided stainless hoses, added on 6 months later). Braking is excellent, no signs of rotor/pad wear after 2 yrs of use. The harder you brake, the better they brake. BTW, the ART rotors are considerably heavier than the OEM lexus/toyota rotors, which means more iron/higher density inside (more heat-sinking ability). The alternative I was going to go with are the Powerslot cryogenically frozen slotted rotors w/ the same pads. Price would have been about the same, but there's a guy on the ih8mud forum who has a LC w/ 35" tires and pulls a trailer. Nothing would stop his rig except the ARTs, so I decided to give them a try.

For some background, I've been using the Powerslot non-cryo slotted rotors (brembo blanks) w/ R4s pads on my 86 4runner for 7 yrs. After 7 yrs, there was still about 40% pad material remaining, and the pads/rotors were wearing together at the same rate. There was no sign of the warped feel, either. One key thing to remember when installing rotors is to evenly torque the bolts in a criss-cross pattern with a torque wrench. DO NOT use a pneumatic wrench to install, as they don't sense torque. I had a toyota dealer change my rotors/pads back in 2000 on my 4runner (ran $1K) and within 1 yr, they had that warped feeling. That's when I tore it down myself and installed the Powerslots w/ Porterfield pads for $300. I recently sold the car and the brakes were still good 7 yrs and 95K miles later!

I would avoid cross-drilled. You lose too much surface area from the holes, plus if you don't drill them correctly, they tend to crack around the holes. Slotted are better, IMHO.

[asuapplepie]

Jim,

Have an 06 lx470 and the brakes are starting to squeal. I also need new tires. But I HATE dealers--especially the one in my rural area. How should I go about replacing them both. My husband is a farmer and could do it all except the balancing of the tires. Do you recommend or no?

Need advice on what brakes and tires to buy and where to get. Had been looking at General grabber hts, continental crosscontct lx, kumho roadven apt kl51 and cooper discoverer cts. Many sources seem to have them on backorder and local dealers say they cant get them.

Not sure where to even start on what to do about brakes. Should I get an inspection/estimate to find out what is needeed? You seem to be a wealth of information. Any advice you have would be appreciated. It is mostly used as a grocery getter/kiddo carter, but gets to go off road on occaision...

Also, seat heaters quit working a few months ago, but when accidentally flipped on make the console and under the gearshift really hot. Best way to handle??

Thank you,

Amanda

asuapplepie@yahoo.com

I know the LX470 is a beast and very hard on the pads and rotors. I got new OEM Toyota rotors less than 5k miles ago on all 4 wheels and they are already starting to show signs of warping. Is it possible to upgrade to bigger calipers and rotors for this truck for a brake system that does not have to work so hard. Or would getting the kind that are drilled/slotted work better? Anyone done any of these things and have gotten any better results? Because I know if I just go get these resurfaced they will be warped again in just a few thousand miles.

Don't bother resurfacing rotors. BTW, it's usually not the rotor that warps. Rather, it's an uneven depositing of brake pad material on the rotor from an improper break-in process. To properly break-in new pads/rotors, you are supposed to pre-warm the rotor (very easy braking a few times), then accelerate to 60-70mph fast, brake hard (not so hard that the ABS kicks in, but almost as hard) down to 5mph, immediately accelerate back to 60, brake hard again down to 5. Do this 3-4x. Now drive easy for 10 min or so w/o using brakes at all. Then repeat the sequence once more, drive home (trying not to use the brakes), park in the garage (don't use the e-brake!), let sit overnight. The break-in process burns off the deposits on new pads and deposits pad material evenly on the rotor. Stoptech has a good description of what really happens...

http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml

Now that said, the OEM toyota rotors/pads are so-so (OEM honda rotors/pads are better, IMHO). I installed A.R.T. cryogenically frozen slotted rotors w/ Porterfield R4s carbon/kevlar pads (and stoptech braided stainless hoses, added on 6 months later). Braking is excellent, no signs of rotor/pad wear after 2 yrs of use. The harder you brake, the better they brake. BTW, the ART rotors are considerably heavier than the OEM lexus/toyota rotors, which means more iron/higher density inside (more heat-sinking ability). The alternative I was going to go with are the Powerslot cryogenically frozen slotted rotors w/ the same pads. Price would have been about the same, but there's a guy on the ih8mud forum who has a LC w/ 35" tires and pulls a trailer. Nothing would stop his rig except the ARTs, so I decided to give them a try.

For some background, I've been using the Powerslot non-cryo slotted rotors (brembo blanks) w/ R4s pads on my 86 4runner for 7 yrs. After 7 yrs, there was still about 40% pad material remaining, and the pads/rotors were wearing together at the same rate. There was no sign of the warped feel, either. One key thing to remember when installing rotors is to evenly torque the bolts in a criss-cross pattern with a torque wrench. DO NOT use a pneumatic wrench to install, as they don't sense torque. I had a toyota dealer change my rotors/pads back in 2000 on my 4runner (ran $1K) and within 1 yr, they had that warped feeling. That's when I tore it down myself and installed the Powerslots w/ Porterfield pads for $300. I recently sold the car and the brakes were still good 7 yrs and 95K miles later!

I would avoid cross-drilled. You lose too much surface area from the holes, plus if you don't drill them correctly, they tend to crack around the holes. Slotted are better, IMHO.

[1990LS400]

Chow certainly has some "interesting" ideas.

Don't be concerned about a little squealing. Something as simple as removing the wheels and blowing the dust off the brakes might help with that.

Check each brake pad for thickness. I don't have an LX but the minimum acceptable pad thickness for my LS is only 1 millimeter. To get the biggest bang for my brake pad buck, I almost always wait until brake pads are worn down to the minimum and trigger a warning light or noise. Repair shops just love to recommend and do brake jobs long before they are needed -- it's easy money even if they are essentially cheating you.

Unless brake rotors are severely warped they can be resurfaced multiple times until their thickness is below specification. Brake rotors on vehicles made by Toyota are usually unusually robust and can have life expectancies of far over 200,000 miles.

If you do need a brake job, don't "cheap out". Buy OEM pads and have the rotors turned/resurfaced. And, of course, vehicles almost never need all the brake pads replaced at the same time. Rear brake pads generally last 50% to 100% longer than front brake pads.

As much as you HATE dealers, you may need one to fix your heated seats unless you know of a good repair shop with the required diagnostic skills and technical literature. There is a very detailed diagnostic procedure for the seat heater of each Lexus model involving testing switches and electrical connector pins for voltage, resistance or continuity. Don't let anyone just start replacing components without figuring out exactly which component has failed.

[asuapplepie]

Chow certainly has some "interesting" ideas.

Don't be concerned about a little squealing. Something as simple as removing the wheels and blowing the dust off the brakes might help with that.

Check each brake pad for thickness. I don't have an LX but the minimum acceptable pad thickness for my LS is only 1 millimeter. To get the biggest bang for my brake pad buck, I almost always wait until brake pads are worn down to the minimum and trigger a warning light or noise. Repair shops just love to recommend and do brake jobs long before they are needed -- it's easy money even if they are essentially cheating you.

Unless brake rotors are severely warped they can be resurfaced multiple times until their thickness is below specification. Brake rotors on vehicles made by Toyota are usually unusually robust and can have life expectancies of far over 200,000 miles.

If you do need a brake job, don't "cheap out". Buy OEM pads and have the rotors turned/resurfaced. And, of course, vehicles almost never need all the brake pads replaced at the same time. Rear brake pads generally last 50% to 100% longer than front brake pads.

As much as you HATE dealers, you may need one to fix your heated seats unless you know of a good repair shop with the required diagnostic skills and technical literature. There is a very detailed diagnostic procedure for the seat heater of each Lexus model involving testing switches and electrical connector pins for voltage, resistance or continuity. Don't let anyone just start replacing components without figuring out exactly which component has failed.

[asuapplepie]

Thank you so much for the reply. I, too, am a 'reformed' Mercedes driver. It may be why I detest dealers so much!! Going to see if I REALLY need pads....

Amanda

[Hasanak86]

Hi, Thanks for sharing info. Where did you buy those A.R.T. cryogenically frozen slotted rotors from? how much were they?

[Hasanak86]

1 minute ago, Hasanak86 said:

Hi, Thanks for sharing info. Where did you buy those A.R.T. cryogenically frozen slotted rotors from? how much were they?

Hi, Thanks for sharing info. Where did you buy those A.R.T. cryogenically frozen slotted rotors from? how much were they?

On 8/12/2009 at 8:36 PM, Jim_Chow said:

Don't bother resurfacing rotors. BTW, it's usually not the rotor that warps. Rather, it's an uneven depositing of brake pad material on the rotor from an improper break-in process. To properly break-in new pads/rotors, you are supposed to pre-warm the rotor (very easy braking a few times), then accelerate to 60-70mph fast, brake hard (not so hard that the ABS kicks in, but almost as hard) down to 5mph, immediately accelerate back to 60, brake hard again down to 5. Do this 3-4x. Now drive easy for 10 min or so w/o using brakes at all. Then repeat the sequence once more, drive home (trying not to use the brakes), park in the garage (don't use the e-brake!), let sit overnight. The break-in process burns off the deposits on new pads and deposits pad material evenly on the rotor. Stoptech has a good description of what really happens...

http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml

Now that said, the OEM toyota rotors/pads are so-so (OEM honda rotors/pads are better, IMHO). I installed A.R.T. cryogenically frozen slotted rotors w/ Porterfield R4s carbon/kevlar pads (and stoptech braided stainless hoses, added on 6 months later). Braking is excellent, no signs of rotor/pad wear after 2 yrs of use. The harder you brake, the better they brake. BTW, the ART rotors are considerably heavier than the OEM lexus/toyota rotors, which means more iron/higher density inside (more heat-sinking ability). The alternative I was going to go with are the Powerslot cryogenically frozen slotted rotors w/ the same pads. Price would have been about the same, but there's a guy on the ih8mud forum who has a LC w/ 35" tires and pulls a trailer. Nothing would stop his rig except the ARTs, so I decided to give them a try.

For some background, I've been using the Powerslot non-cryo slotted rotors (brembo blanks) w/ R4s pads on my 86 4runner for 7 yrs. After 7 yrs, there was still about 40% pad material remaining, and the pads/rotors were wearing together at the same rate. There was no sign of the warped feel, either. One key thing to remember when installing rotors is to evenly torque the bolts in a criss-cross pattern with a torque wrench. DO NOT use a pneumatic wrench to install, as they don't sense torque. I had a toyota dealer change my rotors/pads back in 2000 on my 4runner (ran $1K) and within 1 yr, they had that warped feeling. That's when I tore it down myself and installed the Powerslots w/ Porterfield pads for $300. I recently sold the car and the brakes were still good 7 yrs and 95K miles later!

I would avoid cross-drilled. You lose too much surface area from the holes, plus if you don't drill them correctly, they tend to crack around the holes. Slotted are better, IMHO.