DBrucher Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 97 ES300: The last time I changed my brake pads was more than a full year ago, I'm sure, but the issue I'm having has finally driven me batty. The last set of pads I bought were ceramic. They came with little aluminum clips that slide over the notch in the caliper and hold the brake pads steady. BOTH sets (all 4 pads) in the back squealed because of the little buggers, so I re-did the whole job, took them out, and discarded. I don't know if it was my rotors being slightly warped or what, but after taking the little clips out, no more squeaks. I know what you're thinking, but it's not the 'When your brake pad gets THIS short, it's supposed to squeal' thing; it's not. I left the clips in on the front, though because I had no problem up there. So for the past year or so I've heard a small 'clink' when applying the brakes - I know what it is, it's the pads clinking metal on metal while the car rolls forward (same in reverse). Now I want that noise to stop. Sorry for the long rant, but basically my question is this: What are those little aluminum clips called, and you think I can get some without having to buy another set of pads? I stopped in Schucks and sounded like a lunatic not knowing exactly how to explain. I had them pull a set of pads but, of course, those didn't require them. Ideas? Thanks, guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Yeah, those pads are the isolation shims and are designed to reduce/eliminate the squeal from microvibrations through the pads. Older pads have separate isolation shims, which each time I redo brakes, I use RTV gasket maker to seal/bond the isolation shim to the pad itself. Then I smear some copper flake contact paste on the very back side of the assembly (the face that pushes against the caliper piston/housing). The copper flake paste not only acts as a vibration reducer, the copper makes a nice buffer to prevent audible vibrations. Newer quality pads have the isolation shims actually pre-bonded to the pad itself. I still smear on some copper flake paste when installing. I've never had brake squeal in the least bit since I've started this technique. Although, the noise you are talking about is not caused by either. There is a TSB out on the 'brake click' noise for the RX300, so I'm not surprised the problem extends to the ES300 as well. I believe the fix in the TSB was to place heavy grease in the areas that interface and can cause the click. I'm going to replace my front brakes this weekend or the next, and I currently have the 'click' thing going on with my RX300, so I'll let you know if the copper paste in key areas reduces/eliminates this issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrucher Posted October 3, 2008 Author Share Posted October 3, 2008 Cool, thanks for the reply. The people at Schucks kept thinking the same thing - the shims on the back, but those've never been a problem. I also goop the backs up where the caliper actually makes contact with the shims with what I call "!Removed! Juice" - works great. I might have to bite the bullet and just replace the pads once again to get those clips. If so, C'est la vie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Can I ask what brand of pads you are using? Some pads are cut a little more precisely and fit better than others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrucher Posted October 3, 2008 Author Share Posted October 3, 2008 Raybestos ceramic pads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Raybestos pads are decent, but stepping up to Centric or Akebono or other higher-quality brand may be $10-$20 more, but you may find they have a more precision fit, which will reduce the slop, and hopefully eliminate the click sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camlex Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Wagner TQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 5, 2008 Share Posted October 5, 2008 I just replaced my brakes today. I put heavy axle grease on the inside and outside of the pressed-metal brake pad retainers that sit in the caliper mount (these are what the brake pads sit in). Upon reassembly and test, there is no click any more... nothing but smooth, strong, quiet braking! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrucher Posted October 6, 2008 Author Share Posted October 6, 2008 Cool, thanks for the replies. Next pad change, I'll drop the extra coinage and get some better pads that actually fit correctly without supports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Just for a visual for everyone... here's what the little clips in discussion look like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 PS, don't forget to remove, clean, and regrease your slide pins on the caliper mount!! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrucher Posted October 6, 2008 Author Share Posted October 6, 2008 No, mine are shiny aluminum and have a notch where it connects to the side of the caliper and an opposite notch on the other side where the pad slides in. I wish I could show you guys, but alas, I threw them out. I guess I could take the front ones out... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Lastly, incase anyone is curious, here's how the final install looked. Centric rotors, Akebono brake pads, heavy grease on the pad retaining clips, and copper flake paste on the back side of the pads themselves. Brakes work flawless... no squeal, no click... just smooth solid brake pedal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrucher Posted October 6, 2008 Author Share Posted October 6, 2008 That looks good, man. My calipers are red and I sanded the shims down on the pads so they're shiny and reflective. I dig your rotors, though, those look good. I may have to sip off your Kool-Aid next spring... as for now, soon, none of my cosmetics will mean anything when I put my winter tires and rims on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Hmm.... you're either describing your wear-indicators or your isolation shims... neither of those should contribute to the 'clink' that you were describing. It's the pressed metal 'baskets' in the picture are what are causing the clink... putting some nice thick grease on these should take away the click noise. These pics are from my RX300, but I'm pretty sure when I did our ES300 brakes it was the same set up with the spring baskets (although the front calipers on the ES300 are dual pot... the RX300 just has a single pot... what's up with that?). Are you talking about the plates in the picture? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrucher Posted October 6, 2008 Author Share Posted October 6, 2008 No, but surprisingly, your picture has exactly what I'm talking about: Don't sue me, but I stole your picture and edited it back. See attached - red circles. THOSE little clips are what I removed and threw out. I'm sorry it's taken this long to explain, but thanks for sticking with the topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blk_on_blk Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Thanks! Yeah, I was pretty pleased with how nice the Centric rotors are for their price. Red calipers always look cool on the right set up, but I hear you on them disappearing behind the snow tires with winter in Alaska right around the corner. When spring comes you're probably going to have to do a little cleaning on them to make them pop again, eh? Ahhhhh, yes... yeah, you threw out the little clips that hold the brake pad in... and yep, you're going to get clicks-galore without them. Those are the guys that need all the heavy grease to keep quiet. I'm not too sure what you can do without them. I highly doubt it will hurt anything, but you'll definitely get more movement without them. I don't even know where to get new ones, since they are factory parts (or do new ones come with new pads... can't remember). Nice job on the re-edit... pics sure help clarify things, huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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