Sc430 Or Not?

[Bly]

Sadistic you may be right about the flat spotting but what's the difference between flat spotting and "A tire might feel like it has flat spots, but that is just the tire heating up to temperature"? It's still bumpy for the first mile or two. Other than that the Continental extreme contacts are pretty quiet. I would say that they are not as high performance as full summer tires but they seem to do the job for all season tires.

[Sadistic]

A flat spot on a tire can actually damage the tire, and create uneven wear along the tread of the tire. As the flat spot is working out, if it can be worked out the edges of the flat spot are going to wear more. The same thing happens if you were to slam on your brakes and slide for a long period of time, where your car is sliding, the portion of the tread contacting the road is going to be more worn than the rest. And you will feel that "flat spot" in the life of the tire. When its cold outside, the air inside the tire is also cold. It doesn't move around inside the tires as fast. Your tire pressure rises as the tire comes up to operating temperature. That's why tires explode under certain circumstances. So as your tire is coming up to temp, the air in the tires is uneven and makes the tire feel like it's out of balance. Also the tires when cold, are extremely stiff and they're not going to give to bumps in the road as easily, which will make the ride much stiffer. Now, normal P-metric 195-70-14 tires can flat spot over night. If it gets drastically cold. Those tires have 70% of 195 mm of a sidewall. Which is much larger than a 225/40/17 That would be 40% of 225 mm. Also the tires aren't made with the same reinforcements that performance tires are, so the side wall can give a lot more. Performance tires usually have a belt that's spread further from the others guarding the edge of the tread, where as a normal seasonal radial has them more towards the center of the tread. When that happens to a radial it's more of a flat spot in the tire due to sidewall, A bad flat spot in a tire is usually in the thread, not the sidewall. There's really two forms of flat spotting, where the entire tire is actually flatened, and where the thread has a flat spot in it. Both aren't good, but the second is by far worse. The first can also lead to the second.

[ooo]

Sadistic,

Thanks for sharing your expertise on tires. I'll probably get the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S for my SC430.... but how do you feel about the Pirelli PZero Nero M+S ? They have slightly better ratings at Tire Rack primarily becuase they're less noisey than the Pilot Sport A/S...

thanks

[Sadistic]

With my expierence with Pirelli's is that they're a tad noisier and stiffer than other tires in their class and price range. With that said, they also usually perform better, but don't last as long. By the tread design on the Nero's they look like they would make more noise than the Sport A/S'. I've never had either of these tires under me on a car, so I can only go with what I see. From reading countless reviews on tires, the Sport A/S' usually crush every tire they come up against, in comfort, noise and performance. I know they did so against the P-Zero 7000's. I haven't seen a comparrison between the Neros and the A/S so you'll have to go with your reading on that one. Either tire is going to be good in my opinion. I am more biased towards Michelin I will admit just because of the multiple sets that I've gone through in the past. And I've learned over and over that my money was well spent with Michelin tires.

[markb]

Well, with regard to new non runflat tires for my sc430, I have narrowed it down to three tires, the Michelin Pilot a/s, the Pirelli zero nero and the Yokohama db( sorry for inaccuracies.) Does ANYONE have PERSONAL experience with any of these tires? The Yokohamas seem the quietest and softest, the Pirellis seem like the best performance and the Michelins appear to be what most people get. I am not taking my car to the race track and just want tires that are as quiet as possible and as comfortable as possible. I am not expecting the ride of an LS 430 (why, really, shouldn't I expect it but I am not) but I figure that I got this car for its luxury and comfort and not for its trunk space and would hope that I can get a ride that is all that the car has to offer. It is a crime to have paid so much for this car and have to deal with a tire problem of all things. I love the car but I am *BLEEP*ed to have to deal with getting tires for the car to make it feel the way that it should. I want the same feeling driving the car as I have when I get into the car and look at the interior. Anyways, I appreciate any input.- Mark

[markb]

I am also noticing that the Goodyears are also very highly rated as alternative to runflats for sc430. Very difficult to choose.

[ooo]

thanks Sadistic.... My Lexus dealer parts manager is also partial to the Michelin. The Pirelli PZero Nero M+S has not come out yet in the 245-40-18 size yet. Pirelli keeps pushing it back... maybe in early 2004 tire rack tells me. There is one person who owns an SC430 on tire rack reviews that installed the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S for the SC430. He gave it about the best rating you can.... said it transformed the SC430.... day and night difference from his Bridgestone run-flats.... Mark, I think any of the tires you mentioned will be far better from the run flats. If you go with Pirelli, make sure it's only the ones I mentioned that haven't come out yet. All their other models in our size range have poor reviews.....

I'll let everyone know when I install either of the two I mentioned....

[markb]

Thanks for info. everyone. Interesting about the new Pirellis. Now my decision is that I have only 3400 miles on the runflats. I feel like going out and putting miles on them to better justify changing. They are not THAT bad but I am interested in getting the best ride possible. Later.... Mark

[ooo]

Check your cold tire pressure. The bridgestones are much better at 35 or 36 psi... rather than the recommended 33 PSI.... at 35/36 much better handling, car feels lighter and quieter................. and probably longer lasting

[LEXUS420]

I know its preference mostly, but I am an avid promoter of Michelin Pilot Sports. Best tire IMO.

[markb]

I have a 2002 sc430 with very low (3500) miles with runflats. I love the car but perhaps without runflats the riding experience would be improved. Took it to dealer today after calling lexus. The dealer confirmed loud noise of tires, especially upon braking and also the bumpiness. They told me that there is only a 10% difference if I change to non runflats. I have read many posts on this forum to suggest that the % would be somewhat higher. If anyone out there has made the change, could you please explain the difference that I can expect and what tires you changed to. I would be leaning to the Goodyear Eagles because of quiet and less harsh ride. Thank you so much for your help.- mark

[Sadistic]

Adjusting your tire pressure past what the manufacturer will make your tire wear faster and unevenly. Also by adding more air your ride would be more harsh, but your turning would become more responsive.

[SPORTcoupe300]

Hey mark,

lets just say that the noisiest performance non-runflat will be much quieter than your run-flats.

You don't have to worry about noise and comfort, just buy the one that has plenty of traction for whatever conditions you live in.

Only exuivalent tires to run-flats in noise would be spiked offroad tires. :D

[ooo]

Mark,

I still have my bridgestone run-flats... 14K miles on a 2002 SC430. The only reason I didn't switch is because I didn't want to carry a spare in the tight space and I'm not sure about the flat fix cans. I wish i could find an inflatable spare like Mercedes offers.

I have not liked the runflats from day one. They're noisey all the time and especially when braking to slow down and stop. I'm also a member of the Great Britain SC430 site... much tighter SC community... sounds like they have all switched to non run flats... and from all my reading and analysis the difference is day and night! Much better than 10%. Sounds like a 100% difference and much quieter ... maybe 30% to 50% quieter. The Lexus dealer is full of BS... Sounds like they don't want to deal with it... But you are right!!!!!

I am very familiar with the SC430 and ride, etc. Have had mine for about two yeras now.... I plan on on installing the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S in the next few days. They are 291 per tire balanced and installed. Much more expensive than the bridgestones, goodyears and pirellis, but I'm convinced now worth it.... I will let you know.

[markb]

Well, it looks like I am going to go with non runflats and would like some input. Has anyone installed the spare tire kit yet? What other realistic alternative is there?- No tire, tire in backseat, tire in a can? None that I can see.

Now, on to the tires. Everyone seem to be going with the Michelins(Pilot Sport, Pilot Sport A/S) Keeping in mind I bought a "sporty" car and not an all out sports/ race car, and am most interested in the comfort and noise categories, it would appear that the Yokohama AVS DBS2 tire is difficult to ignore, followed by the Goodyear Eagle F1GS-D3 and then the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S. Am I missing something here? Please, any input would be great. Thanks- Mark

[SPORTcoupe300]

Toyo Proxes FZ4

My tire guy recommended these so I bought them. He said Toyo is the #1 company this year, beating Michelin in performance and pricing.

There's a high performance model available (T1-S) but I don't think you need that much performance.

I'm really happy with the tires.

They are not loud and have plenty of traction.

They're also resisting wear pretty well considering I have some camber issues.

Check it out.

[Sadistic]

Toyo beats out other companies in sales, not performance. They beat everyone out, because they were one of the first companies to 1) Make tires in sport compact sizes. And 2) Make extremely cheap tires. I was forced to run Toyo Proxes on my Eclipse when I needed a tire fast. (AWD so I needed 4 of the same size) And they were one of the worst tires i've ever driven on. They're tires that you would settle for in my opinion. I wasn't impressed with wet tire traction, nor dry for that matter. The reason why Proxes get such high praise, is because it's 16 year old kids with Civic's that are praising them.. "Mmm Civic make big smoke, cheap to replace." In my opinion your money is much better spent in a better tire. If you own a Chevelle and want to burn your tires off, they are the tire of choice. Right there next to Radial T/A's.

Mark you have to remember one thing.. You bought a Sporty car, which the A/S tires were made for. If you had an all out performance car, you would have Pilot Sports on your car, not the Pilot Sport A/S'.

[ooo]

Yes the SC430 is a sporty car, not a sports car.... in addition, it's a fine, luxury, beautiful, powerful awesome car. For the money with the Michelin Pilot Sports A/S and a good immediate practical road solution for a flat tire..... there is no better value out there for an incredibly reliable great car! Take a porshe on a long 8 hour road trip and see how you feel afterward vs. driving the SC430. Plus it's a automatic hard top convertible. Two different cars! I can't wait to get the michelins installed!

If anyone from Lexus is reading... can you guys please come up with a better flat tire solution.... At the very least give us the spare for free... We got the tire jack with the car even though you gave us the crummy Bridgestone run flats!!!!!

[Bly]

I was going to say exactly the same thing about the 10% difference between runflats and nonrunflats that 000 said. Obviously the dealer has never driven the car with nonrunflats. IT'S A DIFFERENT CAR. When my wife, who wouldn't feel it if she drove off the grand canyon, notices the difference there is nothing else to say. As for the trunk conversion kit, I did it. Not a big deal. When you need extra space take out the spare, one spin off nut, and enjoy the drive. Everyone reading this who has run flats should be contacting Lexus customer service to complain about the tires. I did and I got a $500 credit. They know the tires stink. BTW with the runflats the car is undrivable in the snow. I live in the NY area. I drove home yesterday with the Continental extreme contact all seasons (non runflats) and did very well in snow mode. It was slow but I got home and kept in on the road without any real problems.

[SPORTcoupe300]

Toyo beats out other companies in sales, not performance.

I was forced to run Toyo Proxes on my Eclipse when I needed a tire fast. (AWD so I needed 4 of the same size) And they were one of the worst tires i've ever driven on.

I wasn't impressed with wet tire traction, nor dry for that matter.

The reason why Proxes get such high praise, is because it's 16 year old kids with Civic's that are praising them.. "Mmm Civic make big smoke, cheap to replace."

That's not right sadistic.....

Toyo Proxes T1-S outperforms your overpriced Pilots anyday, dry or wet.

If you had problems with a tire on a dry road in an AWD car, you just don't know how to drive.

I'm not 16, I don't drive a Honda, and obviously I think the tire performs well enough for me to recommend it to a fellow lexus owner.

If you have a better suggestion, we're all happy to read you opinion, but don't diss other people's opinions especially using 16 year-old civic driver remarks.