Lex Will Not Start

[overdose007]

need help asap.

:I am having my starter in my lexus ls 400 1995 changed and the problem is.

the Mechanic put the new starter in and assembled the car enough so that the check engine light would turn off and he started the car. the car started 4-5 times with no problem. then he finishes assembling the job completely (intake manifold and all) and he tries to start the car and it sounded like it wanted to start but would not, and now it will does not even make the clicking sound it did when it had the bad starter in there and also now, the factory car alarm, the light that blinks which is located behind the turn signal, does not even blink anymore, even when you lock the car but all the other lights in the car work, headlights, tail lights, dash light, etc.

the starter is new, bought from advanced auto and has a life time warranty.

the fuses have been checked and they are all fine.

the new starter was benched before installing and it was fine.

the previous starter that was in there lasted about a year, (got from a junk yard) but the one before that was the original. Car has 130,000.

battery is about a year old.

[Leadfoot]

need help asap.....

and also now, the factory car alarm, the light that blinks which is located behind the turn signal, does not even blink anymore, even when you lock the car but all the other lights in the car work, headlights, tail lights, dash light, etc. 

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From the above clue there is a feed to the theft deterrent ECU that passes through the starter relay and the neutral start switch. Since you don't hear a click from the starter solenoid you probably have a starter relay problem. You should check the relay in the No. 2 junction block located in the engine bay next to the battery (look underneath the cover to determine location of the relay).

To check the relay you need to

1. Inspect Relay Continuity

(a) Using an ohmmeter, check that there is continuity

between terminals 1 and 3.

( b ) Check that there is no continuity between terminals 2

and 4.

If continuity is not as specified, replace the relay.

2. Inspect Relay Operation

(a) Apply battery voltage across terminals 1(+12V) and 3(-ve).

( b ) Using an ohmmeter, check that there is continuity

between terminals 2 and 4.

If operation is not as specified, replace the relay.

Post back if this checks out OK and I will look into it more.

Fingers crossed.

Leadfoot.

[overdose007]

need help asap.....

and also now, the factory car alarm, the light that blinks which is located behind the turn signal, does not even blink anymore, even when you lock the car but all the other lights in the car work, headlights, tail lights, dash light, etc. 

←

From the above clue there is a feed to the theft deterrent ECU that passes through the starter relay and the neutral start switch. Since you don't hear a click from the starter solenoid you probably have a starter relay problem. You should check the relay in the No. 2 junction block located in the engine bay next to the battery (look underneath the cover to determine location of the relay).

To check the relay you need to

1. Inspect Relay Continuity

(a) Using an ohmmeter, check that there is continuity

between terminals 1 and 3.

( b ) Check that there is no continuity between terminals 2

and 4.

If continuity is not as specified, replace the relay.

2. Inspect Relay Operation

(a) Apply battery voltage across terminals 1(+12V) and 3(-ve).

( b ) Using an ohmmeter, check that there is continuity

between terminals 2 and 4.

If operation is not as specified, replace the relay.

Post back if this checks out OK and I will look into it more.

Fingers crossed.

Leadfoot.

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Thank you for the post,

my mechanic tried that, he checked the starter relay and fuses and the connections to the starter.

I just do not understand why it would start up when half assembled then not when it is fully assembled. and why the alarm will not blink now. these dam# cars are expensive as heck to repair. but thanks again, any advise helps at this point.

[Leadfoot]

Hmmmm. I hate it when it nots the easy stuff. Have you got a starter circuit diagram? If you don't have juice at your solenoid its because something upstream is faulty. The current flows through these items in sequence

1) Battery

2) AM2 30A fusible link

3) Main Fusible link

4) Starter relay (therefore you will have 12V at terminal 2 permanently)

The other half of the starter circuit flows through

5) AM2 30A fusible link

6) Ignition switch. The current splits from AM2 (white with red wire) to IG2 (black and orange) and ST2 (orange)

7) 7.5A ST fuse

8) Neutral start switch

9) Black wire to terminal 1 of start relay. From terminal 3 it goes too the

10) Theft deterrent and door lock ECU.

I would double check that you have 12V on term 1 of the start relay for yourself. Only once the current is flowing through the second half does the starter relay get pulled in which causes current to flow through the starter solenoid.

Unfortunately the body electrical section of my manual which describes the theft deterrent and door lock ECU does not show where the start relay feeds in. Don't know if I can help any further, except to say work methodically back from the end (or most convenient point now that its back together) checking for voltage to work out if the problem is upstream or downstream.

The manual also says don't leave the ignition on for longer than 10 minutes, but my mechanic drained my entire battery through mine once (then I killed him ).

Good luck.

[RFeldes]

It seems to me that you have to reset the anti-theft ECU which has disabled engine start. I had the same problem with my Gen1 but don't have the car or manual for the procedure anymore. Also your battery may be low on juice from so many starts, prior, compounding the problem. Someone will chime in.

[overdose007]

It seems to me that you have to reset the anti-theft ECU which has disabled engine start. I had the same problem with my Gen1 but don't have the car or manual for the procedure anymore. Also your battery may be low on juice from so many starts, prior, compounding the problem. Someone will chime in.

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Ok, the alarm, the blinking light behind the turn signal, stays on, it does not blink but just stays on so i guess that is better then it not flashing or coming on at all. but the problem still accurs with the starter not starting and not even making the clicking sound, nothing.

[RFeldes]

If it stays on it needs to be reset. Nothing will happen until you do. If I remember correctly, it is a simple procedure but someone will post for you, I'm sure.

[RFeldes]

All right, Since we have not had a response, I would disconnect the battery for 2 minutes and re-connect. Hopefully, resetting the ECU, Then try setting the alarm with remote lock and wait for the blinking light. About 2 minutes. Then unlock the door with the key or remote. If the alarm "light" goes off. Try starting the car with jumper cables in case the battery is not fully charged at this juncture. Hope this helps, "Leadfoot" knows his stuff and can help you from here if I am totaly offbase. Sure wish I could remember how I reset the alarm properly. Getting old is a Bitc$. Good luck. Please let us know.

[dfkd]

Security reset should be: close all doors and turn key in driver door 3 times (turn top of the key backward 3 times)

[overdose007]

Security reset should be: close all doors and turn key in driver door 3 times (turn top of the key backward 3 times)

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thanks all, so resetting the alarm, will this get the car to start again or this is just to reset the alarm, what i mean is that since the alarm needs to be reset, will that affect the car not starting. Does the alarm need to be set for the start to start because as of right now everytime you turn the key, nothing happens, as far as starting the car, all lights come on and everything but car will not start, no click or nothing but the alarm light just stays on red, no flashing. thanks all.

[akewlguy]

One would think the alarm reset would allow you to restart the LEXUS. I think its a kill system that does not allow one to start until its reset?

[RFeldes]

Correct, the car will not start until you re-set the alarm.

[overdose007]

Security reset should be: close all doors and turn key in driver door 3 times (turn top of the key backward 3 times)

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i turned key 3 times to lock it and 3 times to unlock and nothing then i did it 3 times to unlock and 3 times to lock and nothing. thanks for the post guys, anything helps. trying to avoid taking it to the dealer.

[RFeldes]

"Call" the dealer and ask how to reset the alarm. A service advisor should help you.

[Leadfoot]

Damn shame, I was hoping it was going to be as easy as turning the key a few times.

Looking at the manual it lists the reasons for not starting, ranked in likelyhood, as;

1) Starter Relay

2) Starter

3) ECU powersource circuit

4) Neutral start switch

5) Theft deterrent ECU

The new one to me is the ECU powersource. It is too complicated to describe in words, you need to get either a manual (I downloaded all the PDF's for my car from the Toyota Information Service at http://techinfo.lexus.com/ best $10 I ever spent) or take it to someone who knows. The page is from the troubleshooting section TR114. This should rule out a faulty ignition switch.

Just to humour me please confirm that you have applied voltage across the relay terminals as I stated before and the thing actually pulled in.

The starter we know is fine and the whole mystery about the turning over when partly assembled and not when complete still has me baffled.

In a case like this the only way to solve it is to ignore all assumptions and check every component.

Is the battery fully charged?

Have you got 12V at the terminals?

Have you got 12V at the relay?

Etc.

Have a list and tick them off in order, pedantic but it works. Perseverance will get you back on the road, hopefully soon.

[overdose007]

Damn shame, I was hoping it was going to be as easy as turning the key a few times. 

Looking at the manual it lists the reasons for not starting, ranked in likelyhood, as;

1) Starter Relay

2) Starter

3) ECU powersource circuit

4) Neutral start switch

5) Theft deterrent ECU

The new one to me is the ECU powersource.  It is too complicated to describe in words, you need to get either a manual (I downloaded all the PDF's for my car from the Toyota Information Service at http://techinfo.lexus.com/  best $10 I ever spent) or take it to someone who knows.  The page is from the troubleshooting section TR114.  This should rule out a faulty ignition switch.

Just to humour me please confirm that you have applied voltage across the relay terminals as I stated before and the thing actually pulled in.

The starter we know is fine and the whole mystery about the turning over when partly assembled and not when complete still has me baffled.

In a case like this the only way to solve it is to ignore all assumptions and check every component. 

Is the battery fully charged?

Have you got 12V at the terminals?

Have you got 12V at the relay?

Etc. 

Have a list and tick them off in order, pedantic but it works.  Perseverance will get you back on the road, hopefully soon.

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I will try this and keep you guys posted but as always, thanks for everything so far.

[overdose007]

Damn shame, I was hoping it was going to be as easy as turning the key a few times. 

Looking at the manual it lists the reasons for not starting, ranked in likelyhood, as;

1) Starter Relay

2) Starter

3) ECU powersource circuit

4) Neutral start switch

5) Theft deterrent ECU

The new one to me is the ECU powersource.  It is too complicated to describe in words, you need to get either a manual (I downloaded all the PDF's for my car from the Toyota Information Service at http://techinfo.lexus.com/  best $10 I ever spent) or take it to someone who knows.  The page is from the troubleshooting section TR114.  This should rule out a faulty ignition switch.

Just to humour me please confirm that you have applied voltage across the relay terminals as I stated before and the thing actually pulled in.

The starter we know is fine and the whole mystery about the turning over when partly assembled and not when complete still has me baffled.

In a case like this the only way to solve it is to ignore all assumptions and check every component. 

Is the battery fully charged?

Have you got 12V at the terminals?

Have you got 12V at the relay?

Etc. 

Have a list and tick them off in order, pedantic but it works.  Perseverance will get you back on the road, hopefully soon.

←

I will try this and keep you guys posted but as always, thanks for everything so far.

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thank you everyone, my car is running. the mechanic did not have one of the connectors on good, thank god. but really, everyone that gave advice, thank you very much, it is much appreciated. everything is working, even the alarm. again, as you can tell iam happy, thank you everyone and i will continue to post to help others out as you all have done.

[overdose007]

Damn shame, I was hoping it was going to be as easy as turning the key a few times. 

Looking at the manual it lists the reasons for not starting, ranked in likelyhood, as;

1) Starter Relay

2) Starter

3) ECU powersource circuit

4) Neutral start switch

5) Theft deterrent ECU

The new one to me is the ECU powersource.  It is too complicated to describe in words, you need to get either a manual (I downloaded all the PDF's for my car from the Toyota Information Service at http://techinfo.lexus.com/  best $10 I ever spent) or take it to someone who knows.  The page is from the troubleshooting section TR114.  This should rule out a faulty ignition switch.

Just to humour me please confirm that you have applied voltage across the relay terminals as I stated before and the thing actually pulled in.

The starter we know is fine and the whole mystery about the turning over when partly assembled and not when complete still has me baffled.

In a case like this the only way to solve it is to ignore all assumptions and check every component. 

Is the battery fully charged?

Have you got 12V at the terminals?

Have you got 12V at the relay?

Etc. 

Have a list and tick them off in order, pedantic but it works.  Perseverance will get you back on the road, hopefully soon.

←

I will try this and keep you guys posted but as always, thanks for everything so far.

←

thank you everyone, my car is running. the mechanic did not have one of the connectors on good, thank god. but really, everyone that gave advice, thank you very much, it is much appreciated. everything is working, even the alarm. again, as you can tell iam happy, thank you everyone and i will continue to post to help others out as you all have done.

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well fellows, i went to get my car, started ok and everything but now the "trac off" (traction control) is blinking and the car will not go out of first gear. it drives about 30 mph at about 4-5000 rpms but will not go into second gear and the traction control button does not work.

[RFeldes]

Last time OD............. disconnect the battery 2 minutes and allow the ecu's to re-set/boot. Please............... :cries: And we will start from there..

[overdose007]

Last time OD............. disconnect the battery 2 minutes and allow the ecu's to re-set/boot. Please...............:cries:  And we will start from there..

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Sorry but i am not the one doing the work, my car is at a mechanics shop (works out of his garage) and i am relaying what you guys tell me to him.

[Leadfoot]

Last time OD............. disconnect the battery 2 minutes and allow the ecu's to re-set/boot. Please...............:cries:  And we will start from there..

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LOL, I really like a happy ending. Most of my problems have been traced to faulty mechanics! They are easy to change but very hard to diagnose.

That is a big cat RFeldes, what do you feed it?

[akewlguy]

I did hear something in the past about when there is transmission issues the car may shut down and all that. I dont know all the details, but something crossed my mind about about previous posting. Good luck

[RFeldes]

Last time OD............. disconnect the battery 2 minutes and allow the ecu's to re-set/boot. Please...............:cries:  And we will start from there..

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LOL, I really like a happy ending. Most of my problems have been traced to faulty mechanics! They are easy to change but very hard to diagnose.

That is a big cat RFeldes, what do you feed it?

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He eats whatever he likes, But does his "situps" in the morning to work it off ;)