the-headless_horseman

From your initial post, I don't think you have given enough time & miles for the vehicle to be properly 'broken in'. :whistles: How many miles are currently on the RX? ← I have over 1700 miles on it now...performing better than it was...the original 22.9 mpg is now almost 25 mpg...trying to coast a little more but using power when need it...highway about 27 mpg, depending on speed and road conditions... Headless

I think we need to clarify something here.... Highway mileage is just that...cruising at say 55-75 mph... City mileage can be interpreted a few ways...if you drive in a major surburban/city area and are in stop and go traffic all the time, your electric motors are all you need...you'll get over 30 mpg...this is because you are not often times going over 20 mph... However, if you live in the suburbs and have to start and stop on 35/45/50 mph roads, then you are going to get about 23-25 mpg...reason is because the electric motor is not enough to give you power up to the speed you need...then, top it off with frequent stops at lights and having to start up again...this will adversely affect your mileage... So, if we can set that straight, we can see why the highway mileage is better unless we are talking about bumper to bumper traffic for long periods of time...'normal' suburb driving is not that efficient...unless you drive late at night and don't hit all the lights...can coast a lot! Headless

The same trip to work I was originally getting 22.9 mpg with I am now getting close to 25 mpg...reason? Change in driving style to allow for more coasting (when available) and I guess some engine breakin... I also figured out that the less battery you use when the car is off, the less the ICE wil run when you first start up...it seems that there is an automatic battery charging session when you first turn on the car...and this will NOT show up on your dash display of the engine/battery energy control...haven't checked the navi screen on this though... Headless

No, not backward. 24 mpg refers to 45 mph roads with frequent stops and needing to get back up to speed quickly so the person behind you doesn't ram into you! This leads to the worst mileage, no matter what car you drive...by the time you coast, you have to stop again... On the highway, at least you get to coast, especially with cruise on (definitely recommend cruise when on the highway)...this is where your mileage numbers go up...or, of course, when you're in bumper to bumper traffic and only the electric motor is working... Headless

Okay, everyone, here's an update... I now have about 1700 miles on my RX400h. I can honestly say that highway mileage will range between 26 and 28 depending on speed...figure about 28 mpg at 60 mph...more like 26 mpg at 75. In regards to normal, everyday use...I'm around 24 mpg...still disappointed with this and don't expect too much more. I do have to admit that my area is probably the worst area to drive for fuel efficiency...many roads here are 45 mph limits with lots of hills and lights on the hills...sometimes you have to accelerate to get over the hill...this is an efficiency nightmare! As far as performance, the car is great...very comfortable...I don' t have the ML audio (although I wanted it) but I can safely say the stereo is 'good enough.' Listening to Flamenco (by Jesse Cook) is rather clear...tweak the mid range a bit to help! The voice activation is incredible if you can get a printout of all the commands...anyone have one? There must be a few hundred commands....I only know a few...HELP with this one please! Everything else good to go...for all you newbies, get a cargo mat...I leave mine rubber side up to prevent sliding when taking turns at a speed faster than 10 mph... As far as eletric motor running at certain speeds, I have found that the more warmed up the car, the more efficient both the gas and electric motor(s)...still hard to get car to run only on electric if you want to accelerate with any respectability... Anyway...still probably another 2000 miles for total engine breakin...I'm figuring I'll end up with 25 mpg 'normal' use, as described above, and about 27 on the highway...if ever in bumper to bumper traffic, you can safely assume the 31 mpg with no problem! Headless

What you are saying sounds about right... I think some on this board are accelerating rather slowly...if you accelerate and the gas kicks in, as it should when you actually try to keep up with traffic, you're going to get normal mileage... Those that are saying 30, 40 mpg, etc...I don't see that in real world driving...maybe coasting on a deserted road, but in higher traffic areas, stop and go on roads around 45 mph will put a demand on the vehicle for the gas to kick on...your mileage will suffer...but you'll still get around 25 mpg... As far as highway, the electric will kick on to maintain speed...if you go up a hill, the gas will kick on...this is normal... Expect about 28 mpg at 60 mph, about 25 at 75-80 mph...this is still very good mileage...only on the stop and go heavy traffic on I-95 did I see numbers over 30 mpg... Headless

The engine only kicks on for a minute or two or three...it will take away about 1 mpg on your meter...then again, this depends on how far you've traveled...if you happen to be in bumper to bumper traffic and get a few 'breaks' along the way, once you get up a little speed, the coasting will help prolong the battery charge... Headless

I have found that warming up the vehicle is crucial...being the car does not idle, this would entail driving over 10 minutes at a time... My drive to work is about 10 minutes, so I end up with about 25 mpg now...however, on my 1000+ mile trip over the weekend, I could be coasting at 20 mph, hit the acceleration a bit and only electric would kick in... From a standstill, if you're going to get 'up to speed' at like 35 or 45, you're gonna pay for it...however, in stop and go traffic, the little accelerations to keep up with the car in front of you will be made with electric, and this is where your mileage will be very good! Just remember that even in stop and go, the battery will run down in 15 minutes, and the gas will kick on...no matter what you do...the battery has to keep a certain amount of charge... Headless

...60 mph, you'll get about 28.4 mpg ...65 mph you'll get around 27 mpg ...at 70 mph, you'll get in mid 25s ...at 75-80 mph, you'll get in upper 24s Actually, these figures for the RX400h are significantly worse than what a Camry 4 cylinder can do. A Camry 4 cylinder gets (based on almost a dozen I have rented and driven thousands of miles): ...60 mph, about 34 mpg ...65 mph about 32.5 mpg ...70 mph, about 31 mpg ...75-80 mph, about 29 mpg The Toyota Highlander is about the same size vehicle as the RX400h and is available with the Camry 4 cylinder engine and so probably gets the same or a little better gas mileage than the RX400h. A 4 cylinder Highlander can only accelerate 0-60 in 10.5 - 11.0 seconds, so the RX400h is alot more powerful. ← I don't think there's much comparison between a 4-cylinder highlander and the RX400h...in appeal, performance, and/or luxury... Sure, the highlander might do better on the highway, but it won't do better in heavy traffic.. Plus, the RX has amenities that the highlander doesn't have...I'd also have to worry coming off a short ramp onto the highway as the highlander doesn't accelerate quickly and it could get you in trouble... The hybrid Highlander will be a good choice...a lot more money than a standard highlander, but the best of both worlds...basically, a RX400h with less amenities...but the engine will be the same, and that's a good thing! Headless

Okay everyone... Here's what I got!!! I drove my RX400h over 1000 miles this weekend...from MD to SC and back... I averaged about 27.1 mpg going down as I hit traffic in DC and Northern VA...in traffic, the mileage was great as I was able to coast around on the electric...however, the gas motor did kick on when the electric battery was drained enough...this took about 1 mpg off the avg. before it shut off again...I was not using air or heavy battery drain accessories... When I filled up, my manual calculations showed 27.1...the computer said 27.2... While driving around in slower terrority with 35-50 mph limits, I averaged in low 25s...when you accelerate from stop and have to get up to speed more quickly, it does adversely affect your mileage... On the ride home, I was at 24.1 for the first 150 miles...don't know why...oh yeah, had air conditioning on...so, figure that takes a little over 1 mpg away... The rest of the trip I averaged a little over 27...got as high as 33.1 when in traffic again around Fredericksburg, VA...big accident apparently and lots of traffic... So, I am a converted man...I see the vehicle can do the mileage as stated and I just needed to use it a lot more... BTW...speeds...at 60 mph, you'll get about 28.4 mpg...65 mph you'll get around 27 mpg...at 70 mph, you'll get in mid 25s...at 75-80 mph, you'll get in upper 24s...I had over a 1000 miles to test this, so you can be sure the range is somewhere around this... Headless

My system read 24 mpg at my first fill-up...but it was really 23.4...perhaps I filled up more than dealer, but still numbers a little low... Right now I'm trying hard to get to 23...and keep it there...still shorter drives though... Perhaps with more time it'll get up and over 25...I don't expect this vehicle to ever get over 26 on 'normal' driving for me...time will tell, I guess... Headless

Buyer's remorse, eh???? I don't think so...just adjusting to numbers not (yet) meeting expectations... Other than this issue, I love the car...it is quick (carefully though) and has tons of cool features...I'm sure I'll get years and years of quality use out of it... I'm just bickering over the mileage numbers cause I really wanted to see those great numbers right off the bat... Today alone I discovered how to drive 'older'...didn't tailgate, coasted more, and tried to time accelerations...mileage went up .5 to 22.9...23.0...I'm trying guys/gals...honest... I do think for those of you getting near 30 with normal road and highway use that your vehicle is tuned differently!!!??? Headless

Although I doubt in one fillup you are going to go from 22 to 25 mpg, I do appreciate your certainty regarding better mileage over time...(probably your driving style contributed more to your improved numbers) The RX has a more advanced hybrid system as compared to the Prius, so I expect that it should get better with time as wel, if not even moreso (% wise)l...it's just tough to drive it off the lot and get such low mileage when the darn sticker says it'll do much better... If the trend with the Prius is a nice long breakin, then I have no problem with a breakin for the RX...as far as changing driving habits, I can do that, to a point...I still want to enjoy driving, and timing my coasting with every acceleration doesn't really cut it for me...however, a little compromise is in order, and I'm fine with that... If I could end up with over 25 mpg combined given some time, while actually enjoying driving, I'll be praising this car to everyone...however, if it stays in the low 20s, you can be sure I won't be a Lexus proponent...so far, I contain my sentiments to this and like boards... Headless

Yeah, I'm beginning to think I need to get this puppy on the highway and drive it a few hundred miles to realliy 'open it up.' The gas motor needs to loosen up a little and I am aware that short trips aren't the best gauge for mileage... I will take the car next weekend on the open road and test several speeds on cruise for efficiency....I'll then report the numbers here for all to see... I fully EXPECT to be breaking 26 mpg at the lower highway speeds...55/60 mph...I just hope I don't fall asleep as the car is quite comfortable! BTW, Patt, the link you sent me said that most cars do not get their best efficiency until 3-5k miles...that's quite a distance....and quite a way to improve mileage...I'd like to see improvements regardless of driving types during this time! Headless

First of all...does the RX qualify for the $2000 fed. tax credit? Anyone have an update on that? I remembered seeing $1000 for 2005, but if the $2000 has been extended, that's great...and the RX should count...it is a hybrid!! (regardless of price!) As far as questions about how many miles driven...400...I'm sitting around 22.7 mpg right now but I realize that my drive to and from work is only about 7 miles each way...not much time for the engine/batteries to warm up and get efficient...it's 35-45mph speeds, is hilly, and has lights...maybe not the best conditions for optimal mileage... However, I did drive on the highway about 50 miles and did not do 'too' well...at 75 mph, my mileage avg. dropped from 24.0 to under 23.5...on the return 25 miles, I put it in cruise at 68 mph the last 10 miles and it did jump up to 24.0 again...so, I was glad to see that... My main concern is the mileage issue (obviously)...I do love everything else with the car...the features are great and easy to use...Lexus is number one for a reason...let's hope the mileage numbers get a LOT better with time... Headless

Beating a FX35 in a race...no way...the FX35 is still faster than the RX400h...look at the numbers... No $2000 tax credit...it's a $1000 tax credit for 2005, last I looked... Using HOV lanes not a factor for me...I'm not using the highways during rush hour... Stability system the same as Infiniti...side air bags are a nice plus as well as superior navi system and blue tooth...can't knock that...Lexus rules in this area hands down...but, that's still not reason we all bought the car... That high price tag is/was for high performance and excellent efficiency...looks like we get our pick of one or the other...one thing for sure with the RX...at least the RX400h isn't using premium gas...most other SUVs require such now! That alone is a .20-.25 cent difference per galllon at the pump! If I can drive this car normally and get over 25 mpg on average, I'll be content...(still think we should get 31/27 with normal driving...none of this grandma stuff!)... Headless

As listed above in the Lexus press release...this car was meant to deliver performance and efficiency.... The way I see it at the current time is take your pick...you ain't gonna get both... I know I sound like a constant complainer...I'm quite suprised with myself...argh!! However, I cannot believe I spent over $50,000 on this thing...I expected waaaay too much, evidently...and Lexus has delivered waaaay too little...well below expectations.... I think if you were to poll 250 owners (probably about as many on the road right now), most would not be happy with the vehicle thus far... Getting good performance and good mileage together is not a bonus...it's what we paid for...and if we're not getting it, we have a right to be upset! Sure, my RX400h may get 5 mpg better than my friend's FX35, and with cheapy gas instead of premium, but, the price differential is huge and it's not like the Lexus delivers a much better ride...the FX outperforms the RX in many ways...$10,000 cheaper too (takes a long time to make up that price difference with gas!) I was hoping to get about 12 mpg better...this would be worth bragging about...right now, I'm embarrased with this car! Lexus should have done better...esp. with all the extra time they took to test the vehicle! Headless

Anyone think this car is up to original specs? eh???? Lexus Introduces RX 400h, World's First Luxury Hybrid SUV 01/06/2004 Detroit, MI Lexus introduced what will be the world's first luxury gas-electric hybrid SUV today at a press conference at the North American International Auto Show. The RX 400h will be powered by a V6 Hybrid Synergy Drive system that combines sub-eight second zero-to-sixty acceleration with fuel-efficiency equivalent to the current average for a four-cylinder compact sedan. The RX 400h will also be rated Super Ultra Low Emission Vehicle (SULEV), one of the most stringent emissions rating in the industry. "The new RX 400h re-defines the midsize luxury SUV market while raising awareness and acceptance of hybrid gas-electric vehicles among luxury car and SUV buyers," said Denny Clements, Lexus group vice president and general manager. "This is truly a breakthrough in terms of hybrid gas-electric powertrains because, for the first time, it adds a new performance dimension to the traditional hybrid advantages of high mileage and low emissions." Lexus created the car-based, luxury SUV segment with the launch of the innovative RX 300 more than five years ago. For 2004, Lexus made significant enhancements to the luxury content, performance and safety features with the introduction of the RX 330, making this vehicle the perfect match for the new V6 hybrid system. The new RX 400h will become the premium model in the RX series, offering smoother and quieter operation, increased performance, significantly better fuel economy and a host of high technology, safety and comfort features. Vehicle Dynamic Management The RX 400h will introduce another industry first called VDM, or Vehicle Dynamic Management. Monitoring a variety of sensors, the system is designed to anticipate the onset of a vehicle skid or slide and then helps correct the situation with a combination of braking and throttle control. The new VDM system is less obtrusive than conventional VSC but ultimately more effective. More Powerful, Advanced Drivetrain The 400h hybrid powertrain combines a powerful electric motor with the highly efficient 3.3-liter V6 engine found in the RX 330 to significantly improve low to mid-speed acceleration and overall fuel efficiency. The system is a "full hybrid," meaning that the RX 400h is capable of operating in separate gas or electric modes, as well as a mode that combines power from both. The RX 400h will develop a peak system output of approximately 270 horsepower and deliver combined fuel economy significantly better than the current average compact sedan rating of 27.6 miles-per-gallon. Zero-to-sixty acceleration will also improve over the current RX 330's sub-8 second time. The RX 400h with optional all-wheel-drive, which features a rear-drive electric motor, will accelerate quicker yet. The RX 400h uses a regenerative braking system to further boost system efficiency. When the vehicle is coasting or the brakes are applied, the electric motor functions as a generator, capturing kinetic energy that would normally be lost as heat through the brakes and converting it into useable electricity to recharge the batteries. One of the most remarkable features of the RX 400h is how similar this SUV is to its cousin, the RX 330. The computer-controlled powertrain seamlessly blends power from the V6 gasoline engine, the electric drive motor and the generator. The driver does not feel the vehicle changing operational modes. In fact, the only give-a-way is the absence of the traditional tachometer. In its place, the RX 400h has an illuminated power meter that displays the level of power generated by the gas-electric hybrid powertrain. The driver will also be able to monitor the gas-electric power distribution on the available seven-inch touch panel display screen that comes with the navigation system. Luxury and Convenience Features Lexus craftsmanship and attention to even the smallest details continue with the RX 400h. Nearly every feature available in the RX 330 is found in the RX 400h, with the exception of an exclusive RX 400h use of brushed aluminum accents inside that convey a high-tech look and feel to match its capabilities. The three-spoke steering wheel features easy-to-use controls for the audio system as well as the hybrid system's on-board computer monitor located in the center instrument panel. "We believe the RX 400h will exceed the expectations of luxury vehicle buyers and establish a premium market for performance-oriented, fuel-efficient gas-electric hybrids," said Clements. Preliminary Specifications Powertrain: Engine - 3.3 liter V6 Electric motor(s) - Permanent magnet Estimated total horsepower - 270 Expected EPA emissions rating - Super Ultra Low Emission Vehicle (SULEV) Transmission - Electronically-controlled Continuously Variable Transmission (ECVT) Wheelbase: 106.9 in. Length: 186.6 in. Width: 72.6 in. Height: 66.1 in. # # #

Okay everyone... Here's one for the forum... I drive to work about 10 minutes...during that time, the car gets horrible mileage...as we all know, the RX400h engine runs almost the entire first 1-3 minutes..I guess to recharge the batteries... One the way home from work tonight, I ran an extra errand...a few miles out of the way...I found that my mileage was a little better although it was in similar driving conditions... I'm learning that following behind someone is bad...really...riding the brakes and accelerating kills the mpg....I think this car 'rolls' more than others to help the batteries? I'm also learning that perhaps the longer you drive it at a given time, the more the engine and batteries warm up, thus running more efficiently... For example...whenever I accelerate, even slowly, the gas motor kicks in at like 5-7 mph...when I was coasting on a street tonight at like 25-30, I lightly hit the gas and actually got some battery power...kept me coasting...without the gas kicking on....I have never seen this before...anyone think that if you drive 25 minutes opposed to 15 that it makes a difference? Headless

Resets itself??? Why would it do that? On the RX400h, you reset the mpg on the navi screen...you leave it going as long as you want...(or as short as you want)...that way if your trip is over 1 gas filling, you can gauge it for the whole trip...don't see an advantage to a car resetting the mpg gauge itself with each gas fill-up! On the RX400h, the display is either on the navi screen or on the dash...in the instrument cluster area...you can actually view it in 2 places... Headless

It's nice you're getting 25 mpg plus...I'd like to get there as I'm in the 23 mpg club right now... Again, my friend's Odyssey is getting near 28 mpg on the highway...I think about 17 in city...so, either way, it does a lot better than those 13 mpg numbers...he has the newer model with the cylinder shut-off..he is averaging about 21 mpg right now overall...that's pretty good! The bottom line for the RX400h is as follows: it's a great vehicle with tons of cool features...a technological marvel. However, no matter how anyone wants to put it here, it was pushed as being a very efficient, powerful, luxury SUV...first of its kind. With that in mind, I don't think the VAST majority of buyers will be happy with sub-25 mpg numbers....period...if there is a long breakin period, then I should have heard that from Lexus, not from other car owners (no offense guys/gals)...you cannot put a car out that says 31/27 and expect people not to make a peep when it's getting in the low 20s combined...that doesn't cut it in a 50k dollar vehicle...period...forget comparing it to anything else...compare it to what it's said to do...if it does it, then expectations are met and eveyone is happy...if it falls short, you're going to have a lot of unhappy people...right now, Lexus has a lot of unhappy people! Now, in all fairness, will the mileage gett better with time? I think so...it makes sense...but Lexus should have enough testing to tell us that it's going to get near 23 mpg for a few thousand miles, or tell everyone to drive downhill and not to ever accelerate...for that matter, every car does better with those suggestions... Again, for $50,000, this car is underperforming for the majority of us...justify it any way you want...it's not doing what it is supposed to do...at least not yet...and if it does achieve 31/27 mpg, I'll be the first to rave about it and tell everyone else to be extra patient...as an owner, you'd better believe I want better mileage...I love the car in every other way...it's a great ride! For now, however, it's hard not to be skeptical! Headless

MDX at 14 mpg??? That's horrible...and that's also with premium gas! A friend of mine (actually his wife) has the MDX and they love it...they're getting about 18 mpg combined... I guess, compared to that, I should be happy...even at let's say 23 mpg, with cheap gas, I'm doing a lot better....plus, the performance on the Lexus is vastly superior... I will say that the Acura has a great navi system...they have a 2004 so the navi works while you're driving...too bad ours doesn't! She doesn't have bluetooth though...and I love the bluetooth...nothing beats making calls directly from the car! My drive to work is about 7 miles on 40 mph roads, with lights...it's a little hilly too...perhaps this isn't an ideal drive for a hybrid? By the time it warms up, it's time to shut-down? Headless

The breakin period, I guess, will take some time...why doesn't Lexus inform us of that? The only thing I was told was not to use cruise in the first 100 miles and to change speed a lot... I admit I have accelerated at times quickly (like when merging onto highway)....the car does have a excellent pick-up...but the mileage cost is great! Also, why didn't Automobile and other magazines that really praised the RX tell us exactly HOW they drove it? Did they get new vehicles or vehicles that were already used for some time...so, past breakin period? They got great numbers without making a big deal about how they drove the darn thing...how'd they pull that off? Perhaps I should just take a nice 500 mile road trip...stick the thing in cruise at like 65 mpg and let the gas motor breakin nicely...will probably get over 25 mpg with this approach, eh? Headless

I have had my RX for over a week now...driven it about 350 miles. I have found that if you drive the car no more than 65 mph on the highway (and with cruise) or on flat ground with no need to accelerate, you can get good mileage...otherwise, the car, so far, is a bust. The reason I say this? I have not seen any numbers above 24 mpg on my car. No matter how gingerly or hard I drive it, I can't get the mpg up...whether I accelerate like a grandma or hit the gas 'briskly', the car's gas motor seems to suck down gas...and it seems to run virtually all the time. Lexus stated 31/27...that's fine and dandy...but under what conditions? I don't think drivers should have to change their driving style to get this mileage...as is the case with ANY car, if you drive it a little harder, you lose some efficiency...what's apparent with a hybrid is if you accelerate a little too much, you get lousy mileage...period! I don't know how Lexus got away with advertising good mileage with this vehicle. I'm seeing better performance at a tremendously greater price, and with very little efficiency gain. If I were to receive the 31/27 with 'normal' driving conditions, I'd be very happy. Problem is that I'm driving around at about 22-23 mpg easing the car around as carefully as I can so as to not 'over-engage' the gas motor. I feel very misled and as of this point in time, very, very unhappy with this vehicle. I appreciate the navi system, bluetooth, and other toys, but they pale in comparison to the importance I stressed on the improved mileage for the vehicle. I gloated to everyone that I was getting a luxury hybrid SUV that would be getting me near 30mpg...now I'm embarassed to tell anyone I even bought the car...there is nothing special about the hybrid system other than a lot of technology... A breakin period is, of course, in order...however, the likelihood of going from 23 mpg to near 30 is probably very slim...I guess to get there I'll always have to be driving down hill....this is pathetic. I think Lexus has done itself a HUGE dis-service with this vehicle. I can't imagine most people will be happy with its lower than advertised mpg...all for thousands more. As of this date, this car is a bust...too much money for too little of what Lexus said it would do. Once J.D. Power gets a hold of people like me, I don't see Lexus sitting number one much longer! I am so very disappointed...I guess I should have waited a few years to see how the hybrids would turn out...had I known they'd be so disappointing, I would have put my $50,000+ somewhere else...should've waited for next MDX generation with cylinder cut-off...likely to get true 28 mpg like the Honda Odyssey...and it'll be about $10,000 less, with more room.... Lexus should be ashamed of this vehicle! Headless