krg04

Thank you... Knowing my parents, it may be a while before they decide on either...but I'll let you all know when they do. FYI: I now like the ES330 better than the TL

Yup...thanks for the info. I stopped by the local Lexus dealer tonight to pick up a brochure for my mom but they were out <_< Guess these ES's are popular. Also, I checked out that Alabaster color that was mentioned earlier, I actually kinda liked it...maybe I just have bad taste.

That's true, I didn't even think of that. I just mentioned the RX because of it's Camry roots.

Oh yeah, now I see the difference. The new trim is much brighter. I'm not sure which I like better, I think I like the current charcoal better, but I'll have to reserve judgement until I see the new one in person.

Not a current ES owner, but here's my opinion, Overall, the old front end was better. I really like the new headlights, and the round fogs, but that horrible looking grille ruins the whole design. The new tailights are a dissapointment too. I think the current ones look more jewel-like and expensive. The new ones scream Corolla or something, not sure what. As for the interior, i'm not sure what you mean by new trim? I'm also still surprised they haven't done something with the navigation system. While most high end cars have a navigation screen that looks integrated into the center console, the ES's almost looks like an aftermarket system stuck into the dash. I understand this is partly because the screen flips down to reveal the CD player, but it just looks unfinished...am I the only one that thinks this? I do like the new steering wheel with audio controls. I've driven a few cars with it, and it's awesome. Overall, I think I like the current ES better. They seemed to dumb down the styling with the '05. The grille, the taillights...they all look more basic than the current ones. It's not too drastic of a change though, and I still think both versions make for a great looking car.

You are absolutely right about that. This is probably one of, if not the classiest forum i've seen. The Honda/Acura forums are the worst. I posted something a while back saying we test drove the TL. When my parents decided to wait, certain people were all over me saying I was all talk, and my parents probably never looked at the TL in the first place, and that I was goning to fail at life if I couldn't do something simple like brainwash my parents into buying a car they weren't sure about, I was also told I was just hanging around the forum because I was jealous of the people who "actually" owned TLs...Give me a break. That REALLY turned me off. I'm 17, I wanted a cheap first car to learn on when I turned 16, so I bought a Saturn Ion. It's nice, but nothing great. On the Saturn forum, they constantly bash Japanese products, claiming they are overhyped, pay the auto magazines to make them look good, etc. I said once that I liked my car, but I thought Toyota had much nicer interiors in their cars then Saturn did. I got chewed out and called a Japanese lover or something. This place is not like that. I don't know if that is because the average age of the members here is much higher, or because Lexus attracts a different crowd than the others, or both. One question, if someone claims the ES is not a "real" Lexus, wouldn't that mean the RX300-330 is not a "real" lexus either? Some people...

Not to cause problems, this is just for your amusement... A couple comments from TL owners "My prejudice against the ES330 is knowing that it's a Camry with some extra insulation and end caps. If the ES330 suits you- i.e. you like the cushy ride an understated plasti-elegance, save yourself about $4k and go for the Camry. The reliability is even better. Just don't kid yourself that it will perform and handle in the same league as the TL." Does this guy not realize that the TL happens to be an ACCORD with some extra insulation and end caps? "I liked the styling on previous ES models, but they have transformed it into a car only a true Lex-loyalist could love. Pair that with Anemic styling and performance and it leaves me asking why anyone would buy this car??" OK, don't ask...some people shouldn't be allowed to have opinions. "I too drove the usual suspects when I decided to replace my 97 ES last fall. I was so disappointed in the performance of the ES330, when I tried to accelerate briskly the lag was like I was dialling up "all ahead full" from the bridge, it'm not sure how they've managed to disguise the 237 hp so well." "Who buys ES? Mostly older women. That should tell you something about the car." "IMO, the ES330 screams CAMRY, while the TL only whispers accord." "Both my dad and my uncle have ES's, which should give you some idea of the age of ES buyers." Ok...that's enough. I do not agree with these people at all. These comments were not directed at me, I just found them on a car forum on which someone had asked which car people thought was a better choice.

I see quite a few 2002+ ES's around here without HID headlights. Maybe they just don't ship many to your area? I don't know. My mom likes neutral colors (the white, tan, or the light greenish color...and she wants the beige interior. Not sure if that would be considered undesireable or not? My parents will most likely finance the car, so the fact that Lexus has 2.9% apr helps too. Acura had nothing. Btw, thanks for all the info you've given me...hopefully I'll get her to take the Lexus for a spin this week. My mom is not in a hurry. In fact we test drove the TL over a month ago, and still haven't bought a car. She's says she'll "get it when she's ready." I am really starting to like the ES, at least in the styling department...I think it makes more of a statement than the TL.

Thank you, Here's my question. Do you find the ES to be somewhat fun to drive? I think my mom is scared that she'll end up with and old person's car (cushy ride) and doesn't want to date herself. She wants something that's still somewhat fun to drive around town in. She's not a driving enthusiast, to her, cars are to get you from point A to point B, but she does enjoy an occasional joyride to the coast or something like that.

One of my teachers bought an '04 ES330 just before school got out. She said she got it for under $30,000, she also commented that it was cheaper than she could get the base TL for. She did not get it at the no haggle dealer, but said the dealership she got it at was willing to take a LOT off. The base TL stickers at OVER $33,000...so i'm not sure where you're getting $32k and change...I think you're forgeting the destination charge. The Acura dealership my parents went to quoted them $31,600 for a car that stickered at $33something. I'm not sure how you can say the TL is substantially cheaper? As far as the college rebate, it is not a regional thing. go to www.lexus.com ...there is a link to it right on the home page. It's a new program they started beginning in June. As for the no haggle pricing...yeah, it is kind of odd...i'll agree with that. It's very common around here though. The local Saturn, Honda, Hyundai, Ford, Scion, Toyota, and Lexus dealerships all have no haggle pricing. Scion and Saturn have that policy at all their dealerships...and the rest of the dealerships (Honda, Hyundai, Ford, Toyota, Lexus) are all owned by the same company, which uses no haggle pricing. Also, if my mom wanted to get a base model ES330, why couldn't she order it?...this is Lexus after all, I would think they would make it a little easier to get a customer into a car they want.

I've seen ES's on the lot for MUCH less than $35k...trust me. Also, how much did you get off the $37k sticker price of your car? I bet it was a decent amount. The Lexus dealer closest to me has a "no-haggle" policy. They have all the final prices marked on the car, and that's what you pay. They have decently equipped ES330s that sticker close to $36k priced at $32,xxx. Not bad at all. On the other hand, Acura dealers are much tighter with negotiation, and it's hard to get much off. Two family members bought MDXs and they didn't get one cent off. (this was when they were new and hard to get, but still) Also, my dad went back to further his degree recently, so he qualifies for the Lexus $750 college graduate discount. That also gives the ES more of an edge as far as pricing. Either way, it doesn't matter, both cars are too close in price to influence the decision, so it will basically come down to preference. My mom has driven the TL, and loved it. That leads me to believe that she may not care for the ES. She told me she likes the ride to be at least a little sporty, and doesn't want to feel like she's driving on a cloud. I have a feeling that when she drives the ES, her mind will change. I actually am starting to really like the Lexus, so I hope she likes it also. btw...I walked into the computer room earlier today and my dad was looking at the ES online...so maybe that's what we'll end up with. Either way, I wouldn't be dissapointed.

Well, that's not the case any more. The 2004 TL starts at just over $33,000...the 2004 ES330 starts at just over $31,000...both are similarly equipped. So the TL is actually $2,000 more. And I have to disagree about the interior comment....I personally think the TL is just as plush. Keep in mind, this is the BRAND NEW '04 TL that just came out this year, It is nothing like the previous generation, and it has consistantly rated higher than the ES since it was released. Now, on another note, I still do really like the ES330, it's a bit classier than the TL.

For the record, I'm 17 and I drive a 2003 white Saturn Ion

Nope, she's in her 40s, but still likes a somewhat sporty ride. Both of my parents drove the new TL. My mom loved it, my dad (who is in his early 40s) said it wasn't a comfortable ride, and he wasn't crazy about it. Basically, this is what I think: The TL is edgier inside and out, is sportier, faster, and comes with more features but costs a little more. The ES330 is somewhat bland to look at and to drive, but it drives like a luxury car, is very comfortable, classy, and reasonably priced for what you get. ...and yeah, she will drive both eventually. Right now she's just casually looking. She said that she probably get one by the end of the summer. Believe it or not, she had her mind set on an suv about 3 months ago. She went and looked at the VW Touareg, BMW X3, and Volvo XC90. Then she just changed her mind entirely. We looked at the Nissan Maxima (my dad liked it, mom didn't), then the TL...we almost bought the TL, my parents were ready to sign, but then they decided they wanted to look around a bit more. We have looked, and my dad's been trying to talk my mom into different cars, but she's been set on the TL the whole time. Within the last week or so, my mom has pointed out the ES and said she loved the look of it. Just the other day, a white one drove by us, and my mom started asking me about it, "how is it in comparison to the TL" etc, etc... I did some research, and that's what brought me here.

Hey, I'm new here. We're contemplating the purchase of a new car. We test drove the Acura TL and loved it. The car is actually going to be my mom's, but i'm the car buff of the family. Recently, the ES330 has been catching her eye, she's pointed them out to me a few times and asked me about them. Did anyone here look into the TL before buying their ES, and if so, why did you decide to go with the ES? For the record...my mom is in her 40s, and is a fairly conservative driver. I personally like the TL better (I think)...but i'm not sure. Feel free to comment.