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lemon

Rx400H Recall (Inverter Related)

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Just found this at clublexus.com Thanks to caveman at that site for posting...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43574776/ns/business-autos/

Safety Recall BLD (B2D - Interim) - Certain 2006 through 2007 Model Year RX 400h Vehicles Intelligent Power Module (IPM) Replacement

What is the Condition? The Intelligent Power Module (IPM) is located inside of the Hybrid System Inverter and contains a control board with transistors. Certain transistors on the control boards of some of the subject vehicles were inadequately soldered and could be damaged from heat caused by a large current during high-load driving. If this occurs, various warning lamps will be illuminated on the instrument panel. In most cases the vehicle will enter a fail-safe driving mode, resulting in reduced motive power in which the vehicle can still be driven for short distances. In limited instances, the fuse of the power supply circuit could burn out when the transistor is damaged. If this occurs, the hybrid engine system will stop while the vehicle is being driven and the vehicle will coast to a stop increasing the risk of a rear collision.

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I knew there was something not right with the inverters on these vehicles, so much so that I recently used the nhtsa website (and Transport Canada website) to voice my concerns over inverter failures (mine was leaking coolant - a colleague at work had his 2006 RX lose all power on the highway at 100km/h - diagnosis was failed inverter). I doubt my emails caused any widespread investigation, but it's nice to see action being taken.

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I hope it covers all years of 400h, not just the 2006 and 2007 because of complaints with those years...Toyota did this with the sludge problem, because of a lawsuit, but didnt cover the 2003 year and many have had sludge in those engines as well, but guess what, not covered....

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Maybe by the time the 2008 models arrived (or by a certain VIN number) they had rectified the bad soldering on this unit in the inverter.

Still, woudn't that indicate that they KNEW there was a problem with the bad soldering on previous inverters and this means they would have been aware of the problem as far back as 2007 (when the 2008 models appeared). Why then, was there not a recall IMMEDIATELY upon the discovery of the bad soldering.

Or maybe, on the other hand, after reports of inverter failures (or after the NHTSA made some pointed inquiries), they investigated and discovered this problem and THEN traced it back to some point in the past when the soldering method was changed?

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C'mon, Lemon, bad soldering cannot cause gaskets to leak!

Seriously, at least Toyota is doing something about it. My Corvette's HVAC PCAs bad soldering would cause the outside temperature display to gradually fade away to nothing. I had to resolder a bunch of resistors, myself because most likely, it wasn't considered a safety issue.

I also had to install a column lock bypass because the steering wheel locking pin would become stuck in the locking position, rendering the car immovable. was there ever a recall? ....only for auto tranny Corvettes!

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I have no idea how you extrapolated bad soldering to leaking gaskets. In fact, I never mentioned gaskets at all. My inverter was leaking - I was never told why, who knows if it was a gasket?? No where did I link bad soldering to leaking inverters.

All I said was that I contacted the NHTSA and Transport Canada about failed inverters - mine was leaking, another had failed completely.

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In the world of automotive mechanics (with the exception of radiators), if it leaks, it's a failed gasket.

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And in the world of auto mechanics, how long have inverters been around, and how well are they understood internally by someone outside of Toyota's specially trained 'hybrid' technicians?

Have you ever heard of, or seen a transmission fluid leak because the metal of the transmission housing was too porous? No gasket involved there. Or a leak from a crack in an oil pan? Again, no gasket. For all I know, my leaking inverter may have been a cracked housing.

Regardless, cracked housing, porous metal, or bad gasket, I never said the bad soldering was causing my leak, which is what you somehow read my post to be.

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dont forget that some mercedes components use no gasket material...

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The Intelligent Power Module (IPM) is located inside of the Hybrid System Inverter and contains a control board with transistors. Certain transistors on the control boards of some of the subject vehicles were inadequately soldered and could be damaged from heat caused by a large current during high-load driving. If this occurs, various warning lamps will be illuminated on the instrument panel. In most cases the vehicle will enter a fail-safe driving mode, resulting in reduced motive power in which the vehicle can still be driven for short distances. In limited instances, the fuse of the power supply circuit could burn out when the transistor is damaged. If this occurs, the hybrid engine system will stop while the vehicle is being driven and the vehicle will coast to a stop increasing the risk of a rear collision.
I knew there was something not right with the inverters on these vehicles, so much so that I recently used the nhtsa website (and Transport Canada website) to voice my concerns over inverter failures (mine was leaking coolant - a colleague at work had his 2006 RX lose all power on the highway at 100km/h - diagnosis was failed inverter). I doubt my emails caused any widespread investigation, but it's nice to see action being taken.

Mmmm, I think most folks would say your "something not right" comment in reference to the first quote somehow implied that the recall is related to your leaking inverter. I think not!

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Really now. Give your head a shake. The recall specifically states it's bad soldering. You'd have to be really obtuse to somehow connect bad soldering and leaking coolant (and you're the one that linked them, not me). It was also convienient of you not to notice that in the same line I made note of a friend whose inverter failed competely, no leaking involved. Now that is one incident that you could put two and two together and come up with the likely cause being the bad soldering.

I guess to paint a better picture for you, I could also mention the rash of Toyota Highlander Hybrids that suffered inverter failures (do a search on here, I'm sure I posted it). Those incidents, along with the less common (maybe there are more Highlanders on the road?) RX400h inverter failures plus my leaking inverter are what caused me to believe that there were problems with the inverters.

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The Intelligent Power Module (IPM) is located inside of the Hybrid System Inverter and contains a control board with transistors. Certain transistors on the control boards of some of the subject vehicles were inadequately soldered and could be damaged from heat caused by a large current during high-load driving. If this occurs, various warning lamps will be illuminated on the instrument panel. In most cases the vehicle will enter a fail-safe driving mode, resulting in reduced motive power in which the vehicle can still be driven for short distances. In limited instances, the fuse of the power supply circuit could burn out when the transistor is damaged. If this occurs, the hybrid engine system will stop while the vehicle is being driven and the vehicle will coast to a stop increasing the risk of a rear collision.
I knew there was something not right with the inverters on these vehicles, so much so that I recently used the nhtsa website (and Transport Canada website) to voice my concerns over inverter failures (mine was leaking coolant - a colleague at work had his 2006 RX lose all power on the highway at 100km/h - diagnosis was failed inverter). I doubt my emails caused any widespread investigation, but it's nice to see action being taken.

Mmmm, I think most folks would say your "something not right" comment in reference to the first quote somehow implied that the recall is related to your leaking inverter. I think not!

I'd like it if 'most folks' would chime in then. I think most people would read that as I had concerns over the inverters failing and contacted Transport Canada and the NHTSA. My concerns were leaking (mine) and complete failing (not mine). End of story - they were contacted. Now, months later, there is a recall for the bad soldering in the module. You must have some weird way of linking events if you equated that to my leak was caused by bad soldering.

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OH mY goodness, symantics, I read that he had a leaking converter, and some friend had a inverter failure internally, (not leaking) Lets build a bridge and get over it. :chairshot:

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OH mY goodness, symantics, I read that he had a leaking converter, and some friend had a inverter failure internally, (not leaking) Lets build a bridge and get over it. :chairshot:

Good point. I'm over it - rickety wooden bridge with fraying ropes. There's a recall - you will be notified if it affects you, and you will end up with a shiny new part (maybe an inverter, but more likely some piece inside the inverter). If your inverter is simply leaking, this recall will not affect you.

Here's a response from Lexus Canada to my inquiry regarding this (Transport Canada also PHONED me today to advise that it would also be posting and enforcing a Canadian recall)

"Thank you for your recent correspondence.

Please be advised Lexus Canada will be releasing a similar campaign as approximately 1,500 Lexus vehicles in Canada are affected.

We would like to take this opportunity to explain inside the inverter assembly is an Intelligent Power Module (IPM) which contains a control board equipped with transistors. In some of the affected vehicles, the transistors on the control boards may have been inadequately soldered and as a result, they could be damaged from heat caused by a large current during high-load driving. If this occurs, a number of warning lamps, including the malfunction indicator lamp, slip indicator light, brake system warning light, and master warning light will illuminate on the instrument panel in your vehicle.

If this condition occurs, in most cases, the vehicle will enter a fail-safe driving mode, resulting in reduced engine power so the vehicle can still be driven for short distances to a safe location. In rare instances, the fuse of the power supply circuit could blow when the transistor is damaged. If this occurs, the hybrid system will stop while the vehicle is being driven, and the vehicle will coast to a stop.

Please be advised Lexus Canada is currently preparing the campaign remedy parts. In the interim and in the near future, owners of affected vehicles will be notified by first class mail. An interim owner notification will advise owners of the following information:

1) This recall affects their vehicle;

2) When the campaign remedy parts are available, Guests should make an appointment at any Lexus dealership to have the IPM in the Inverter Assembly inspected and if necessary, replaced.

3) Steps Guests may take before the campaign remedy is performed on their vehicle to help determine if this condition might exist on their vehicle or if they have experienced this condition and steps they may otherwise take at this time.

Once the campaign remedy becomes available, Guests will be notified again and asked to make an appointment with any Lexus dealership to have the campaign remedy performed on their vehicle. This repair will be performed at no charge to Guests.

If you experience this condition before the remedy is available, please contact an authorized Lexus dealership for diagnosis and an appropriate repair as soon as possible.

If you have previously paid for to have the IPM in the inverter assembly replaced to address this specific condition, please contact your Lexus dealership for reimbursement consideration.

We hope this information is helpful."

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Should we seriously believe this was somehow fixed for the 2008 models? :huh:

Either Lexus realized they screwed up on the 06-07 models and quickly fixed it for the 2008's, all the while letting every 06-07 owner drive around for 3 years knowing that something could go wrong... or they're telling us a lie that the 08's are fine.

In either case it doesn't sound very good. :blink:

And i love how they write that the boards will either be "inspected" or replaced. If they're "inside" of the inverter, does that mean the inverter will need to be taken apart and possibly "put back together" if some mechanic at Lexus "thinks" it's OK? Do you think they'll have to tamper with any gaskets or what not?

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Should we seriously believe this was somehow fixed for the 2008 models? :huh:

Either Lexus realized they screwed up on the 06-07 models and quickly fixed it for the 2008's, all the while letting every 06-07 owner drive around for 3 years knowing that something could go wrong... or they're telling us a lie that the 08's are fine.

In either case it doesn't sound very good. :blink:

And i love how they write that the boards will either be "inspected" or replaced. If they're "inside" of the inverter, does that mean the inverter will need to be taken apart and possibly "put back together" if some mechanic at Lexus "thinks" it's OK? Do you think they'll have to tamper with any gaskets or what not?

That is precisely what worries me...my next door neigbor has a 2003 highlander that experienced the sludge, and because the lawsuit was filed in 2002 his vehicle was not covered, exactly the same engine, and no fixes...I hope we arent left out to hang in the wind...Sometimes their propriortory information is just plain customer unfriendly....

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Should we seriously believe this was somehow fixed for the 2008 models? :huh:

Either Lexus realized they screwed up on the 06-07 models and quickly fixed it for the 2008's, all the while letting every 06-07 owner drive around for 3 years knowing that something could go wrong... or they're telling us a lie that the 08's are fine.

In either case it doesn't sound very good. :blink:

And i love how they write that the boards will either be "inspected" or replaced. If they're "inside" of the inverter, does that mean the inverter will need to be taken apart and possibly "put back together" if some mechanic at Lexus "thinks" it's OK? Do you think they'll have to tamper with any gaskets or what not?

That is precisely what worries me...my next door neigbor has a 2003 highlander that experienced the sludge, and because the lawsuit was filed in 2002 his vehicle was not covered, exactly the same engine, and no fixes...I hope we arent left out to hang in the wind...Sometimes their propriortory information is just plain customer unfriendly....

I agree, it doesn't make much sense to me. I don't understand why they wouldn't include the '08 models, because we all know nothing was changed for the 08's. All of the parts used in the 08's were taken out of the same parts bin as all the ones installed on the 06 and 07's out there, including the Highlander. :angry:

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I can't even get my service tech to return my calls about this recall. Are the parts available yet?

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When i was in for service last week i asked about the january recall, the service manager said no parts yet and he expected to see them after january, he was not entirely sure lexus had decided how much to include in the recall as far as replacement, or to be more clear he had not yet been advised by Lexus the exact specifics of what they wanted to replace. He also said they would be taking a close look at each inverter even if they just to replace circuit boards. I know our vehicles are all toyotas, however it is my sense there is more protection of the brand Lexus and that they will to what it takes to solve the problem.

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Should we seriously believe this was somehow fixed for the 2008 models? :huh:

Either Lexus realized they screwed up on the 06-07 models and quickly fixed it for the 2008's, all the while letting every 06-07 owner drive around for 3 years knowing that something could go wrong... or they're telling us a lie that the 08's are fine.

In either case it doesn't sound very good. :blink:

And i love how they write that the boards will either be "inspected" or replaced. If they're "inside" of the inverter, does that mean the inverter will need to be taken apart and possibly "put back together" if some mechanic at Lexus "thinks" it's OK? Do you think they'll have to tamper with any gaskets or what not?

That is precisely what worries me...my next door neigbor has a 2003 highlander that experienced the sludge, and because the lawsuit was filed in 2002 his vehicle was not covered, exactly the same engine, and no fixes...I hope we arent left out to hang in the wind...Sometimes their propriortory information is just plain customer unfriendly....

Well Cduluk, my 2008 may have just failed...no warning, just got Check hybrid system, check VSC, and Bad braking system lamps, then the Check engine light came on...Car started loosing power, and the hybrid battery went to two bars, but eventually jumped back up to two thirds....next it died on a left turn from a stoplight, had it towed to Toyota, (lexus dealership in my town gave me a very bad taste with their poor mechanical fix on my RX300 tranny.)...Man I could not get the codes before I towed it to dealership...Friday is earliest they can look at it. Wish me luck, just turned 103k miles....Oh it sucks to be me tonight...

I agree, it doesn't make much sense to me. I don't understand why they wouldn't include the '08 models, because we all know nothing was changed for the 08's. All of the parts used in the 08's were taken out of the same parts bin as all the ones installed on the 06 and 07's out there, including the Highlander. :angry:

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Lexus' trearment about this tsb really gets me P.O.'d. Our 400h was built in '05 and if the power plant suffers colateral damage due to so-so inverter cooling over a half decade (and who'd know), it seems like Lexus couldn't give a rip. We got notice from Lexus MONTHS ago, but thery're really slow to take care of it. They've known about this since the days of the stink about possible 'unintended acceleration' issues ... & so modernly, Lexus is suposedly no longer sluffing off owner conserns. Yea, right.

.

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Lexus' trearment about this tsb really gets me P.O.'d. Our 400h was built in '05 and if the power plant suffers colateral damage due to so-so inverter cooling over a half decade (and who'd know), it seems like Lexus couldn't give a rip. We got notice from Lexus MONTHS ago, but thery're really slow to take care of it. They've known about this since the days of the stink about possible 'unintended acceleration' issues ... & so modernly, Lexus is suposedly no longer sluffing off owner conserns. Yea, right.

.

There is no problem with "so-so inverter cooling". All this recall concerns is a bad solder job on some circuit board inside the inverter. If the solder connection breaks, the inverter shuts down. It won't affect the engine whatsoever.

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My Lexus rx400h was overheated and my engine gasket got burn after i drove my suv to my houae and parked,then i call the mechanic to replace the gasket after that the car didn't start again when diagnosed it show check hybrid,check vsc and without any warning light on my dashboard the automobile electrician said my inverter was bad. please how is that possible

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