'03 Rx300 Transmission Fluid Flush

[merlin2375]

Hi all,

I have an '03 Lexus Rx300 with 65K on the odo. I don't know if the transmission fluid has been changed. The car is running fine and shifting fine but as part of maintenance I would like to get the fluid flushed.

I have a trusted mechanic who will do the flush but I am really anal about fluid selection

1) Should I only use dealer T4 (Toyota T4)

2) Not having known if the fluid was changed at 30K, am I asking for trouble

3) Is it ok to switch to synthetic T4 now?

Any other thoughts or things I should worry about?

Thanks thanks thanks!

[KBRX330]

Best to stick with the T-IV. Buy it from a Toyota dealer as it is usually cheaper. You will need about 12 qts.

[lenore]

The tranny hold 9.8 qts, but for a flush you will need a couple extra. If the fluid is burnt smelling or real dark I would not do a flush. I would do a drop the pan and clean the filter, then top off, Then the next normal oil change I would drain the fluid and top off, and then do one final fluid change the next oil change.

Read this post from another site on how to do it:

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=220061

by the way the only fluid you can use is the Toyota Type IV or Amsoil or the Mobil 3309 series of fluids. all other fluids are not compatitable with the RX300 transmission.

[KBRX330]

I just do 4 drain-fills to achieve about 80% new fluid which is fine if you don't want to flush. The RX330 has no serviceable filter so doing a flush is not necessary. Like stated above if the fluid is burnt don't flush it but do drain fills. If you have a fliter then a pan drop-refill is a must do. But a flush is $168 and I can do 4 drain refills for $60. If I do 5 drain re-fills for $80 I end up with about 88% new fluid. I make it a point to do a drain-refill about every 15,000 miles so my fluid has really never turned dark since new and the transmission still shifts llike new at almost 140k. Well worth the trouble IMO as I plan to keep this car in the family to about 300k.

[Grumpa72]

There are transmissions shops that should be able to do a flush if you choose to, with you supplying the Toyota spec ATF. By doing a flush, you are ensuring that 100% of the old ATF is out and the new is in. That said, I do the "drain the pan, refill with four quarts and then drive" method three times and I am confident in my transmission fluid.

[wwest]

Dropping the sump/pan allows you to remove the 1/8 inch of debris accumulated there in only about 40,000 miles. You can also check the magnets placed in the bottom to see if they are "holding" an inordinate amount of metalic "fines".

[phillyfan]

What are people's oppinions on changing 'old-old' transmision fluid as I know from past threads that there may be concerns of transmission failure when changing to new fluid as the 'particulate' nature of the burnt fluid increases friction for the transmission to grab.

Any concerns changing fluid that may be 60,000+ miles old if there are no problems.

Not really a question for myself but I know concerns have been raised in the past.

Thanks

[lenore]

the fluid should be changed. If it is discolored or smells burnt, the fluid has broken down. I would not flush, but to a drain and fill. The other possibility is a fluid exchange. It uses the cars pump to change the fluid. Most flushing machines have this capability. YOU would probably need about 10 or 11 qts to do this. The AWD has a capacity of 9.8 qrts total. A drain and fill will take 4.3 qts.

[mikey00]

Here is my 2 cents on a flush: I have always been a fan of a drain and fill every 15K. I figure a D&F every 15K produces about the same end result as a flush every 30K without the risk of moving some debris around in the trans and without the high cost of a flush. Well it turned out that I missed my D&F schedule by about 3K and was going to be at the Toyota dealer anyway, so I decided to go for a flush. After the flush the trans performed fine just as it always has. Then 2 weeks (700 miles) after the flush, the trans did not engage in reverse and finally did engage with a thud. This happen 2 more times over the next 2 weeks. My guess is the flush moved some dirt somewhere where it shouldn't be and was causing the problem. My next move was going to be to pull both sensors on the top of the trans and clean and swap them to see if the problem changed. But it's been almost a month now and the problem has not returned. Of course there is no proof that any of this was caused by the flush but in hindsight I wished I skipped the flush and did a D&F.

[Messerchmidt]

USE AMSOIL!

[wwest]

USE AMSOIL!

Yes, by all means, and give Lexus a certain/sure reason for voiding your warranty.

[mikey00]

USE AMSOIL!

No thanks on the Amsoil reccomendation.

[wwest]

What are people's oppinions on changing 'old-old' transmision fluid as I know from past threads that there may be concerns of transmission failure when changing to new fluid as the 'particulate' nature of the burnt fluid increases friction for the transmission to grab.

Huh...?? What say...??

Particulate nature "helps"....?

NOT...!!

Any concerns changing fluid that may be 60,000+ miles old if there are no problems.

Not really a question for myself but I know concerns have been raised in the past.

Thanks

First, while engine lubricating oils are specially formulated so as to hold particulate matter in suspension, so it will drain away when you change the oil, ATF is formulated to NOT hold particulate matter in suspension and therefore have it not interfere with the analog "computer" (valve body, tiny orifices) operation.

[phillyfan]

Searching the Lexus forums there have been comments about the risk of changing ATF in high mileage vehicles with poorly serviced transmissions. I honestly don't know how real this is but it is certainly not something I made up.

Over at clublexus.com there is a mention of a link to TrannySlip

The most 'risk' (if it exists) seems to be with flushes and not the drain and fills per people's opinions. Does anyone here have an experience to share regarding fluid changes in a high mile RX.

I'm not a mechanic and can't offer personal experience on this matter, I just remember reading about the subject in the past on forums.

[tmastres]

Searching the Lexus forums there have been comments about the risk of changing ATF in high mileage vehicles with poorly serviced transmissions. I honestly don't know how real this is but it is certainly not something I made up.

Over at clublexus.com there is a mention of a link to TrannySlip

The most 'risk' (if it exists) seems to be with flushes and not the drain and fills per people's opinions. Does anyone here have an experience to share regarding fluid changes in a high mile RX.

I'm not a mechanic and can't offer personal experience on this matter, I just remember reading about the subject in the past on forums.

I've got about 110,000k miles on my 00 RX and I've had 3 flushes done on it. I really do respect those that do the drain and fill method, and if it works for them then thats great. What I've been able to glean from the thousands of posts on the trans issue is that the 01-03's are harder on the fluid, yet the 99, 00's are the most likely to fail. Having an 00 I really don't notice very much degradation of the fluid, but I have it flushed around every 30k anyhow. I suspect that those that do the D and F do so because 1) they can do it themselves and 2) its cheaper. For me its really because 1) its been working for me and 2) I already do all the OC's and other routine maint. on 4 vehicles so I'm not at all interested in adding yet another routine service to my long list of weekend chores. I'll pay the money for a flush. Call me lazy but I'd rather spend that tie at the ballpark.

[lenore]

I would recommend a Fluid exhange, not a flush, You use the vehicles tranny pump to change the fluid versus the machine and not kick up debris, I just had this done on my Ford F150 and seems much safer than the forced flush with additives and cleaners. I suspect that some of the cleaners can be a real disaster on a old tranny. The way it works is the line is disconnected from the tranny to the cooler and the machine is put in series, than the car is ran in park which allows the Transmission pump to push the fluid through the cooler and transmission. No additives, no cleaners, no forced pressures.

[KBRX330]

Here is my 2 cents on a flush: I have always been a fan of a drain and fill every 15K. I figure a D&F every 15K produces about the same end result as a flush every 30K without the risk of moving some debris around in the trans and without the high cost of a flush. Well it turned out that I missed my D&F schedule by about 3K and was going to be at the Toyota dealer anyway, so I decided to go for a flush. After the flush the trans performed fine just as it always has. Then 2 weeks (700 miles) after the flush, the trans did not engage in reverse and finally did engage with a thud. This happen 2 more times over the next 2 weeks. My guess is the flush moved some dirt somewhere where it shouldn't be and was causing the problem. My next move was going to be to pull both sensors on the top of the trans and clean and swap them to see if the problem changed. But it's been almost a month now and the problem has not returned. Of course there is no proof that any of this was caused by the flush but in hindsight I wished I skipped the flush and did a D&F.

I have had this happen in flushing a neglected trans. What I have learned is to never let the fluid get burnt in the first place and that is why I start my drain fill regimen at 30,000 miles in any vehicle I buy new. One older vehicles that have not been maintained I will never flush. I have had better results by slowly introducing new fluid into the trans by drainfills with 2-3,000 miles in between until I have run 10-15 quarts through the system. Never an issue this way. If there is a replaceable filter I will do a drain/filter and then another in 10,000 miles. You would be surprised at the second one as I have had the second filter come out almost cmpletely clogged in only 10k. I do think flushing a dirty trans stirs up all the contaminants.

[mburnickas]

USE AMSOIL!

Yes, by all means, and give Lexus a certain/sure reason for voiding your warranty.

oh please! Lexus is way behind the times on fluids...Then again if someone thinks color of ATF means something you are better then superman...

Amsoil ATF is WAY over Lexus fluid( lexus does not make fluids)

[lenore]

I agree, Amsoil would be the way to go, Just wish I could become a dealer and distribute amongst my family....I have not switched, but its coming...

[wwest]

USE AMSOIL!

Yes, by all means, and give Lexus a certain/sure reason for voiding your warranty.

oh please! Lexus is way behind the times on fluids...Then again if someone thinks color of ATF means something you are better then superman...

Amsoil ATF is WAY over Lexus fluid( lexus does not make fluids)

It should be obvious to all that Toyota's transaxle design is currently, constantly changing, in a state of "flux", since the initial design flaw, mistake, was embedded late in the last century. But, additionally, the frictional material for the torque converter lock-up clutch has been changed throughout the industry just within the last few years. Beyond that time the lockup clutch was only used in top gear and under low engine torque conditions to facilitate an actual OD gear ratio. Nowadays it is being used to (marginally) improve FE in maybe all the top gears of a 6-speed transaxle, 4th, 5th, and 6th.

Who better to know the proper formulation for the ATF for a given car model other than the OEM designers of the transaxle....??

[mburnickas]

It should be obvious to all that Toyota's transaxle design is currently, constantly changing, in a state of "flux", since the initial design flaw, mistake, was embedded late in the last century. But, additionally, the frictional material for the torque converter lock-up clutch has been changed throughout the industry just within the last few years. Beyond that time the lockup clutch was only used in top gear and under low engine torque conditions to facilitate an actual OD gear ratio. Nowadays it is being used to (marginally) improve FE in maybe all the top gears of a 6-speed transaxle, 4th, 5th, and 6th.

Who better to know the proper formulation for the ATF for a given car model other than the OEM designers of the transaxle....??

Just becuase they design a AT does not mean they know anything on fluid. They still push oil drains that are 10+ years old..BONG...Toyota does not make fluids. They buy them and rebadge them.

I do not put much faith in mfg on fluids or anything. They write manuals that bean counters write, not engineers.

YMMV, but if you think Toyota fluid is great, that is wonderful. I would tell anyone to test it compared to Amsoil or any other "top tier" fluids. Look at what gives you more, it an't toyo.

Lastly, if toyo fluid was so good why did my car shifter smoother etc with a non-toyo fluid? PLus warranty is a non issue. Not going into it for like the 1,000,000,000 time.

If you like toyo sold fluid, keep using it. I will use other since Toyo quality it not what it once was.

[KBRX330]

USE AMSOIL!

Way too many posts about people having shift issues using non speced fluids in an Aisin Warner transmission. Mobil makes T-IV and badge it under Mobil 3309. Besides, I can buy T-IV from a dealer for less than I can buy Amsoil. SO why would I pay more for a non-specified fluid?? Makes no sense at all.

[mburnickas]

USE AMSOIL!

Way too many posts about people having shift issues using non speced fluids in an Aisin Warner transmission. Mobil makes T-IV and badge it under Mobil 3309. Besides, I can buy T-IV from a dealer for less than I can buy Amsoil. SO why would I pay more for a non-specified fluid?? Makes no sense at all.

because you are getting more.

[mburnickas]

USE AMSOIL!

Way too many posts about people having shift issues using non speced fluids in an Aisin Warner transmission. Mobil makes T-IV and badge it under Mobil 3309. Besides, I can buy T-IV from a dealer for less than I can buy Amsoil. SO why would I pay more for a non-specified fluid?? Makes no sense at all.

because you are getting more.

[Grumpa72]

because you are getting more.

Getting more WHAT? Other than your claims and the ads that Amsoil puts out, what tangible evidence is there that Amsoil gives "more", whatever more is. If Toyota has a specification out for a fluid, and you buy any ATF that meets that spec, then how is Amsoil giving "more"?

I go for frequent fluid changes and checking of levels and color. I buy my ATF from the local Toyota dealer and I suspect that he is cheaper than an Amsoil dealer.

Gary