Rough Riding Ls460l

[TSB]

I did drive another LS460 before ordering my LS460 but during that short ride I didn’t notice the harshness of the ride

You should drive another LS460 now for an extended period to compare the ride to yours. What we're trying to figure out is is yours typical or is there something wrong with it.

How do I get another LS640 to drive for an extended time? The dealer will never give me another 70K LS640 even for one day. I appreciate you comments.

[SW03ES]

Tell the dealer you want to drive another one to compare yours to. They must have a demo they let sales customers drive. Even if you only drive it for an hour.

They'll give you one. They let you drive the LS460L they were trying to sell you.

Go to another dealer and take one for a test drive.

Drive a test loop in yours. Drive the other one on the same loop, and then drive the loop again with yours. If you feel a difference make the service manager do the same thing with you in the passenger seat.

[IS400]

I'd call the detroit newspapers and tell them about your problem and that is happening to more than just your car. They will eat it up with a spoon. Any chance to bash foreign cars, especially a top tier lexus, will get lots of newspapers sold here in s.e. michigan. Just make sure to tell lexus you are going to do it before you contact the papers. Give them a chance to come out with a 4 axis accelerometer and compare your car's ride to their baseline cars.

Mythbusters style!

[TSB]

I'd call the detroit newspapers and tell them about your problem and that is happening to more than just your car. They will eat it up with a spoon. Any chance to bash foreign cars, especially a top tier lexus, will get lots of newspapers sold here in s.e. michigan. Just make sure to tell lexus you are going to do it before you contact the papers. Give them a chance to come out with a 4 axis accelerometer and compare your car's ride to their baseline cars.

Mythbusters style!

You play rough. You’re suggesting blackmail and that’s not a good idea. Basically, Lexus makes great cars and I loved my LS430’s. Maybe I should get new shocks to improve the ride but that may void my warranty.

[IS400]

Why is it blackmail? They advertise the relentless pursuit of perfection. If the LS460 line is showing cases of harsh ride characteristics and not equal to the ride of the previous model, it is false advertising.

False advertising is a crime and should be reported to the public. Lexus is not above the law.

When dealers lower tire pressure below recommended levels or put on non factory tires it would lead anyone to believe that the way the car rides is how lexus designed or assembled it to ride. The are grasping at straws to try and get the owner off their lot and accept the car as is. Trading gas mileage by lowering tire pressure, and getting a wallowy unresponsive but somewhat better ride? C'mon that is assinine. Low tire pressure causes accidents and dramatically increased tire wear and should never be part of a solution to this problem.

I expect to feel every bump in my old pick-up truck. I do not expect a jarring ride from a 60-80K luxury car.

So when consumer reports says something sucks it is blackmailing the company to perform? Nah. It is the TRUTH about what kind of product they are producing and how the dealers are not being helpful and deny responsibility for giving the owner a car that rides like the demo did and every example should.

It is a december to remember when you get a rough riding lexus for christmas and the dealer says, "so what?"

[SW03ES]

You play rough. You’re suggesting blackmail and that’s not a good idea. Basically, Lexus makes great cars and I loved my LS430’s. Maybe I should get new shocks to improve the ride but that may void my warranty.

Absolutely Lexus makes great cars. I am a huge Lexus fan. However, you have a right to be satisfied with your purchase. If you feel your car doesn't ride like it should they should repair it. Thats why I suggested you drive another LS460 to compare to yours.

A lot of people who come on here with issues act like they deserve the moon and the stars and thats too far, but I think you're too far the other way. You're a repeat $70k LS buyer and you deserve to be satisfied with your purchase.

Trading gas mileage by lowering tire pressure, and getting a wallowy unresponsive but somewhat better ride? C'mon that is assinine. Low tire pressure causes accidents and dramatically increased tire wear and should never be part of a solution to this problem.

A LOT of the Lexus ride is in the tires, its always been that way. A lot of times the dealer and the factory over inflate the tires and that ruins the ride. For instance the PSI on the doorframe for my ES is 29 and it always comes back from the dealer at 37.

TSB, what is the PSI on the driver doorframe of youe LS460?

[TSB]

You play rough. You’re suggesting blackmail and that’s not a good idea. Basically, Lexus makes great cars and I loved my LS430’s. Maybe I should get new shocks to improve the ride but that may void my warranty.

Absolutely Lexus makes great cars. I am a huge Lexus fan. However, you have a right to be satisfied with your purchase. If you feel your car doesn't ride like it should they should repair it. Thats why I suggested you drive another LS460 to compare to yours.

A lot of people who come on here with issues act like they deserve the moon and the stars and thats too far, but I think you're too far the other way. You're a repeat $70k LS buyer and you deserve to be satisfied with your purchase.

Trading gas mileage by lowering tire pressure, and getting a wallowy unresponsive but somewhat better ride? C'mon that is assinine. Low tire pressure causes accidents and dramatically increased tire wear and should never be part of a solution to this problem.

A LOT of the Lexus ride is in the tires, its always been that way. A lot of times the dealer and the factory over inflate the tires and that ruins the ride. For instance the PSI on the doorframe for my ES is 29 and it always comes back from the dealer at 37.

TSB, what is the PSI on the driver doorframe of youe LS460?

The label on the doorframe says that all of the tires should be 33 PSI. When I bought the car on 12/14 the pressure in all of the tires was 36 PSI. Right now they all read 30 PSI.

BTW, I just found out that we should not blame Lexus Japan for the uncomfortable ride in the LS460; the problem is with Lexus USA, the distributor of the car in this country. I went to the Lexus USA web site and clicked on Lexus International to find out what options were offered on the LS460 SWB in other countries. All of the LS460’s sold in Great Britain (England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland), Republic of Ireland, Australia, New Zeeland and “Pan Europe” (that probably means all of Europe) are equipped with adaptive variable suspension as standard equipment. It is also available as an extra cost option on LS460’s sold in Hawaii by a different distributor.

I wonder why the distributors in these countries offer adaptive variable suspension as standard equipment on the LS460 if the ride with the standard suspension is so great.

[SW03ES]

If they read 30 PSI and the door pillar says 33 they need to be 33, 30 is too low and that will create a poor ride too.

The adaptive variable suspension is not the issue, the car should ride properly without it, the LS430 did.

[08LS460]

I am new to this forum and also have a harsh riding 2008 LS460. When mentioned to my service tech at the dealership all I get is that "the car is operating as designed". Yeah right. It's reassuring to know that there are others with this same complaint. It also ticks me off to learn that short wheelbase LS460's in Europe come with the air suspension as standard when we in the U.S. can not even get it as an option. Who at Lexus makes these crazy decisions anyway??

[RFeldes]

All I can think of is either Cadillac/ Lincoln crossovers or implants from other forums or manufacturers, God forbid. LOL, in this age of Clintons nothing surprises me. I have owned a 400, 430 and the 08 460 is the best ride of all. As you may or not be aware of I have had extensive experience with 07 S550's and 08 S600. I would like to hear what you harsh riders have been driving. I also would be interested in your Dealer, and Service Ticket write up numbers to substantuate these claims. I'm sure Lexus would be too. It seems to me that we need to clear this up. So 08ls460/is400?, and other qualified or non, what is your history with LS's and "previous" vehicles and your expectations or assumptions. All I heard before is the LS is a boat. Now that it has met BMW/MB, more than halfway and not beating your back out, rock solid in turns, it's more solid than before. Quieter than a 550/600, the best of all worlds, I promise. Hopefuly, we can clear these accusations up.

[08LS460]

RFeldes, the LS460 is my first Lexus. My most recent rides have been Toyotas, a Camry and an Avalon, both of which have a smoother ride, not harsh over bumps like the LS. Granted, the Toyotas do not corner as well as the LS460, but my every day drive does not require me to run a slalom race. I expected a much more luxurious and less jarring ride with the LS460. Big disappointment.

[eatingupblacktop]

Did you not test drive before buying? Lexus has dialed in more road feel to upgrade their performance image, but I wouldn't call it harsh. I have a neighbour with one. Lovely ride. It's firmer than my LS400, but I've got the old suspensioin with over 200 k on it. I would suggest taking out a demo at the dealership over a route you find to be harsh in your car. Then immediately drive your car over the same route for comparison. If you find a substantial discrepancy, take out the service manager for the same comparison. It may be that your car was not prep'd properly before delivery.

Just noticed SW made basically the same suggestions earlier in this thread. In any event, never hurts to repeat good advice.

[gordonw]

Its funny how things have reversed. Todays Camrys and Avalon ride like the old Buicks...soft, floaty, too much body roll, no road feel. Not like the old days when the Big 3 made crap. Toyota's demographics has shifted toward an older age group, essentially filling the needs of the generations that uses to buy Buicks and Cadillacs, since both Buick and Cadillac have over the years *BLEEP*fted toward more driver oriented vehicles. Lexus has done the same thing. Since Toyota has gotten older, Lexus has shifted toward younger, like the IS-F with more perfomance. Lexus has always tried to model itself after its German counterpart, though the early LS were a little softer ride.

Its ashame we here in the US don't have roads like the German autobahn, then people would understand why certain vehicles, like BMW and MB, ride and perform like the way they do. As mentioned by someone in an earlier reply, part of a vehicles ride characteristic is in its tire and if people just looked at the tires of the LS460, they would have notice the car has 50 aspect ratio which pretty much says performance and road feel since the tire won't have as much air as say a 65 aspect rato tire to cushion the ride.

[RFeldes]

My two cents again, I agree with Gordon and still am confused as to 08ls460's response and in no mean to do I not disagree with his asessment. Having just purchased an 07 Avalon for my future "father in law" in bad need of replacing his 97 fleetwood and his saying quote " The best car I have ever owned" referring to the Avalon. Keep in mind he is 84 and a former State Senator and having owned Caddi's all his life I found it to be not only profound but challenging. We took it for a ride from Lake Charles to a small town about 12 miles up I-10, the roughest ride you will ever take and it behaved. Now, I will say "behaved" bumpity, bump. Took the same ride in the 460 and a "much" more "subdued" bumpity, bump. Smoother than his Avalon and more tart than my 430. Take that ride in my girlfriends BMW 325 and call a chiropractor. Not sure what is the matter, tire pressure or a tie down problem as was suggested. My Dealer put my tires at 30psi maybe for the cause. My friends Dealer put his S600 at 29 down from 34. Could be our roads compared to Euro standards as their roads are much better. 08ls460 try 30psi as that is where mine were set a delivery. Hope we resolve this issue as I have none on my ride. Hope it works out for you 08ls460 or maybe a Lincoln is your best bet.

[Lisat]

Rough ride is the exact words I used when talking to Lexus Shop Mgr. I have taken my car in twice for the rough ride. This time they say it is the tires. BUT tires are not warrantied. So, after 25k miles I am to be responsible for paying for new tires!!! I am *BLEEP*ed. The Shop Mgr said he would talk to Customer Service and see what he can do. So don't pick up my car until he talks to them. My car feels like it's driving on snow tires, not as bad, but similar. He said he sees this alot with "sport" Lexus'. I said I could care less, I pay too much to have my 2007 LS460 drive worse than my 3 yr old Camry!!!!! If I do not get new tires at their expense I am definitely going to contact our ABC Consumer guru and see what they can do!!

[SW03ES]

Well, tires are wear items. 25k is good life for low profile tires like that, I'd just replace them with something better and see what that does.

Its not reasonable to expect Lexus to replace tires at their expense after 25k miles.

[Mike001]

I have LS460 with about 2300 miles and a very rough ride. Include me in your "class action";

maybe there will be a fix for my car as well. If any resolution is achieved with your car,

please pass it on.

thanks,

richard hirsch

tampa

Richard,

Happy to include you in the issue. Glad to hear we are not alone. I'll PM you as this develops.

Seattle

I have heard stories of dealers leaving shims installed in the springs during shipping in and it causing a rough ride situation once the car is delivered. I'd say that no, this is not safe since the car is not designed to be driven with those shims in place. My guess is "removing the tires" is dealer code for "we removed the shims that we should have removed prior to delivery"

Latest news - the factory is sending in a rep to examine the car. The dealer's service folks are not exactly proud of that, particularly after they're top suspension man and best trained tech sayt he car rides rougher than it should. "Definitely not the Lexus luxury we'd expect."

The dealer now has 3 460L's exhibiting the same issue to some degree, one worse than ours, one slightly better. They're hunting for Michelin tires to retrofit but there is a shortage in this area. They've done one of the 3, not ours, but have no owner feedback as oif yet. It is beginning to feel like they (Lexus) have a real issue here and that our car is on the tip of the spear.

The dealer still contends the issue is only with people that have a lot of Lexus experience and are familiar with how they are supposed to ride - that makes me feel good all over and sounds pretty ironic.

Anyone else out there with a "rough rider"?

[Mike001]

I have LS460 with about 2300 miles and a very rough ride. Include me in your "class action";

maybe there will be a fix for my car as well. If any resolution is achieved with your car,

please pass it on.

thanks,

richard hirsch

tampa

Richard ,

I live in the same area and about to purchase the 08 LS460..probally from the same dealer as you ?

I am really concearned with all the " post " about a rough ride ...not to mention the diffulculties some owners have had with problems being resolved with their dealer ..espically just after purchasing a new Lexus .

I just assumed the LS460 would exceed my expectations from my current Lexus/ a 2000 GS.

Iwill admit I have barely test driven the LS460...and yes I would be classified as a novice in terms of evaluating performance ?!

Yet with the " rough rider " issues I may cool my " jets " in terms of pulling the trigger untill further due dilligence.

Up to this point for me it was all about $$ price point and which " color " to go with ......I like Black / Black but concearned about this being so hot living in Florida .....then read there is a concearn from someone who says the driver's seat doesn't doesn't cool as well as the passenger's & the rear seats ??...seems minor after reading all the " rough riding " post.

I would assume the 2008 Ls would have had ALL the " bugs " worked out ...guess that is not the case ?

Do you feel this is a mattter of what type tires are on the LS when you take possession ?...or is this much more of an issue than a certain tire mfg on the LS460 ?

What other concearns & considerations do you have as a new owner of the same car I was about to purchase ?!!

Thanks to anyone for your imput / advise before I spend this much $$ on a car .

I have heard stories of dealers leaving shims installed in the springs during shipping in and it causing a rough ride situation once the car is delivered. I'd say that no, this is not safe since the car is not designed to be driven with those shims in place. My guess is "removing the tires" is dealer code for "we removed the shims that we should have removed prior to delivery"

Latest news - the factory is sending in a rep to examine the car. The dealer's service folks are not exactly proud of that, particularly after they're top suspension man and best trained tech sayt he car rides rougher than it should. "Definitely not the Lexus luxury we'd expect."

The dealer now has 3 460L's exhibiting the same issue to some degree, one worse than ours, one slightly better. They're hunting for Michelin tires to retrofit but there is a shortage in this area. They've done one of the 3, not ours, but have no owner feedback as oif yet. It is beginning to feel like they (Lexus) have a real issue here and that our car is on the tip of the spear.

The dealer still contends the issue is only with people that have a lot of Lexus experience and are familiar with how they are supposed to ride - that makes me feel good all over and sounds pretty ironic.

Anyone else out there with a "rough rider"?

[Streamliner]

Two days ago, I took delivery of my seventh, new LS. My first was a '93 LS400. I have since had a '96, '97, '00, '03 & '05. All of my cars have had the air suspension, including this new LS460L. This is, BY FAR, the smoothest, quietest, most magnificent car I have ever driven or ridden in. My '97 was my previous favorite, as it had 16" wheels, which I happen to feel is the size that should still be used. My '05 LS430 Ultra had 18" wheels and I was quite unhappy with the way it rode over bumps. On smooth roads, it was wonderful, but the low profile tires just don't offer enough sidewall cushion for me. To my surprise, this '08, with 18" wheels, soaks up the bumps SOOOOO much better than my '05. Still, I wish the car had 16" or even 17" wheels, as I feel it would ride that much better.

[SW03ES]

The tires on the 460 have higher sidewalls than the 430, despite both being 18s

[Sal Collaziano]

Part of the reason I like the Lexus LS series is the soft ride. I learned a lot from this thread. I see the tires are a major reason for this soft ride. And I understand the sidewalls on the LS460 are higher than previous models.. I too would prefer smaller wheels.. 17" would be fine - though it might not look right on the vehicle...

[08LS460]

You say that the tires on the LS460 are "higher" than on previous models? The LS460 has 50 aspect ratio tires. Are you saying the LS430 had 45 (or less) aspect ratio tires? My LS460 is my first Lexus, therefore I am not familiar with the specs on previous LS's. Someone please enlighten me.

[SW03ES]

Yeah the LS430 with the 18s runs 245-45-18s while the LS460 runs 235-50 18s. They run 45 aspect tires on the 19' option.

[460LEX]

I will put my 2 cents in I have had the 1st Gen 1990 the 2.5 Gen 1999 LS400, now own a LS430 and a LS460. The LS 400 's were the softest riders, the 430 was stiffened up a bit but depending what sizes tires still is soft. The 460 is the stiffest off them all. Why some of you say would Lexus do this. Well if you have been keeping up with the trends in Luxury automobiles the europeans have gotten all the great press on handling and Lexus is always said to be floaty and dives in the corners. this always right or wrong gave the edge to BWM and second Merc. So if after year after year of the Rags spuming out the same rap what would you do? Knowing that handling and ride have a correlation. Lexus did what I would do to keep from becoming a 70 year old mans car they setup the suspension very close to the 7 series BMW. Don't belive me go test drive, the LS 460 is still more refined than the BWM 7 and even more so than the Merc S550. It compromises ride with handling and I think they did a great job. A automobiles ride is largely depended on the shocks and springs. these can also soften some with age so some of you that are critical might do good to put some miles on before you jump all over Lexus. While I enjoy my 430 and use it as my Daily driver I love my 460 and will be keeping both because they are different cars and you can never get too much LS in your life.

[plamma]

B)

I will put my 2 cents in I have had the 1st Gen 1990 the 2.5 Gen 1999 LS400, now own a LS430 and a LS460. The LS 400 's were the softest riders, the 430 was stiffened up a bit but depending what sizes tires still is soft. The 460 is the stiffest off them all. Why some of you say would Lexus do this. Well if you have been keeping up with the trends in Luxury automobiles the europeans have gotten all the great press on handling and Lexus is always said to be floaty and dives in the corners. this always right or wrong gave the edge to BWM and second Merc. So if after year after year of the Rags spuming out the same rap what would you do? Knowing that handling and ride have a correlation. Lexus did what I would do to keep from becoming a 70 year old mans car they setup the suspension very close to the 7 series BMW. Don't belive me go test drive, the LS 460 is still more refined than the BWM 7 and even more so than the Merc S550. It compromises ride with handling and I think they did a great job. A automobiles ride is largely depended on the shocks and springs. these can also soften some with age so some of you that are critical might do good to put some miles on before you jump all over Lexus. While I enjoy my 430 and use it as my Daily driver I love my 460 and will be keeping both because they are different cars and you can never get too much LS in your life.

I agree fully. I've had a 1990 and a 1998 LS400. They differed very slightly in handling. The new 460 has much more road feel and is only slightly less in handling compared to my old 2006 BMW 530 station wagon. By the way, I'm an 81 year old great grandfather who loves to drive.

Plamma