Awd Or Fwd... That Is The Question

[blk_on_blk]

So, I'm looking to pick up a 2000 RX and have been looking in my area (Portland, OR), reading reviews, etc. I've done the comparison between the MDX, the RX, and the X5. The MDX seems to be not as refined and kind of 'unspirited', and the X5 is hella-fun, but they have build questions and some pretty bad tranny concerns. Although the RX isn't the most powerful of the group, it seems to fit nearly everything I'm looking for.

I've read the posts and concerns about the transmission failures in the 99-01 (or so) RX300's, and I've read how the tranny is actually a fairly uniquely redesigned transmission with an integrated transfer case on the AWD version, but I'm guessing for the front wheel drive version it's basically a revamped Camry/ES300 tranny. I've also read that most of the failures have been on AWD units... I can see this being plausible: more heat, more load, more wear, etc. I've also noticed the FWD units are quicker and get better fuel economy, which is also understandable...

My question is: is AWD that much of an advantage? I could see it if one lived in a rougher climate, but PDX is pretty placid. Anyone have any raves or rants about either model?

[lenore]

It is not whether, but when the AWD tranny will fail. Stick to the FWD and save yourself a lot of money both gas wise and pocket book wise. I love our Lexus, but the premature tranny failure will ruin your passion real fast. Make sure to have the tranny serviced at 15k intervals which ever one you get. I personally would have gone with the MDX if I had it to do again.

[blk_on_blk]

Really?!? You would have gone with the MDX? ...do tell!

I've been leaning toward the FWD model, but wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything. I've had my 4Runner off road enough, and got it stuck enough, to know that's not what I'm looking for, so I'm not planning on taking the RX anywhere I wouldn't take our ES300, so FWD should do just fine.

[wwest]

Really?!? You would have gone with the MDX? ...do tell!

I've been leaning toward the FWD model, but wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything. I've had my 4Runner off road enough, and got it stuck enough, to know that's not what I'm looking for, so I'm not planning on taking the RX anywhere I wouldn't take our ES300, so FWD should do just fine.

Obviously you weren't in Portland during the winter of 68-69...!!

Insofar as I know the RX transaxle isn't unique in any way, simply an add-on PTO. And I'm not so certain the premature transaxle failures have been isolated to only the AWD model.

IN any case I will tell you that IMMHO a FWD RX with VSC & Trac would probably yeild as great wintertime adverse roadbed conditions as would an AWD RX. Regretably VSC/Trac was not available in the early models, made available for the AWD model in '01 but I'm unsure of the FWD.

I traded my 2000 AWD RX300 (in Wilsonville) for a 2000 911/996 and then bought a 2001 AWD RX300 to get HID, VSC and Trac.

No trips planned to Mt Hood or Bachelor?

[Grumpa72]

It is not whether, but when the AWD tranny will fail. Stick to the FWD and save yourself a lot of money both gas wise and pocket book wise. I love our Lexus, but the premature tranny failure will ruin your passion real fast. Make sure to have the tranny serviced at 15k intervals which ever one you get. I personally would have gone with the MDX if I had it to do again.

I couldn't disagree MORE with this statement. :chairshot: I believe that the people who squawk the most are those who have had failures. How about the rest of the RX community on this DB and others? Does EVERYONE with the RX 300 tell you about their transmission failures? Why hasn't the industry reported that ALL older RXs have tranny failures? Because it is only a few. It may well be that there are more than the average number of failures that one would expect but it is most certainly not all of them! Take a look at JD Powers surveys and the RX come up first every year. Do you really think that this would be the case if the RX owners knew that 80000 miles down the road their tranny was going to $hit the bed? Provide data if it is available please. I will agree that proper tranny and oil changes will alleviate many issues. Please remember the adage that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. ;)

To the topic at hand, AWD versus FWD. I looked extensively at Acura, Lexus, VW, BMW, and Volvo. Did my homework with JD Powers and Consumer Reports. In those two organizations Lexus and Acura came out on top each time. Lexus edged Acura by only a percent or two. It finally came down to how they looked and felt. My wife chose the Lexus but I would have picked the MDX personally, both for its looks and for its third row seating. In addition, we still own our 14 year old Acura Legend and it has been absolutley trouble free. Don't get me wrong, I do love this car but if I couldn't do the periodic repairs myself, I wouldn't own it due to high maintenance costs from the dealer. I do like the full time AWD that has many protections that you won't have in a FWD vehicle. The ability to transfer power to the non-slipping wheel is a great safety feature.

Ok, sorry. Off of my soap box.

[tmastres]

It is not whether, but when the AWD tranny will fail. Stick to the FWD and save yourself a lot of money both gas wise and pocket book wise. I love our Lexus, but the premature tranny failure will ruin your passion real fast. Make sure to have the tranny serviced at 15k intervals which ever one you get. I personally would have gone with the MDX if I had it to do again.

I'd disagree with that as well, insofar as ANYTHING and EVERYTHING will fail eventually. As I've mentioned before on this board, I've got exactly 100k on my 2000 RX, only changed the fluid twice and everything seems fine. Now I don't want to disparage anyone who's had the failure, I've had vehicle problems with other cars and it'll put you in a bad place in a hurry so I can understand anyone who's had problems never trusting the brand again, thats natural.

As for your actual question, I'd say AWD's no big dea l, especially if yo've got another vehicle to take if you know theres going to be deep snow or you know you'll be off-road. The only problem is that you may have trouble finding a 2wd model. I friend of mine bought a used 99RX from a non-Lexus dealer 2 years ago. It was advertised as 2wd and priced thus, turned out it was actuall AWD, somebody didn't do their homework/paperwork correctly. I've never inspected a 2wd model underneath but other than the VIN I don't think theres a way to tell the difference cosmetically.

Lastly a couple of people have mentioned the MDX in this thread and other than its size (being slightly larger) I personally don't rate it up with the RX. My brother-in-law has one as does my wife's best friend so I've been in them a bunch. I find the seats stiffer and the ride noticably harsher. And while the Lexus is no powerhouse the MDX seems even more sluggish and truck-like. Of course I'm talking about similar vintage vehicles 01-02 , I rate the new MDX pretty highly and when I finally get rid of my RX I'll be looking hard at the Acura as I like the new style .

[wwest]

Isn't it really nice to be able to set back and advise someone else to risk paying an extra $4,000.00 for a transaxle replacement on a $15,000 purchase?

[blk_on_blk]

Hmm... well, that's all great input, and I can see everyone's point of view. I'm not sure if there is any 'right choice'... maybe I'll just look for the right vehicle, at the right price, that has had the right care.... that's probably the 'right' choice.

As to the MDX, I think it's a great vehicle, but I found it to be a bit heavier and drive more like my 4Runner (truckish like). I also had an older Legend (a '93 LS coupe to be exact) years ago, and that was a phenomenal car, but there is just something about the Honda design that is very bland and leaves me tepid. I can't put my finger on it, and I was hoping it wouldn't be there in the Legend, but it was... it's just kind of a numb neutrality when driving them like they are sterilized or something... the eunuchs of the car world (sorry Honda/Acura... no offense intended). Although I'm impressed with the MDX, I think it's still too truck based for what I'm looking for.

In regards to AWD vs. FWD, if they are kind of hard to find, and not easily identified, then I may not try too hard to find one. Do they drive any different? I see the numbers on weight, acceleration, etc, but is it something a person can gauge by the seat of their pants? I'm not looking for a racer (I sold my drag Chevelles years ago), but I don't want it to be kind of piggy on the road... peppy is good. Also, I wonder what the real percentage of drivetrain issues are. Of course I know most people who are unhappy are going to the be ones to post/complain first, just as here on Carsurvey. com http://www.carsurvey.org/modelyear_Lexus_RX300_1999.html but I wonder what the real numbers are.

LOL, Wwest, you're right... I wasn't around for the 68-69 Portland winter... in fact, I wasn't around at all at that time. I think I was just a dirty thought in the back of my dad's head right around that time. :D I do like your choice of rides there... trading in/up for the Porsche and newer RX... sounds like a good change :D

As for the trips to Hood or Bachelor... I'll stick to the beaten path or ride with friends on the ski trips. Here's a pic from last 'not so flattering moment' up on Lolo Pass. Hey, I spent 10 years in New Mexico... nobody told me about springtime 'corn snow'. I though the 4Runner would go right through it, for I've done it tons of times in Colorado... instead it packed down under the skid plates and picked the thing right up off the ground.... stuck... wheels spinning free. My girlfriend wasn't too happy about having to help me dig out, but it must not have been too bad, cuz now she's my wife :D

[wwest]

Hmm... well, that's all great input, and I can see everyone's point of view. I'm not sure if there is any 'right choice'... maybe I'll just look for the right vehicle, at the right price, that has had the right care.... that's probably the 'right' choice.

As to the MDX, I think it's a great vehicle, but I found it to be a bit heavier and drive more like my 4Runner (truckish like). I also had an older Legend (a '93 LS coupe to be exact) years ago, and that was a phenomenal car, but there is just something about the Honda design that is very bland and leaves me tepid. I can't put my finger on it, and I was hoping it wouldn't be there in the Legend, but it was... it's just kind of a numb neutrality when driving them like they are sterilized or something... the eunuchs of the car world (sorry Honda/Acura... no offense intended). Although I'm impressed with the MDX, I think it's still too truck based for what I'm looking for.

In regards to AWD vs. FWD, if they are kind of hard to find, and not easily identified, then I may not try too hard to find one. Do they drive any different? I see the numbers on weight, acceleration, etc, but is it something a person can gauge by the seat of their pants? I'm not looking for a racer (I sold my drag Chevelles years ago), but I don't want it to be kind of piggy on the road... peppy is good. Also, I wonder what the real percentage of drivetrain issues are. Of course I know most people who are unhappy are going to the be ones to post/complain first, just as here on Carsurvey. com http://www.carsurvey.org/modelyear_Lexus_RX300_1999.html but I wonder what the real numbers are.

LOL, Wwest, you're right... I wasn't around for the 68-69 Portland winter... in fact, I wasn't around at all at that time. I think I was just a dirty thought in the back of my dad's head right around that time. :D I do like your choice of rides there... trading in/up for the Porsche and newer RX... sounds like a good change :D

As for the trips to Hood or Bachelor... I'll stick to the beaten path or ride with friends on the ski trips. Here's a pic from last 'not so flattering moment' up on Lolo Pass. Hey, I spent 10 years in New Mexico... nobody told me about springtime 'corn snow'. I though the 4Runner would go right through it, for I've done it tons of times in Colorado... instead it packed down under the skid plates and picked the thing right up off the ground.... stuck... wheels spinning free. My girlfriend wasn't too happy about having to help me dig out, but it must not have been too bad, cuz now she's my wife :D

Yes, we tend to call that stuff "Pacific Boilerplate".

Personally I have a 1994 AWD Ford Aerostar if I plan to intentionally go where the ice and snow is.

But for the unexpected stuff, lots of that twice in the past 4 months, I always carry a complete set, 4, tire chains during the winter months. You should be aware that tire chains cannot be fitted on the rear of the RX series as shipped. I added 1.5" wheel spacers all around, upgraded to 17X8 wheels aand +1" tires (wider stance, more roadbed contact area, etc) mostly so I could use tire chains on the rear initially and then also on the front if it became necessary. Otherwise my RX runs on Bridgestone Turanza summer only tires all year around for comfort and quietness.

[tmastres]

Isn't it really nice to be able to set back and advise someone else to risk paying an extra $4,000.00 for a transaxle replacement on a $15,000 purchase?

Why yes it is!! I can say it beacaue I wasn't afraid to do it (although it cost me a lot more than $15k) and, becuase I'd do it again. Our 14yr old loves my RX and he really wants it when he starts driving, though I'm not sure I want to give it up. I may be in the market for another one soon and if I find a cherry 00 or later RX at a good price I'll snap it up without a second thought!

[blk_on_blk]

Hey Wwest, do you have a pic of your RX with the +sized wheels and spacers? Kind of interested of what the end look would be.

Thanks!

[wwest]

Hey Wwest, do you have a pic of your RX with the +sized wheels and spacers? Kind of interested of what the end look would be.

Thanks!

I think its in the photo gallery at clublexus.com

[blk_on_blk]

So, after taking everyone's input here, reading reviews, and wondering if I wanted to deal with 'viscous coupling' issues on an AWD vehicle (especially when the mileage crests into the 6-figure range), I ended up getting a 2WD RX300. It took me a while to find it, since I wanted black with the gray interior and all the options, but I ended up finding it in Fountain Hills, AZ... worked with a great dealer, Cooke Motors. I bought the vehicle sight-unseen (ran a CarFax and did some research on it), and it came in being in even better condition than I expected. The only thing other I wanted on it was the Harrier style rear wing, but at least it's got a little deflector back there.

Anyhow, thanks for everyone's input here... it's greatly valued and definitely helped shape what I was looking for.

Thanks again!

[wwest]

So, after taking everyone's input here, reading reviews, and wondering if I wanted to deal with 'viscous coupling' issues on an AWD vehicle (especially when the mileage crests into the 6-figure range), I ended up getting a 2WD RX300. It took me a while to find it, since I wanted black with the gray interior and all the options, but I ended up finding it in Fountain Hills, AZ... worked with a great dealer, Cooke Motors. I bought the vehicle sight-unseen (ran a CarFax and did some research on it), and it came in being in even better condition than I expected. The only thing other I wanted on it was the Harrier style rear wing, but at least it's got a little deflector back there.

Anyhow, thanks for everyone's input here... it's greatly valued and definitely helped shape what I was looking for.

Thanks again!

I would have advised you to get a 2001 or later model with VSC/Trac and maybe HID but you at least got TC, Traction Control. Just be careful going up to Hood Meadows or Bachelor to ski with tire chains on the front ONLY. Drive SLOWLY and VERY CAREFULLY...!

Even with no rear drive I think I would still add the wheel spacers so I could have tire chains, when needed, on all four for safeties sake.

You have fuchsias out already, blooming yet...!

[blk_on_blk]

Yeah, I was trying to hold out for the right deal that was a 2001+ model, but this '99 came along at the right price, and it was just too clean of a deal to pass up (even with the shipping costs from AZ). It's got dealer service records starting from the day it rolled off the docks, plus every option from that year, and in the color combo I wanted. It even has the later model chromed 18"s on it, which I was considering upgrading to.

I now see what you are talking about regarding needing spacers... there's not much room between the wheel/tire and the strut. I'll probably hang on to the 4Runner for trips up the mountains. I can't really see bringing the RX up the mountain with 2WD, nor putting chains on the chromed 18"s.

Yeah, fuchsias in the front and several on the pergola in the back... now I just need to get the rest of the yard up to par.