I Drove The New Ls460...now I'm Wondering?

[texagun]

Let me say up front I love my LS430. I came from Mercedes and BMW's and I love the quality, reliability, and comfort of my LS430. So I went and test drove the new LS460. Drove it about 15 miles, on streets, country roads, and interstate highway. It is a wonderful car and drove great...absolutely no complaints...........but............I did not see that great of a difference between the LS460 and my LS430. I expected the steering feel to be much improved after talking with the salesman, but I could not detect any significant difference. Power was greater, the 8-speed transmission shifted more often, but frankly, I think I prefer my LS430. I would be interested to hear the impressions of you who currently own an LS430, and have driven the new LS460. What differences did you notice, and if you liked it better, why?

[lexus411]

370 hp, excellent turning radius, the navigation w/ the traffic data are just a few. The previous LS was a great car, tough to improve on. The new LS 460 will one again be the benchmark of the industry but this time not just for reliability.

[nc211]

Very interesting observations Texas.. I have not driven the 460, or even seen one yet in person. I've never driven the 430, or even the 98+ 400's..just driven my 95. But, I can say, these later models must be really something if each one had been improved from the model years prior..because my 95 is a dream to drive and I've never been happier with a car than this one, even with the repairs. I am curious what folks will say about the 8 speed tranny, and how they like all that shifting. I'm guessing most won't complain. But I think it would possibly get on my nerves personally. I like staying in one gear, and just giving it a little gas to go faster, not downshift to the lower gear. I think that's the key to a really smooth feeling in the car. But, that's just me. Would I turn down a 460, or even not buy one if I could afford it? NO WAY, that sucker would be in my garage in a heartbeat. The tech toys don't really matter that much to me though. Just give me cruise control, power windows/seats/mirrors, and a decent radio, and I'm good to go. Heck, I feel spoiled rotten with just having the power steering wheel in the LS now. I'd probably wreck if I had all those other gadgets, like laser cruise, smoke screen, oil slicks, missles, etc...

Although an ejector seat would come in handy...but would probably be the basis for my divorce.

"It's a bird, it's a plane...no, it's your nagging mother flying over the neighbor's yard! Don't spill that juicy-fruity crap on my seats son!"

[greggebhardt]

Let me say up front I love my LS430. I came from Mercedes and BMW's and I love the quality, reliability, and comfort of my LS430. So I went and test drove the new LS460. Drove it about 15 miles, on streets, country roads, and interstate highway. It is a wonderful car and drove great...absolutely no complaints...........but............I did not see that great of a difference between the LS460 and my LS430. I expected the steering feel to be much improved after talking with the salesman, but I could not detect any significant difference. Power was greater, the 8-speed transmission shifted more often, but frankly, I think I prefer my LS430. I would be interested to hear the impressions of you who currently own an LS430, and have driven the new LS460. What differences did you notice, and if you liked it better, why?

What is nice about being the buyer is YOU make the choice if the vehicle is right for you. I have only driven the LS430 and not owned it but I must say it is a nice car indeed. I do find that the 380hp, 8 speed transmission and handling make the LS460 a better car. Not sure is "better" is enough to go out and buy one, that is up to you.

I can tell you that I am VERY happy.

[rwallican]

Nothing like being content nc211, huh? That's the great thing about these cars. I've never seen so many people with older cars so content with their performance and reliability. A true testament to the Lexus brand. I gotta say I LOVE my 96ls. The way it handles on the freeway and that 270 hp is plenty. I never want to get rid of it, just add to it. It's by far the best car I've ever owned. You rarely hear people speak as highly of their older cars (Caddy, BMW, Mercedes) than Lexus owners. I plan on getting that 460 one day.....but I'm going to keep my 96 for everyday driving. I sat in that 460L after contemplating whether my next vehicle would be an SUV (Can you believe I actually considered a Range Rover!?!?). That L is luxurious and SUPER big on the inside. So now, it's a goal. Definitely content for now but plan on moving up in a few years.

[RFeldes]

nicely put rw ...they are all fine, fine automobiles and share a well rounded bloodline no matter the year, only my opinion and observations. When you drive out the driveway and you go down the road, how content are you? My 1990 feels as good as the 2002..not as many bells and whistles on the 90 but a pure, "solid" car as I have never experienced in my lifetime and I have owned them all. No list needed....I am shooting for a 600hl..wish me luck..but you guys are the best. They are all a pleasure and believe me, the best ever.

[SW03ES]

Let me say up front I love my LS430. I came from Mercedes and BMW's and I love the quality, reliability, and comfort of my LS430. So I went and test drove the new LS460. Drove it about 15 miles, on streets, country roads, and interstate highway. It is a wonderful car and drove great...absolutely no complaints...........but............I did not see that great of a difference between the LS460 and my LS430. I expected the steering feel to be much improved after talking with the salesman, but I could not detect any significant difference. Power was greater, the 8-speed transmission shifted more often, but frankly, I think I prefer my LS430. I would be interested to hear the impressions of you who currently own an LS430, and have driven the new LS460. What differences did you notice, and if you liked it better, why?

Same reaction my father had when he drove the LS430 in 2001 and decided to keep his 98 LS400. He even said after he got his 04 LS430, if it hadn't been a company car he would have kept his 98 because the way they drive is so similar.

Gotta remember the LS ride and drive is the car's greatest asset, the changes they make in that area are small. Personally I think the LS460 is way more appealing than the LS430 in simply equipment and cosmetic ways.

[SRK]

nicely put rw ...they are all fine, fine automobiles and share a well rounded bloodline no matter the year, only my opinion and observations. When you drive out the driveway and you go down the road, how content are you? My 1990 feels as good as the 2002..not as many bells and whistles on the 90 but a pure, "solid" car as I have never experienced in my lifetime and I have owned them all. No list needed....I am shooting for a 600hl..wish me luck..but you guys are the best. They are all a pleasure and believe me, the best ever.

Well said. They are pure, solid cars. I'd like to move my 92 up to a 99 or 00, but then I drive the old thing and I wonder why. I drove a 430 a while back, and sure its an improvement in nearly every way, but it's still an incremental improvement on the early LS400 that redefined the industry.

As I implied in my GS thread how is it that a 98 GS 400 can feel better than a 00 BMW M5? The press went crazy over that BMW, just gushed about everything it did, and for sure it's an impressive car, but......Lexus are too.

I still think the LS of all generations is the best kept automotive secret out there. Anyone who hasn't driven one has no idea how good they really are.

[jrdcjd]

drove LS460 and liked the nav screen (bigger and brighter), backup camera, knee bags, etc, but also just returned from trip to vegas in my 02 LS430... 10 hours each way and feeling good at the end of the trip...looked down at speedo when moving with traffic and 90+ no commotion, just quiet with the miles ticking off. just cant trade it for the 460. love that big black 430. 460 was not as quiet...tranny was not as quiet and seemed "busy."

finally convinced my business partner to quit repairing m-bz and he got the LS 430 too.

[jainla]

What is nice about being the buyer is YOU make the choice if the vehicle is right for you. I have only driven the LS430 and not owned it but I must say it is a nice car indeed. I do find that the 380hp, 8 speed transmission and handling make the LS460 a better car. Not sure is "better" is enough to go out and buy one, that is up to you.

I can tell you that I am VERY happy.

I think you have to weigh the cost (financial and time) of the upgrade vs. what you are going to get out of it; and that evaluation will be different for every person. My LS was a HUGE upgrade in every way from the car i had before; ride, handling, power, everything was an improvement by a factor of 2 to 5. So the bang for every upgrade buck was (for me) tremendous and a compelling reason to buy the car.

The 430 to 460 upgrade however, while measurable, the bang for the buck factor (for me at least) is not nearly in the same league, so I don't think I could really justify the cost; at least not at this point in my life-- I can park myself thank you very much, and I never ride in the backseat so the ottoman would be lost on me (it doesn't mean I won't take one if someone is giving one away however :) ).

For someone else; however the cost may be trivial, and they may really need the new features (they get driven around alot, they MUST watch DVDs, or they are just a REALLY BAD parallel parker). So for them the bang for the buck factor would justify the cost of the upgrade.

So far though the LS has not gone through any radical transformation like the 7 series or the S-Class have; and that keeps the day to day driving experience somewhat similar. While it as been 16 years since I drove the original LS400 on a rainy day I can still remember that it drove much like my LS430 does. Does the new car run faster, handle better and have many more luxury features? Yes. Is it a night and day comparison in day to day operation? No. And I think that's smart; it keeps buyers who want that kind of a car coming back for more.

In styling and asthetics however, i will agree with Steve that the LS460 is the biggest step forward the LS has taken since its inception; and while I think that will certainly bring buyers from other makes the previous more conservative LS seemed to suit many buyers just fine.

I think we are also hitting the law of diminishing returns here: the original LS400 was (and still is in many ways) so good that I'm not sure how much better it can really get.

[fwvett]

I traded my 2000 LS 400 for the new LS 460 and have had it for 11 days and ~350 miles. From the first I enjoyed major improvements in handling and acceleration, especially rolling acceleration. Also, the comfort of both front and rear seats is greatly improved. And, the Mark Levinson sound system with the hard disk, the navigation system, the back up camera and the park assist sonar plus a few other gee gaws are worthy additions. In this latter camp, I particularly enjoy the keyless start feature and the automatic electronic parking brake/hold feature -- what a truly great idea this brake is! The styling is attractive to me and has drawn several positive comments. I do not find the 8 speed transmission to be either a significant plus, or minus, to this point -- it is like other Lexus trannies -- smooth and seamless. Overall, the LS 460 is not quite so smooth riding as the LS 400 and I believe may not be quite as quiet, altho differences, if any, are very slight.

I cannot adequately compare the LS460 with the LS 430 as I have only ridden in the LS 430 and never driven

it. However, the LS 460 rear seat is definitley more comfortable and roomy for passengers.

To this point, I am pleased with what I see as generally significant improvements and enhancements when compared to the LS 400 I have driven for 7 years. We also have an SC 430 which we love.

[greggebhardt]

I traded my 2000 LS 400 for the new LS 460 and have had it for 11 days and ~350 miles. From the first I enjoyed major improvements in handling and acceleration, especially rolling acceleration. Also, the comfort of both front and rear seats is greatly improved. And, the Mark Levinson sound system with the hard disk, the navigation system, the back up camera and the park assist sonar plus a few other gee gaws are worthy additions. In this latter camp, I particularly enjoy the keyless start feature and the automatic electronic parking brake/hold feature -- what a truly great idea this brake is! The styling is attractive to me and has drawn several positive comments. I do not find the 8 speed transmission to be either a significant plus, or minus, to this point -- it is like other Lexus trannies -- smooth and seamless. Overall, the LS 460 is not quite so smooth riding as the LS 400 and I believe may not be quite as quiet, altho differences, if any, are very slight.

I cannot adequately compare the LS460 with the LS 430 as I have only ridden in the LS 430 and never driven

it. However, the LS 460 rear seat is definitley more comfortable and roomy for passengers.

To this point, I am pleased with what I see as generally significant improvements and enhancements when compared to the LS 400 I have driven for 7 years. We also have an SC 430 which we love.

I agree that the room in the rear two seats is nothing short of amazing. Adults can ride in the back and not feel the least bit cramped. The 460 keyless ignitition is a first for me and it is still taking some getting used to. I still reach for a key everythime I approach the vehicle btu realise I do not need one.

The power, after getting out of the LX470, is like a slingshot and will make this car fun for years to come.

[texagun]

The increase in rear passenger seat room is definately a plus, however I noticed it came at the expense of a significantly smaller trunk which is a minus. Guess you just don't get something for nothing. For a touring automobile, the decrease in trunk space is a big disappointment.

[greggebhardt]

The increase in rear passenger seat room is definately a plus, however I noticed it came at the expense of a significantly smaller trunk which is a minus. Guess you just don't get something for nothing. For a touring automobile, the decrease in trunk space is a big disappointment.

Not knowing any better, I thought the 460's truck was cavernous!

[texagun]

Not knowing any better, I thought the 460's truck was cavernous!

Better look again....it is significantly smaller.

[greggebhardt]

Not knowing any better, I thought the 460's truck was cavernous!

Better look again....it is significantly smaller.

I have been in two different LX470s for the last 6 years and have not driven or owned a Lexus car . . . . . so, as I said I have nothing to compare it too. In my opinion the truck IS cavernous and plenty big for any trip I would take. :P

[texagun]

FYI:

I looked up the trunk capacities in the Lexus sales brocures:

2007 LS460 with Executive Rear Seating.......12.0 Cu. Ft.

2006 LS430 with Rear Air Conditioning...........17.5 Cu Ft.

2007 LS460 Short Version............................18 Cu. Ft.

2006 LS430 without Rear Air Conditioning......20.2 Cu Ft.

[greggebhardt]

FYI:

I looked up the trunk capacities in the Lexus sales brocures:

2007 LS460 with Executive Rear Seating.......12.0 Cu. Ft.

2006 LS430 with Rear Air Conditioning...........17.5 Cu Ft.

2007 LS460 Short Version............................18 Cu. Ft.

2006 LS430 without Rear Air Conditioning......20.2 Cu Ft.

You seem to think I am arguing with you or something, I am not. You are talking 2 sq. ft. difference! I could take an extended trip and never fill the truck up! You need to prioritize and leave the kitchen sink at home! <vbg>

Let me repete myself one more time "In my opinion the truck IS cavernous and plenty big for any trip I would take. "

Do you understand this is "My Opinion"

[SW03ES]

Not knowing any better, I thought the 460's truck was cavernous!

Better look again....it is significantly smaller.

We used to travel in a 98 LS400 with a 14cu/ft trunk, so its all plenty big to me lol.

Honestly, I saw no need for more trunk room in the 460 I looked at. The differences in style alone FAR outweigh the 2 cu/ft difference in trunk space to me.

[jainla]

Numbers don't really tell the whole story; the LS460Ls with the tiny trunk option loose space at the front behind the seats; so that the trunk becomes short, wide and deep. It's still got space; but there's not that much usable space. Try to put some medium sized suitcases in there..its a tight fit. They should offer fitted luggage like a ferrari.. :chairshot:

The LS460 does not have the rear seat cooler or exec options so it's trunk will always be larger than the L model. I bet the hybrid with Exec seating has almost no trunk; maybe they can make the fuel tank a little smaller and put the batteries there?

Also comparing it with an LS430 is a little unfair; it has the largest trunk in its class.

Not knowing any better, I thought the 460's truck was cavernous!

Better look again....it is significantly smaller.

We used to travel in a 98 LS400 with a 14cu/ft trunk, so its all plenty big to me lol.

Honestly, I saw no need for more trunk room in the 460 I looked at. The differences in style alone FAR outweigh the 2 cu/ft difference in trunk space to me.

[stuart8181]

I traded my 2000 LS 400 for the new LS 460 and have had it for 11 days and ~350 miles. From the first I enjoyed major improvements in handling and acceleration, especially rolling acceleration. Also, the comfort of both front and rear seats is greatly improved. And, the Mark Levinson sound system with the hard disk, the navigation system, the back up camera and the park assist sonar plus a few other gee gaws are worthy additions. In this latter camp, I particularly enjoy the keyless start feature and the automatic electronic parking brake/hold feature -- what a truly great idea this brake is! The styling is attractive to me and has drawn several positive comments. I do not find the 8 speed transmission to be either a significant plus, or minus, to this point -- it is like other Lexus trannies -- smooth and seamless. Overall, the LS 460 is not quite so smooth riding as the LS 400 and I believe may not be quite as quiet, altho differences, if any, are very slight.

I cannot adequately compare the LS460 with the LS 430 as I have only ridden in the LS 430 and never driven

it. However, the LS 460 rear seat is definitley more comfortable and roomy for passengers.

To this point, I am pleased with what I see as generally significant improvements and enhancements when compared to the LS 400 I have driven for 7 years. We also have an SC 430 which we love.

I agree that the room in the rear two seats is nothing short of amazing. Adults can ride in the back and not feel the least bit cramped. The 460 keyless ignitition is a first for me and it is still taking some getting used to. I still reach for a key everythime I approach the vehicle btu realise I do not need one.

The power, after getting out of the LX470, is like a slingshot and will make this car fun for years to come.

Trunk too small now...

[1990LS400]

Trunk too small now...

Coincidentally, the trunk was the very first thing I asked to look at when a Lexus dealer salesman brought an LS460 around for me to test drive a few weeks ago.

While the LS460 trunk would hold our standard size wheel chair (better than our 00 LS400 does), I was surprised that the size/shape of the trunk did not seem as big or "luggage friendly" as an LS430.

The small trunk size of our 00 LS presents frequently challenges -- as did the trunk of our previous 90 LS. Even without the wheel chair, the 00 LS trunk barely holds the two standard size rolling airline carry-on bags, our two PC/briefcase bags, and the few other things (small camera tripod, a few car wash towels, ice scraper/brush, etc.) my wife and I take with us on a typical weekend trip. Add two additional adults and bags on a weekend trip and, "Houston, we have a problem."

I have a "pass/fail" checklist I use when evaluating cars for acceptability. The LS460 failed one of my top requirements when I found that the front turn signals could not be seen from the side -- kind of important when you have limited left eye vision. I suppose I could have some additional European market side signals installed like I did in 1990 on my first LS, but doing that was a hassle and I shouldn't have to do that again. The side visibility of the front turn signals on my 00 LS is barely adequate. It would be appropriate for Lexus/Toyota to install lighting systems that are at least as good as what is standard on Mercedes, BMW, Audi, etc. I didn't bother to test drive the LS460 after my "walk-around" inspection -- there was no point.

The Toyota Avalon Limited is looking better to me all the time. The ones I've seen lately even have turn signals in the side mirror glass -- not as good as the side signals on most European cars but better than nothing. The Avalon may not be as "snazzy" as an LS but at least it appears to meet my minimum standards including HID, VSC, and lots of air bags.

[greggebhardt]

Not knowing any better, I thought the 460's truck was cavernous!

Better look again....it is significantly smaller.

Why would I look again. I own it and it is still cavernous!

I have a 2006 Tundra if I need to carry all. The LS460 truck size is perceived differently by each person. I could not be more happy and it held my luggage for two without a problem. Some, maybe need to rethink what they are putting in their suitcase!

[1990LS400]

Why would I look again. I own it and it is still cavernous!

I have a 2006 Tundra if I need to carry all. The LS460 truck size is perceived differently by each person. I could not be more happy and it held my luggage for two without a problem. Some, maybe need to rethink what they are putting in their suitcase!

I think some of the surprise is related to Lexus making so much noise about producing a standard wheel base LS460 with significantly more rear seat space that an LS430 and to carry four or five people in greater comfort. I think Americans have come to expect "bigger and better" all the time and in all aspects. You know ... the "supersize me" mentality.

The LS460 trunk size is certainly far within the limits of acceptability. I just did not have expect the trunk size to shrink. I expected the trunk size to increase 5-10% and be at least as big as the trunk in a Ford 500 (21.2 cubic feet).

[Rx330driver]

question...where is this publicity about a SWB model with more rear seat space? i have not heard anything about that. All i hear is self parking car, with 8 speeds.

i think those who want more room are forced to get the L