Cell Phones Equal Car Crashes

[CanadaCraig]

Hi Guys!! :)

Click on THIS to read the story.

It comes as NO surprise to ME. I've always been against the idea of anyone talking on the phone WHILE DRIVING. Driving a car takes ALL of your attention. Not just what you're willing to spare.

I'd make it illegal to talk on any phone while driving. PERIOD.

What do YOU think?

Craig!! :)

[amf1932]

Hi Guys!! :)

Click on THIS to read the story.

It comes as NO surprise to ME. I've always been against the idea of anyone talking on the phone WHILE DRIVING. Driving a car takes ALL of your attention. Not just what you're willing to spare.

I'd make it illegal to talk on any phone while driving. PERIOD.

What do YOU think?

Craig!! :)

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Amen!

[91L3xus]

There was some research that said hands-free devices were much less safe than talking normally with the phone to the ear. this is because if a driver needs to react quickly, he can just drop the cell phone, while if he had an earpiece in, chances are someone would be still trying to carry on a conversation with them, which would be much more distracting in a crucial time, like swerving to avoid an obstacle. ;)

[amf1932]

There was some research that said hands-free devices were much less safe than talking normally with the phone to the ear.  this is because if a driver needs to react quickly, he can just drop the cell phone, while if he had an earpiece in, chances are someone would be still trying to carry on a conversation with them, which would be much more distracting in a crucial time, like swerving to avoid an obstacle.  ;)

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Show me this so called "research" you're talking about!

[91L3xus]

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Show me this so called "research" you're talking about!

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Here ya go. :)

"When they were in a conversation on a cell phone, they were no longer any faster or any more accurate in their ability to detect meaningful changes, such as a little girl running between cars in traffic, than they were able to detect changes that were not meaningful to driving safely."

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Here's another

In 2001, they found that even hands-free cell phone use distracted drivers. In 2003 they revealed a reason: Drivers look but don't see, because they're distracted by the conversation.

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And here's probably the most rediculous one. Radio, baby, etc.

She drove along with Ronni Graf, who manages her hectic life from her car, with baby in tow and hands-free cell phone at the ready.

"Now," Graff says, "I can change the radio for the baby, get a diaper bag and a pacifier and pass it back to him. That's why it's good for me."

People are so dumb. <_<

Edited July 12, 2005 by 91L3xus

[91L3xus]

Also from the 3rd link:

"Hands-free units can be less safe, because it leads to longer conversations and more mental distraction," Kissinger observes.

[SW03ES]

This honestly is total BS. Cell phones are no more dangerous than anything else you do in the car while you're driving, its just a "popular" thing to go after.

I've said this before but when I was in college I studied under a Psychology professor that did a lot of research into the many things one does in the car that reduces response times, and he found that response times were not as effected by cell phones as they were by anything else, and that handsfree or to the ear didnt make a lot of difference. The worst thing? Heads up displays reduced reaction time more than alcohol.

His research was just successful in the Maryland legislature voting to continue allowing cell phones to be used without handsfree kits in cars.

[91L3xus]

This is true, but it is completely outrageous when you see or hear about someone like Ronni Graf who thinks since one hand isn't occupied to hold the cell phone that she can change the radio, attend to her BABY in the back seat, drive her car and i'm guessing talk on the cell phone at the same time. If she had any common sense, she would at least pull off the road, and take care of her child at hopefull no one else's expense; and also be respectful of other people's decisions to allocate their full attention to just driving.

It's a combination of stupid actions and decisions (including multi-tasking when driving) that causes most accidents. And when you put an irresponsible driver behind the wheel of a car with any distractions, there's bound to be an issue.

Edited July 12, 2005 by 91L3xus

[CanadaCraig]

SW03ES

I found your message confusing. You said, "This honestly is total BS. Cell phones are no more dangerous than anything else you do in the car while you're driving......."

Like WHAT - for instance? Steering? Braking? Using a turn signal?

To suggest that using a cell phone is NOT distracting and does NOT contribute to the lack of attention that causes many accidents - simply flies in the face of logic. Would you care if your surgeon was talking to friends on his cell phone while making his first cut into your chest?

Craig

[SW03ES]

I didnt say it wasn't distracting, but its no more distracting than changing the radio, talking on a handsfree kit, having a conversation in the car, or even believe it or not driving with the windshield wipers on. Yep, that reduces reaction times as much as talking on a cell phone.

And come on, driving a car is not heart surgery. Its a behavior that is done mostly unconciously much like walking. Comparing the two is stupid.

Yes accidents happen, but stupidity is to blame not cell phones. Cell phones are just the in thing to bash. The cell phone is here to stay, without the ability to use it in the car many professionals will not be able to conduct business including me. A law banning them in cars might get passed in Canada, but never in the US.

[monarch]

I agree, Canada Craig that cell phones or any other distractions are dangerous. About 4 months ago while driving my beater pickup truck I crashed into the rear bumper of a brand new Toyota Tundra at 2-3 MPH, all because I was distracted by my cell phone and didn't brake as quickly as I should have. I was very, very lucky the Tundra bumper withstood the impact without visible damage and the owner decided not to file an accident report that would have raised my insurance rates.

Also, there have been cases where other drivers almost crashed into me because they were preoccupied with their cell phone conversations.

[denslexusgx470]

doing anything else while driving is very dangerous. That was the reason for why my mom got rear ended in the RX back in 02. the old lady wasn't paying attention to a sudden stop because she was giving a lot of attention to her dogs in the back seat. Add to that, her radio was hecka loud that you thought someone had a microphone and was speaking in it in a concert hall.

after all that, you know what happened? she didn't say "sorry" or "anyone hurt?" but instead attended to her dogs with those questions in her mind. ayyy, :chairshot:

[1990LS400]

My wife and I noticed just last Sunday how few people made it through a particular intersection after the light turned green. People seemed to just sit there for a few seconds after the light turned green and then slowly moved on. When we looked around us we noticed that many of the drivers had a cell phone pressed to their ears and simply were not paying attention to what was going on around them.

I have joked about punching out the next person that hits my car while talking on the phone. I thought about doing that to the last phone using driver who rear ended my LS but she was just too cute.

[denslexusgx470]

My wife and I noticed just last Sunday how few people made it through a particular intersection after the light turned green.  People seemed to just sit there for a few seconds after the light turned green and then slowly moved on.  When we looked around us we noticed that many of the drivers had a cell phone pressed to their ears and simply were not paying attention to what was going on around them.

I have joked about punching out the next person that hits my car while talking on the phone.  I thought about doing that to the last phone using driver who rear ended my LS but she was just too cute.

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awww, how nice of you. still damage the Lex though even if she was cute. :P

[SW03ES]

Well if you use that logic windshield wipers should be outlawed too, because they cause the same drops in reaction times as cell phones.

[CanadaCraig]

Well if you use that logic windshield wipers should be outlawed too, because they cause the same drops in reaction times as cell phones.

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The difference being that windshield wipers are a part of the car. We need them to see out of the windsheild on a rainy day. A cell phone is an UNNECESSARY DISTRACTION. I'm sure that your professor was/is a very smart person. But other equally smart people are disagreeing with him.

Craig

[1990LS400]

This is not exactly a new issue. Cell phone companies and service providers had plenty of evidence since at least the early 1980's that talking on a cell phone was much more dangerous than talking to a passenger in the car. It is odd that this is hitting the news again now.

My father had a "radio telephone" beginning in the 1950's (they were in wide use through the 1970's) and I remember how he always pulled off the road before making a call and immediately pulled over when receiving a call.

Frankly, I give a wide berth to people talking on phones while driving and I leave a lot of extra room in front of me if I see the person in back of me talking on a phone.

What scares me most are the people who run stoplights while talking on the phone. They don't do it on purpose - they just don't see the red light at all - they are in "cell phone land".

I don't think it would do much good to ban handheld phones in cars since handsfree phones are just as distracting. Although other devices in cars are distracting there is something very, very different about talking on a cell phone with someone you can't see and who can not see what you are dealing with.

[RX in NC]

There's no question that a cell phone combined with driving is a dangerous mix. Check with any Highway Patrol statistician for their empirical evidence built up over the past decade or so.

Those who use cell phones while driving will always argue that other in-vehicle activities are just as dangerous. Those who believe that cell phone usage should be outlawed for all drivers will always argue that no other in-vehicle activity comes close to being as dangerous as talking on a cell phone.

If you want the truth, talk to the cops. They'll tell you that using a cell phone while driving should be illegal. Kudos to the states that have taken that step at this point. I surely wish that North Carolina would - our roads would be somewhat safer, especially during the morning and afternoon commutes.

I'm glad my office is in my home....

[SW03ES]

I don't think it would do much good to ban handheld phones in cars since handsfree phones are just as distracting.  Although other devices in cars are distracting there is something very, very different about talking on a cell phone with someone you can't see and who can not see what you are dealing with.

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Not according to this research, I've seen the results with my own two eyes.

What you have to look for is empirical research, you never know what you're getting when you read whats written in these news stories because news stories are designed to make money. People want to read about how cell phones are dangerous because cell phones are a high status item in our culture. Its the same as the gas guzzling SUV stories, people are jealous of these things and they enjoy hating them. I've said it before, there was also a study about attitudes towards people on cell phones and not and it showed that people had very different reactions to pictures of a man holding a cell phone than they did to the same man with no cell phone. People thought he was more important, affluent, people said he was arrogant. All because he's holding a cell phone, powerful stuff.

When you actually look into the real scientific studies done on the subject, there's not much. Whats out there is pretty evenly split down the middle. That usually means the truth is halfway between, worse than our research would assume, but not as bad as the research at the opposite side of the spectrum.

The truth is that cell phones are not the danger the media wants to make us believe. Remember, this research was enough to keep the state of MD from enacting a hansfree law. I believe we're the first state to vote one down.

We need them to see out of the windsheild on a rainy day. A cell phone is an UNNECESSARY DISTRACTION.

So a radio is an unnecessary distraction? How about a navigation system? Heads up display? Eating? Drinking? Passengers? Remember that all of these things slow reaction times as much, or more than a cell phone conversation.

Who are you to say cell phones are unnecessary? I find it quite neccesary as do the millions of people on our roads that work in industries where contact is vital that also include lot of time spent in a car. Sure "we didnt use to have cell phones" but people didn't used to expect the kind of availiability and response that they do now. Hell, I'm getting ready to get a Blackberry because clients get bitchy if their email goes an hour before response. I would be unable to be as effective at my job if I could not have a cell phone. It would put me at a disadvantage.

The issue isn't the distractions in our cars, its the fact that most of the people that drive them can't drive them safely. What more do you expect when all you have to do is make a left turn, paralell park, turn around, and back up 100 feet to be able to drive down a highway at 70MPH. THATS where our attention needs to be focused but thats not popular because we each can't sit behind the TV or computer screen and condemn others because the issue includes us.

[SW03ES]

There's no question that a cell phone combined with driving is a dangerous mix.  Check with any Highway Patrol statistician for their empirical evidence built up over the past decade or so.

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Actually the stats I saw had cell phone usage linked to 1% or so of all auto accidents. I'll find that data this evening.

If you want the truth, talk to the cops. They'll tell you that using a cell phone while driving should be illegal.

Cops also tell us that we need to drive 55MPH and if we don't we're going to die.

They'll tell you that using a cell phone while driving should be illegal. Kudos to the states that have taken that step at this point.

There are no states that have banned the use of cell phones entirely. That will never pass.

[SW03ES]

Here you go:

http://www.ncsl.org/programs/transportatio...eupdate1203.htm

In California for instance, 611 cell phone crashes compared to 5,611 innatention crashes (that is, doing other stuff like eating, etc) compared to a total 491,083 crashes. That means cell phones accounted for a total of .12% of all accidents in CA. Hardly the great menaced the media makes it out to be. Thats 1/10th of 1%.

They make a point that cell phone use is hard to detect, well lets say even if all of the innatention crashes were cell phone related, that would still only be 1.1% of all crashes.

The cause of the rest of the crashes, the other 99%? The fact that we don't require drivers to be trained in the US. Do we hear about this? No because it doesn't sell papers and pay for advertising space on TV or the Internet like harping on cell phones does.

So whats driving the huge anti cell phone campaign thats costing the taxpayers billions? The media, as always. The sad thing is people are dying because the infastructure is so poor, and we're all too duped by the media to understand that.

[RX in NC]

Only the gullible allow themselves to get duped by the media.

Any distraction in the cockpit will increase the chances for accidents. For the most part, using a cell phone requires more attention and brainpower than adjusting the radio, eating, drinking a beverage, etc. Many drivers do not have the dexterity or the ability to subdivide their attention spans to handle the multitasking required. They believe that they do, but their driving capabilities often prove them wrong.

You want to be able to continue to use your cell phone, so you'll vigorously defend that outcome. Others want cell phones to be outlawed while driving, so they'll vigorously defend that outcome. Both factions have the right to do so.

In the meantime, cell phone-related crash statistics continue to climb, as do the injuries and fatalities associated with them. Routine observation on our highways and byways tell most of us that there are too many drivers out there who can't manage to safely drive and use a cell phone at the same time.

This is one of those unfortunate situations where for the good of the motoring public, the use of cell phones needs to be severely restricted in moving vehicles.

Perhaps a compromise would involve some sort of attention span / dexterity test that one must pass in order to drive with a cell phone. But many phone providers as well as federal and state authorities may not be able to agree on how such a test should be designed and administered.

But in the general publics' hands, cell phones are dangerous when combined with driving a vehicle. That is becoming clearer with each passing year.

[SW03ES]

I totally agree, but the question is are those drivers really any safer without the phones in their hands?

It all comes back to the requirements to get a license in the US. EVERYONE should have to go through a lot more to get and keep a license than they do now. Personally I think drivers licenses should be a federal thing so the requirements are consistent among states.

I got my license a lot more recently than most of you and trust me, it was scary. I took a 2 week class that consisted of red asphalt videos and tests about law that were sad. My favorite time was the 3 classes we spent learning about "Buying, titling, and insuring a car". Then I took one class in a car with an instructor who excused me from the other two classes because I was "the best young driver she'd ever seen" which I thought was awesome at the time, but now that scares the hell out of me.

I had to get an 80 to pass the law test, which you should have had to get a 100 to pass, then I turned left, paralell parked, turned around once, backed up 100 feet (all in a closed course) then I was good to careen down the highways at 80MPH talking on my cell phone! It was sick.

They've made it a little harder now by creating this logbook of driving time for parents to fake.

THATS the problem folks.

[91L3xus]

Damn. SW sure knows how to put up a good argument. If there was a "thumbs up" smilie, i'd put it here.

To add on the ease of getting a liscense, when i took incar driver's ed last summer, nothing was serious at all. My instructor (through his own private company in Silver Spring) was probably the worst way to be brought up into the driving world. People (like 15 and 16 years old) would drive my instructor and a few other passengers around, while talking on thier phones, changing the radio station, talking to the instructor and talking to other people in the car. He didn't inforce times when students didn't fully stop at stop signs, use turn signals or adhere to the right-of-way at 4 way stops. It was the first time driving for about half of the kids i rode with during the 2 weeks. They hadn't even driven with their parents yet! And already our lives were put in their hands.

One time, since we were late for the next few appointments, we eventually put 7 people (including the driver) in a Pontiac Gran Prix. What kind of example does that show to new drivers? If they enter the world of driving like this, who knows what they will be like out on the road after getting their liscenses?

[amf1932]

How much clearer does this have to be spelled out!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8545779/