Rx400h Not Up To Specs

[SW03ES]

wwest has been banned from the LOC for a period of two weeks. I'm tired of him being rude and condescending to our RX400h owning members. He chose not to heed my repeated warnings about this behavior on this topic and this is the result.

[Husker4theSpurs]

Resets itself???  Why would it do that?

On the RX400h, you reset the mpg on the navi screen...you leave it going as long as you want...(or as short as you want)...that way if your trip is over 1 gas filling, you can gauge it for the whole trip...don't see an advantage to a car resetting the mpg gauge itself with each gas fill-up!

On the RX400h, the display is either on the navi screen or on the dash...in the instrument cluster area...you can actually view it in 2 places...

Headless

←

On my RX it resets after a fill-up ... I don't have the Navigation system so maybe it works the same as the 400h for the 330's with Nav. Yes, it seems wrong to have it reset manually if you would want an average over a long trip.

[SW03ES]

The mileage resets every fillup. Theres also some way to get a lifetime mileage reading though that cannot be reset.

My fiance got over 50 mpg for the first time ever on her Prius and its now over a year old with almost 7000 miles. The mileage gets better with age.

[F86D]

wwest has been banned from the LOC for a period of two weeks. I'm tired of him being rude and condescending to our RX400h owning members. He chose not to heed my repeated warnings about this behavior on this topic and this is the result.

←

Repeated warnings??

Where did you send those??

None in PM that I remember.

Since I'm banned I can't access my account to see any PM's nor find out if the email address I registered under is still valid.

Our, my, spam filter keeps getting more robust, for reasons I'm sure you can understand, so maybe your warnings got filtered and I just never noticed.

I will respect the ban but in the future you might try in some way to be sure I recieve your warnings.

Thank You,

Willard West

And now would you please be so kind as to "ban" this account also.

[Drumrboy]

wwest has been banned from the LOC for a period of two weeks. I'm tired of him being rude and condescending to our RX400h owning members. He chose not to heed my repeated warnings about this behavior on this topic and this is the result.

←

I don't want to get into a peeing match here, but I dont see where wwest was "rude and condescending"

I'm not saying he/she wasn't but could someone point out the post.

to be fair, this board is chock full of info, the kind of stuff you cant get anywhere!!

Thats good and bad.

I've had problems with my 330 and it seems (to me) that most of you guys just gloss over these things.

continued later.....

[F86D]

I suspect it has something to with my asking if rx400hgirl was/is truly blond.

[RX400hGirl]

I suspect it has something to with my asking if rx400hgirl was/is truly blond.

←

I'm actually a red-head but I definitely have blonde moments. My husband pointed out to me that indeed the most accurate mgp is going to be your total consumption not just per trip. That said, I was just encouraging the original poster to at least do some trip checks to see if he ever sees the 27/31 mpg promised before returning the car.

I think we are all learning are way with this, and I can tell you I'm no expert

I also should point out that I live in the #3 worst city for traffic in the U.S. so my good fortune is also my greatest grief. :cries:

[F86D]

rx400hgirl...

Very glad you didn't take it as an insult, meant it to be a joke but I know I shouldn't do that over the phone or on the internet, sorry.

[SW03ES]

wwest- I sent you a PM which you read, I have confirmation of it. I also repeatedly warned you through the forums that you needed to step back and stop turning all the RX400h threads into argumentative *BLEEP*ing matches.

You may come back in 2 weeks, and after that time if you can keep your posts objective and respectful they'll be no future problems.

[Drumrboy]

I suspect it has something to with my asking if rx400hgirl was/is truly blond.

←

Well ya know what, I can see how someone could take that as rude. (I say its sexist) but what the hey do i know. I must have a thick skin though. I'm polish and blonde, (ya think ive heard a few jokes before??

[the-headless_horseman]

Okay everyone...

Here's one for the forum...

I drive to work about 10 minutes...during that time, the car gets horrible mileage...as we all know, the RX400h engine runs almost the entire first 1-3 minutes..I guess to recharge the batteries...

One the way home from work tonight, I ran an extra errand...a few miles out of the way...I found that my mileage was a little better although it was in similar driving conditions...

I'm learning that following behind someone is bad...really...riding the brakes and accelerating kills the mpg....I think this car 'rolls' more than others to help the batteries?

I'm also learning that perhaps the longer you drive it at a given time, the more the engine and batteries warm up, thus running more efficiently...

For example...whenever I accelerate, even slowly, the gas motor kicks in at like 5-7 mph...when I was coasting on a street tonight at like 25-30, I lightly hit the gas and actually got some battery power...kept me coasting...without the gas kicking on....I have never seen this before...anyone think that if you drive 25 minutes opposed to 15 that it makes a difference?

Headless

[the-headless_horseman]

Anyone think this car is up to original specs? eh????

Lexus Introduces RX 400h, World's First Luxury Hybrid SUV

01/06/2004 Detroit, MI

Lexus introduced what will be the world's first luxury

gas-electric hybrid SUV today at a press conference at the North American International Auto

Show. The RX 400h will be powered by a V6 Hybrid Synergy Drive system that combines sub-eight

second zero-to-sixty acceleration with fuel-efficiency equivalent to the current average for a

four-cylinder compact sedan. The RX 400h will also be rated Super Ultra Low Emission Vehicle

(SULEV), one of the most stringent emissions rating in the industry.

"The new RX 400h re-defines the midsize luxury SUV market while raising awareness and

acceptance of hybrid gas-electric vehicles among luxury car and SUV buyers," said Denny

Clements, Lexus group vice president and general manager. "This is truly a breakthrough in

terms of hybrid gas-electric powertrains because, for the first time, it adds a new performance

dimension to the traditional hybrid advantages of high mileage and low emissions."

Lexus created the car-based, luxury SUV segment with the launch of the innovative RX 300 more

than five years ago. For 2004, Lexus made significant enhancements to the luxury content,

performance and safety features with the introduction of the RX 330, making this vehicle the

perfect match for the new V6 hybrid system.

The new RX 400h will become the premium model in the RX series, offering smoother and quieter

operation, increased performance, significantly better fuel economy and a host of high

technology, safety and comfort features.

Vehicle Dynamic Management

The RX 400h will introduce another industry first called VDM, or Vehicle Dynamic Management.

Monitoring a variety of sensors, the system is designed to anticipate the onset of a vehicle

skid or slide and then helps correct the situation with a combination of braking and throttle

control. The new VDM system is less obtrusive than conventional VSC but ultimately more

effective.

More Powerful, Advanced Drivetrain

The 400h hybrid powertrain combines a powerful electric motor with the highly efficient

3.3-liter V6 engine found in the RX 330 to significantly improve low to mid-speed acceleration

and overall fuel efficiency. The system is a "full hybrid," meaning that the RX 400h is capable

of operating in separate gas or electric modes, as well as a mode that combines power from

both.

The RX 400h will develop a peak system output of approximately 270 horsepower and deliver

combined fuel economy significantly better than the current average compact sedan rating of

27.6 miles-per-gallon. Zero-to-sixty acceleration will also improve over the current RX 330's

sub-8 second time. The RX 400h with optional all-wheel-drive, which features a rear-drive

electric motor, will accelerate quicker yet.

The RX 400h uses a regenerative braking system to further boost system efficiency. When the

vehicle is coasting or the brakes are applied, the electric motor functions as a generator,

capturing kinetic energy that would normally be lost as heat through the brakes and converting

it into useable electricity to recharge the batteries.

One of the most remarkable features of the RX 400h is how similar this SUV is to its cousin,

the RX 330. The computer-controlled powertrain seamlessly blends power from the V6 gasoline

engine, the electric drive motor and the generator. The driver does not feel the vehicle

changing operational modes. In fact, the only give-a-way is the absence of the traditional

tachometer. In its place, the RX 400h has an illuminated power meter that displays the level of

power generated by the gas-electric hybrid powertrain. The driver will also be able to monitor

the gas-electric power distribution on the available seven-inch touch panel display screen that

comes with the navigation system.

Luxury and Convenience Features

Lexus craftsmanship and attention to even the smallest details continue with the RX 400h.

Nearly every feature available in the RX 330 is found in the RX 400h, with the exception of an

exclusive RX 400h use of brushed aluminum accents inside that convey a high-tech look and feel

to match its capabilities. The three-spoke steering wheel features easy-to-use controls for the

audio system as well as the hybrid system's on-board computer monitor located in the center

instrument panel.

"We believe the RX 400h will exceed the expectations of luxury vehicle buyers and establish a

premium market for performance-oriented, fuel-efficient gas-electric hybrids," said Clements.

Preliminary Specifications

Powertrain: Engine - 3.3 liter V6

Electric motor(s) - Permanent magnet

Estimated total horsepower - 270

Expected EPA emissions rating - Super Ultra Low Emission Vehicle (SULEV)

Transmission - Electronically-controlled Continuously Variable Transmission (ECVT)

Wheelbase: 106.9 in.

Length: 186.6 in.

Width: 72.6 in.

Height: 66.1 in.

# # #

[marmadmax]

I may have become disappointed a little too soon. I took your advice again - I reset the MPG calculator again today for the second time. Today, I travelled a total of 55 miles, 15/85 city/hwy. I started off with about 4 miles of city driving and the MPG registered 32+ :D . The next segment was about 20+ hwy miles. This lowered the computer calculated average for the 25+ mile trip to 31. After the return trip, the overall mpg for the 55 mile excursion did drop to 29.

Now I will have to say that I did everything I could to make sure the electric motors were operating whenever possible. I backed off the accelerator, coasted, cruise control on hwy at about 63 mph - I did change my normal driving pattern somewhat. It is disappointing that it may be necessary to change your normal driving patterns in order to achieve near predicted mpg numbers, but I guess it is possible. At least it was on this day. Tomorrow I fill up and will get mpg calcs using more traditional methods. However, I do not anticipate anything close to these results.

[SW03ES]

Yeah short trips are bad for the mileage, if you group your trips together so that you drive less often, but for longer you'll get better mileage.

The Prius people make getting mileage a sport, there's a technique for it.

[ReXus]

Hi F86D/wwest. Sorry, I hope my complaint didn't get you banned. I did think your post was impolite, but certainly not punishable by death! :-)

FWIW, I've read many of your posts on a number of sites over the years, and you do have a unique way of presenting "the other side of the coin." I for one usually do appreciate the occasional reality check and the 180-degree counterpoint. No hard feelings I hope.

[SW03ES]

Nothing got him banned but his own conduct. Its not only this post, its a history of abrasiveness and rudeness when it comes to this topic, but lets not dwell on this. Its only 2 weeks anyways, lets hope he can come back and learn from the experience.

[the-headless_horseman]

As listed above in the Lexus press release...this car was meant to deliver performance and efficiency....

The way I see it at the current time is take your pick...you ain't gonna get both...

I know I sound like a constant complainer...I'm quite suprised with myself...argh!!

However, I cannot believe I spent over $50,000 on this thing...I expected waaaay too much, evidently...and Lexus has delivered waaaay too little...well below expectations....

I think if you were to poll 250 owners (probably about as many on the road right now), most would not be happy with the vehicle thus far...

Getting good performance and good mileage together is not a bonus...it's what we paid for...and if we're not getting it, we have a right to be upset!

Sure, my RX400h may get 5 mpg better than my friend's FX35, and with cheapy gas instead of premium, but, the price differential is huge and it's not like the Lexus delivers a much better ride...the FX outperforms the RX in many ways...$10,000 cheaper too (takes a long time to make up that price difference with gas!) I was hoping to get about 12 mpg better...this would be worth bragging about...right now, I'm embarrased with this car! Lexus should have done better...esp. with all the extra time they took to test the vehicle!

Headless

[RX400h]

One thing you forgot to mention is that you can easily trounce the FX35 in a race while still beating him in fuel mileage, while also getting a $2000 tax break and possibly the use of the HOV lanes. Also, look at the extras you have that he may not such as a very sophisticated stability system, side air bags, voice-recognition NAV with blue tooth, etc, etc. $50K is alot of dinero but you do get alot of technology for the money.

Take a poll here and I think you'll find that the majority are happy with their purchase.

[the-headless_horseman]

One thing you forgot to mention is that you can easily trounce the FX35 in a race while still beating him in fuel mileage, while also getting a $2000 tax break and possibly the use of the HOV lanes. Also, look at the extras you have that he may not such as a very sophisticated stability system, side air bags, voice-recognition NAV with blue tooth, etc, etc. $50K is alot of dinero but you do get alot of technology for the money.

Take a poll here and I think you'll find that the majority are happy with their purchase.

←

Beating a FX35 in a race...no way...the FX35 is still faster than the RX400h...look at the numbers...

No $2000 tax credit...it's a $1000 tax credit for 2005, last I looked...

Using HOV lanes not a factor for me...I'm not using the highways during rush hour...

Stability system the same as Infiniti...side air bags are a nice plus as well as superior navi system and blue tooth...can't knock that...Lexus rules in this area hands down...but, that's still not reason we all bought the car...

That high price tag is/was for high performance and excellent efficiency...looks like we get our pick of one or the other...one thing for sure with the RX...at least the RX400h isn't using premium gas...most other SUVs require such now! That alone is a .20-.25 cent difference per galllon at the pump!

If I can drive this car normally and get over 25 mpg on average, I'll be content...(still think we should get 31/27 with normal driving...none of this grandma stuff!)...

Headless

[patt]

Headless, you must have looked quite a while ago at the tax break - it was initially suppose to go to $1000 in 2006. Looking recently at the IRS.gov site, the 2005 deduction is now $2000 - they extended the higher level. However, the last time I looked they hadn't announced whether the RX would be included.

By the way, we are happy with our RX400H.

In regard to what wwest posted, according to the manual, the RX does run on only gas some of the time. The front motor/generator isn't always in use. That is what the display in mine shows too. I see all the combinations during a drive: engine only, motor only, motor and engine, engine and regeneration, regeneration only.

[WEast]

Headless, I've read your posts and heard your frustrations on the other lexus forums also. How far along (mileage-wise) are you for the reported break-in period?

In general I would like to request total mileage on any 400h that is either getting or not getting what it is supposed to (27/31). It seems most people are reporting it to be better as more miles are put on like the Prius. But it would be good to know if there truly are cases where it does not improve.

[RX in NC]

Yep, many folks wear rose-colored glasses on these boards and a lot of participants come across as cheerleaders for their particular vehicle.

No vehicle is perfect and quite a few don't do what they are advertised and sold to do. As for the 400h, the jury will be out for quite some time.

But remember - gas/electric hybrids are a stop-gap, niche, trend-of-the-moment thing in automotive design. They will have their run but at this point, no one knows how long that run will be.

Hydrogen power is the eventual answer in replacing fossil fuel dependence. But hydrogen vehicles are still not visible on the horizon due to fuel distribution infrastructure creation, governmental red tape, Big Three heads in the sand, and many other factors that must change drastically in order for the technology to be introduced. Once those obstacles are overcome, and only then, hydrogen power will proliferate faster than any transportation mechanism in history. Watch and see.

[WEast]

I am surprised by some reactions of wwest being temporarily banned.

I would like to shed a little light on why someone who seems intelligent and knowledgeable is also able to occasionally be abrasive, contrary, and rude - particularly on the subject of the 400h.

Let me summarize:

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Posted on: Mar 29 2005, 02:56 PM

Personally I'm willing to place bets that the RX400h will never be released for sales to the general public.

This one is just funny in hindsight. I wish someone had taken him up on it!

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Posted on: Apr 11 2005, 12:58 PM

Those of us who want to be environmentally conservative, "greenies", likely will not be buying any vehicle being marketed based on V8, hybrid SUPERCHARGED performance.

So the market will most likely be "boy-racer" types that want to "look" green.

How many of those around??

And given the vehicle is being primarily marketed to "lead-foot" types, that Boston Lexus service writer may very well be correct, the RX400h will be a gas hog, not as a result of the hybrid aspects, but because of its use in the designated high performance market.

There's nothing egregious about this post, but I find it quite assuming and generally wrong. I seem to find a lot of "light-foot, responsible type" 400h drivers on the forums

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Posted on: Apr 12 2005, 10:38 PM

"longest waiting list in the history of Lexus..."

Yes, and how much of that wait was due to Lexus delaying production again and again? How many do you suppose lost faith and dropped off the waiting list.

Must have been very close to the 18, 000 Lexus touted as being on that waiting list since so many high population density area dealers are now offering first come first serve MSRP deals on the RX400h.

There are still waiting lists in high population density areas, and while many are probably the same person going to 2 or 3 dealers to get the soonest available, they clearly have not lost 18,000 people due to "lack of interest". I must admit that I do not know the production schedule(s) of the 400h, or how many delays there were, but demand is still quite high from what I see.

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Posted on: Apr 12 2005, 11:43

Complainin!

Me?

NOT!

Just stating the facts.

I have no cause to complain, I dropped off the wait list years (seems like) ago. Now that Lexus is marketing to the HP/Torque set and not their Prius base I'm rather glad I did.

Back when I worked at Boeing if a vendor delayed the scheduled delivery of a machine tool we always sent an engineer to look into the reason. You just simply wouldn't believe some of the things we learned that way.

So you're just simply here to scoff at people that still want one?

A delay to fix something is always better than to rush the product out... Ask GM.

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Posted on: Apr 14 2005, 05:14

Maintaining confidence in hybrid technology cannot be accomplished by building GAS HOGS.

This statement is false. An obvious stab at the mileage of the 400h - but that has nothing to do with the 400h being an important stepping stone in the improvement of hybrid technology. Every model that goes into production and gets real road usage helps to hone design for future models.

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Posted on: Apr 15 2005, 11:09 AM

Maybe when he started the battery was FULL and at the end it was EMPTY.

Okay, this was likely a joke. However, combined with previous statements this can be easily perceived as condescending.

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Posted on: Apr 15 2005, 01:04 PM

Debunking....

Really??

Just give some thought to what the fuel economy might have been if T/L wasn't going after the boy-racer set.

"boy-racers"... Seems to me that there are many women and men of all ages curious about getting a luxury hybrid with pep.

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Posted on: Apr 15 2005, 02:45 PM

But.

Just how many "boy-racers" will be interested in an SUV, a LUXURY SUV, even with V8 performance. And how many of those that are interested can afford the HL version, let alone the RX.

Pretty small demographics, methinks.

*sigh*... again with the "boy-racers"...

Methinks you doth protest too much.

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Posted on: Apr 22 2005, 05:08 PM

I think V8 performance in the class and weight or the RX series is pure overkill, I'm perfectly happy with the ZOOM level of my 2001 AWD RX300. So I won't be in the market for an RX400h GAS HOG anytime soon.

I also happen to think that V8's are unnecessary.

"GAS HOG" is relative to what you compare it to.

The 400h is not a Prius and everyone knows that.

A Hummer is a GAS HOG.

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Posted on: Yesterday, 11:23 AM

RX400hGirl...

If you don't reset the computer after each trip you get 20-24MPG (the "TRUE" average!). But if you reset it after each trip you get 30MPG.

That's called peak detection to some of us.

Appologies in advance, but are you truly a BLOND??

And the grand slam... reads: 'peak detection to those of us with a brain'

Even as a joke, how can you expect that someone would not be offended?

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I'm here to get facts, which is why I realize that this post is inherently out of line. I am still on the fence about getting one of these, so I'm not just some blind fan. As someone who supports any step in the direction of cleaner cars that have some torque - I've found some of those statements wrong and generally rude in tone. After reading through many of his non-400h posts, I have not seen that attitude..

People have their reasons for wanting or owning this vehicle, and the suggestion that they are foolish or not smart enough to take all things into consideration is what ticks people off. Bottom line, if you don't like or own a 400h - what are you doing here shooting people down on 400h strings?

Something to think about for a couple of weeks...

Apologies to the moderators for the rant...

[the-headless_horseman]

First of all...does the RX qualify for the $2000 fed. tax credit? Anyone have an update on that? I remembered seeing $1000 for 2005, but if the $2000 has been extended, that's great...and the RX should count...it is a hybrid!! (regardless of price!)

As far as questions about how many miles driven...400...I'm sitting around 22.7 mpg right now but I realize that my drive to and from work is only about 7 miles each way...not much time for the engine/batteries to warm up and get efficient...it's 35-45mph speeds, is hilly, and has lights...maybe not the best conditions for optimal mileage...

However, I did drive on the highway about 50 miles and did not do 'too' well...at 75 mph, my mileage avg. dropped from 24.0 to under 23.5...on the return 25 miles, I put it in cruise at 68 mph the last 10 miles and it did jump up to 24.0 again...so, I was glad to see that...

My main concern is the mileage issue (obviously)...I do love everything else with the car...the features are great and easy to use...Lexus is number one for a reason...let's hope the mileage numbers get a LOT better with time...

Headless

[patt]

Headless,

One site to look at for information on fuel economy testing and why it may differ from real world experience is:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/!Removed!/ratings_description.shtml

Look particularly on this page:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/!Removed!/why_differ_detailed.shtml

For all cars, short trips are one of the things that reduce mileage from the test conditions.